Can't cope in Y7

I have a physical disability with some hidden aspects which affect my spatial awareness and some forms of more visual processing. For example if I'm with you I can tell you how to drive from my house to the hospital but if I'm not I would probably struggle to breakdown the middle bits.
I used a laptop/scribes and other sort of adaptations all through school. I've been able to stop using a lot of those things now because time and distance have helped me improve some of those skills and find strategies for others.
Plus, knowing how to dictate clearly and talk people through things and make sure they record them accurately is a skill that I use a lot in my work as I'm in a role where I provide information to the public constantly. Learning to take information in without notetaking means I can focus more on the person I'm helping.
Giving him tools to help him isn't making him unemployable it's giving him skills he could use in future.

This could be my DS in a year's time, he is in Yr 6 and has Asperger's Syndrome, dyspraxia and speech and language problems. However he was reading at 4c at the end of year 5 and I have been told over and over that he'll never get a statement. However, it has been clear to me that there is a lot more to his SNs than the school realise, he is brilliant at developing masking strategies and very compliant, also working within the academic range of his class, so they haven't been worried (he does get a lot of support at SA+). Basically they are doing what they need to to keep him in line with the lowest achievers in the class on the basis that he is just not very able.

So, I have gone ahead anyway and applied for a statement, I had to appeal to get the assessment but it is now underway. As part of this I have had independent speech and language / occupational therapy and Ed.Psych assessments made, and it all makes sense now. He has significant difficulties with language and processing, plus coordination problems from the dyspraxia all of which are really holding him back from achieving his potential, but his IQ is on the high side of average. He has social problems due to the Asperger's as well, I am absolutely determined he is going to have that statement (or EHC plan) - I think you ought to be considering requesting it too. Even if we don't get it we will be so much further towards understanding his needs. But, I have heard anecdotally that it's very hard to get a statement for dyslexia, you really need to post in the SNs boards for advice. My DS's SNs have turned out to be far more significant than even I realised, so there was next to no hope of the school working it out.

It also sounds as though you do not fully understand your son's particular learning difficulties and what he can and can't do, as opposed to what he is motivated enough to do or stubbornly not wanting to do. It is very common for those with Learning Difficulties to just give up, retreat into a dream world where everything is Ok and pretend it isn't happening, every day and every piece of work is a challenge, because it takes so much more effort to achieve what others achieve easily.

I don't believe for one second your son was not capable of writing more than one sentence on christenings if what you say about levels and past attainment is true, I can believe he may have forgotten what the teacher asked him to do and the suggestions that were given about how to go about it. I can believe that he then sat there with a piece of paper in front of him and did not know where to start, I can believe it was just too intimidating and he didn't have the confidence or tools to attempt it so he gave up, did the bare minimum and went to off to do something that did not make him feel so intimidated and lacking in confidence and hoped for the best. How sad.

If you and the school allow this to continue then you are right he will leave school with no qualifications and a belief that he is no good and he may well be lucky enough to fall into a job where his talents enable him to succeed as so many did in the 70s when Dyslexia was not recognised and no help available and recover his confidence but what a waste to experience all that loss of self esteem in the meantime.

All of this is by the way personal and family experience.

However there is lots of help available and you need to ask the school for a proper assessment of the support your son needs and to explain to you what his weaknesses and strengths are and how you can support him, then you need to support them in ensuring from the home end that he realises that he can do better, it just takes effort. Dyslexia is a disability but it does not mean you can't do things, it just means it takes more effort, that you need to find ways to achieve things whilst coping with your weaknesses. Often simple things, like, if working memory is poor, making sure that you get a record of what the teacher wants you to do, whether that is by writing it down, or getting them to do it for you (and all teachers should be prepared to do that if it is an identified need. ) and is sequencing is a problem sitting down and planning what you are going to do and following that plan instead of jumping in and losing sight of what you are meant to do. It is not necessarily that time consuming but armed with knowledge and a bit of thought you can support your son through this, but not, I am sorry, by being negative. None of us are perfect, it is frustrating , and I just had to take 10 mins because my DD leaves for uni in two days time and though she has a list she is still trying to sneak off to watch crap TV rather than have to make the huge effort it requires for her to organise herself. But no point shouting, and no point letting her get away with it either......

FeelingSad
I am really struggling with your posts because you come over as very negative probably because you are frustrated by the situation. Both of my DS are dyslexic; DS1 is in yr7 and DS2 Yr3.

I help them with their HW when they need it, even if its just sitting beside DS1 giving him some moral support. DS1 was doing a tough piece of English the other day and I read it out to him so the speed of his reading didn't cause a problem. I have scribed work for both of them and DS1 will sometimes dictate his answers to me, I write them down and then he copies what I have scribed.

My aim is to keep them engaged in Education and to allow them to show their potential. I help out with homework because coping with school when you are dyslexic is knackering so they are already tired when they get in.

You keep talking about him not having a scribe when he job or similar but if he becomes totally disengaged with education he won't get a job that reflects his true potential anyway.

I know its tough when you work and have more than one child but your son needs more help than he realises. Do go back to the school and push them because they are not giving him the support he needs.

Would echo Atilla, it's not a good thing he doesn't have a statement. Having a statement means that you get a proper assessment of need a a parental right to challenge if the identified need isn't being met.
There is no such thing as there being too high a level for a statement, dd got 5b SATs and has a statement she has never been anything ever than above average.
Try posting on the SN section as there will be plenty there who can advise you how to proceed.

Feelingsad

I also wondered about you feeling depressed and in need of some help too.

Dyslexia is a recognised learning disability but what is happening here is that your son is being failed by school because they are not differentiating his needs properly. His whole school career will be like this if you do not act so you need to go in and see them. Phone calls alone are not enough. They are not meeting his needs at all, he should not be getting detentions.

I presume the SENCO is aware that he is dyslexic. It may well be that practically all of his other teachers are not aware he is dyslexic and needs more support and time.

Re your comment:-
"The issue is dyslexia. And (luckily) he's way way above the low level needed for a statement".

You think that is a good thing?. I do not think you actually understand the mechanics of statements at all given this comment. Its based on need and not how "low" a level the child is. It makes me think you've been given a line throughout his whole schooling career to the effect that he would never get a statement anyway.

It is also your role here to be his advocate and to fight his corner for him because frankly no-one else will do so.

Not sure he will be allowed a Gap Year! They have to stay in education/training until 18, so he will have to do something including study one way or another - including English and Maths if not achieved at 16.

Feelingsad

You need to remember that these sorts of problems often reflect conditions that involve "developmental DELAY". That means that they will get there eventually, but it will take longer than for other children. I have seen this with my own daughter, who has now successfully graduated from a good university. What you mustn't do is assume that your child will NEVER be able to do the things required for a good job, but that these skills will come online at a later age than for his peers.

In the meantime, such children are essentially struggling with being in classes that are one or two years ahead of where they are developmentally. In order for them to cope, they need assistance from the schools, or from tutors, or from you. One of the problems with the "constructivist" style of teaching that is currently very prevalent in this country is that it is not explicit enough for children like ours; there is too much expecting that children will "discover" or "intuit" certain things (like how long a piece of homework should be, or how to research on the internet), and not enough explicit instruction and detailed modelling of what good answers should look like and how to achieve them step-by-step.

Also, in my experience a lot of the homework that is given is impractical even for the most competent children, because teachers simply don't realise it is too difficult and that parents are doing it for or with their kids. Internet research is a particular problem because so much material is at University level, not at 11 year old level! A bit of practical advice: include the phrase "Key stage 3" in quotes when your child does searches, and he will be much more likely to find material he can cope with.

Finally, it may well be beneficial for your child to take a "gap year" after GCSEs to allow his brain to catch up before he starts college/A-levels.

Finally, please don't take this amiss, but I am wondering if you are not clinically depressed, and in need of some help yourself. I speak as someone who has suffered from this myself, which is why I feel I "recognise" the possible signs in your posts. I really hope things get better for you.

You're talking about his homework. How is he managing actually in class?

Also, my DS doesn't have SEN but he still needed a lot of support with homework at the beginning of Y7 (especially in subjects he didn't much like). I didn't help him with it, but for a couple of months I did demand to see his homework before it was handed in. If it wasn't good enough or he hadn't written enough, I'd make him do it again or write more.

(There was a memorable time when he thought he could write 'Sorry - didn't really understand this' in his Maths book. He's not done that again.)

You come across as someone who wants a solution, but doesn't like anything that is being said.

What do YOU think the answer is?

Going to a library, opening a reference book on Christianity and looking up 'Christenings' (not sure what baby George has to do with it) is EXACTLY like the reading paper- you read a paragraph on Christenings and extract the right information. Or he could have asked you. Or googled it. Research doesn't just happen in ONE black and white way.

I know of dozens of young people with far more severe SEN than your son who have gone on to do fullfilling jobs- I don't quite get what you're insinuating with that question, but I suspect it isn't nice.

It won't take hours every night, it will take some time of you showing you're interested and checking his work before it is handed in, and using his homework diary to communicate to the teacher.

Also, a lot can change in a year- let him try toe to toe again, it might be what makes it all come together this time. You need a positive 'can do' attitude, not a negative 'can't, won't, not worth it' one.

Dd has just started y7 too and has needed support with her homework just as I expected her to tbh. She got 5b in her SATs (and has a statement of SEN) but the homework from secondary isn't like the homework she had in primary and until she gets used to what's needed then I expect she will need support. Speaking to her friend's parents they are all supporting their children's homework too.
I have at times written for dd, I show her how to research, I hep her cut out the waffle. I think maybe you need to resign yourself to helping with homework for the time being as well as pushing for support at school and for homework to be better differentiated to his own particular needs

You need to request an urgent appointment with the SENCO.
They need to assess him. He may well have a processing issue which means he finds it hard to understand what they want him to do for homework. If he can't read or write well enough they need to give him in school help. If he is not doing enough for him homework - because he can't then he should not be getting detentions.

What happens in the detentions? Is it just "punishment" or does it give an opportunity for attention on the work he has not completed well enough so far?

What are you prepared to do to help?

My DC at various times have had: their homework written in for them, one had reduced homework to just the "core subjects" for a while, some have been withdrawn from some lessons for extra help.
There is a set amount of time per subject for homework, and if my DC have spent that long I have been known to stop them and sign the place in their books - so the teacher knows that it is taking them excessive amounts of time to get the work done. They have had to attempt their homework, and have at times struggled - but hard work is a good skill to learn.

BTW the one who struggled the hardest got less than 4's in Reading and English SATs at 11, but he wouldn't have complained at having to write more than 1 sentence at 11 - even though Primary school had let him get away with very little writing. He could search info on the internet - it was just spelling, and handwriting that he really struggled with.

OP I am sorry you are feeling so desperate - but I do think (from what you have posted) that your son has inherited a stubborn and slightly negative attitude to hw from you. His SEN is also going to make written hw frustrating and hard for him so it is important that he gets positive and active support.

My ds is Yr6 he has very good reading levels but he hates writing so he usually types his homework and it is rarely a huge essay jus a few lines on the relevant subject - and I check what he has been given for hw and help him complete it if necessary - by asking him questions/ helping him google things etc.. With a research piece children need help - they learn by watching adults use the skills needed to find information as well as doing it themselves - all children need motivation, direction and examples when doing homework, at differing levels.

In the beginning of yr7 they will need more input but as the skills become second nature they will need less. The only way you will know how much support your ds needs is by finding some time to go through a piece of homework with him and seeing for yourself what he can and cannot do. It may not be possible for you to do this every night but is there really 1.5 hrs of research based hw every night? An hour or two at the weekend may be sufficient not even every weekend. The support of the teachers and some additional understanding that hw will be done to the best of your ds ability is obviously essential as well - he should not get detention if he is doing what he can without adult support.

Good luck.

Maybe in short term you could contact the teacher who gave the detention ( in a casual non confrontational way) and see if she is aware of the diagnosis and chat through his difficulties with her/him. He/She may have no idea of his difficulties.

I have always found with Dd it is also worth asking for a copy of the right answer or what a good answer looks like so when revision time comes round they know whats expected.

I know several dyslexics who have successful jobs and careers they just develop coping strategies in their own time.

4b is good - my son had a level 3b. And my daughter a 3a. Both went to get a C grade English Language and a C and D in Literature.

You are going to have to support him with his homework until you get out of this hole and work out between you and the school what is going on - is he able to cope in lessons? if so, why not with homework? If you help you may find it is simply one issue - the spelling of christening/prince william etc - in which case do as we do (still for our 16 year old) get him to ask you how to spell the problem words out for him so he do his google research and can move on independently.

He wrote more than one sentence to get a 4b, if that included a reader scribe - then take on that role for him. Yes you want him to be independent to go to work when he is 16+ but you don't have to leave him suddenly in the lurch today! If you do you he stands the risk of getting caught up in a web of negativity and that will do more harm for his future than good because, in my experience, negativity breeds negativity.

There seem to be some contradictions going on here. OP, you say his reading age is more of less on track for his age, he doesn't need a LSA, his dyslexia is too mild for a statement... and yet you say he couldn't read or understand a word like "christening" or "Prince George", and that his reading and writing is just too poor for y7 work in general.

My gut feeling is that either he has some other learning disabilities at play in addition to dyslexia, or his dyslexia is actually far worse than his official diagnosis.

I can tell you're feeling very defeatist about the whole situation, but clearly you need to fight for more assessments and more support. Something just doesn't seem to add up about what you're saying when it comes to his ability, or lack of.

As an aside, I have been surprised at how demanding English language GCSE is. And English GCSE is a pre-requisite for many things.

I don't think that 'most' jobs require reading, writing researching as their main skill .

I am expecting my DD1 to end up with a job that requires

• verbal skills as priority
• problem solving only within boundaries, not open ended
• writing 'standard' texts only not inventing/structuring own reports

For example

• childcare
• tour guide or similar
• hotel receptionist / management
• local government housing officer
• social worker

She is not going to be

• lawyer
• computer programmer
• researcher

As her motor skills are also v poor she is also not going to be anything thatb requires great practical skills such as motor mechanic, chef, tree surgeon.

You sound quite worried and panicky. If you can get your DS to recognise/admit he needs assistance in some things, and then work the 3 of you (you, DS and school) in partnership, you should be able to find a way through.

Thanks, teenandtween, that's really helpful. DD is not biddable - I suspect in practice she'll just choose all the maths/science/practical options she can when she gets to that time & her writing is ok to get by. But it's good to know that it's possible to move over to using a laptop later in secondary, I had thought it might be something that needed to happen earlier.

Some of this chimes with my DD (albeit she is not secondary school yet).

Her reading is (FWIW) extremely strong. Research projects - even the simplest ones - she really struggles with.

What has helped is to ban the Internet (she protested and said I was sabotaging her education - I had to be tough!). I found she was getting drawn into Wikipedia - and getting utterly lost. She doesn't find it easy to structure her thoughts and needed a much smaller pond to paddle in. What I did instead was insist on two or three reference books being procured (either what we had, or library, or pick something up from charity shop) - and told her to wring as much as she could from those. In desperate straits, I printed off articles - but I was strict on no screens. Then highlighters, sticky notes, spider diagrams - she did improve her focus and discrimination.

Takver
We adopted DD when she was 8.
So first we thought she was just 'behind' due to early experiences.
By y6 we were concerned enough to see primary school with a typed list of problems, but because she was in the middle of the class and expected to reach l4s we were fobbed off. We paid for a private EdPsych assessment which indicated a very spiked profile and helped us to understand her strengths and weaknesses.
y7-y9 I had to give continued support on homework especially bouncing it back to her to encourage/insist more to be written, and helping on structuring/ordering more open ended things. Luckily I had the time for this and DD is biddable.
End y9 I asked for her to be assessed for laptop/extra time. Came back as laptop. I am not convinced she would have been assessed without me.
End y10 I visited doctor and asked for a dyspraxia assessment, which we are now awaiting. Not sure it is dyspraxia, but I'm pretty much convinced there is something.

OP DD has improved over secondary, but has needed to be shown (repeatedly) how to go about certain tasks. I always made it clear to the teachers the level of assistance she was getting. She needs more time and assistance to learn the essay skills, but she is getting there and is predicted passes for all her GCSEs.

you don't* kick up a fuss.

So, what is it that you actually want? Him to be better at things and not need help?

That's not going to happen on its own. In secondary each teacher will only see him about 3 hours a week in the company of 29 other children. If you doing kick up a fuss and get him support in class, he will simply be judged as a mildly able, lazy boy. Which obviously isn't the case, but if you aren't prepared to help him and don't agree with him having an LSA, that's what will happen. I've never come across a parent who doesn't want to fight toothand nail and demand support for their SN child.

If he's "not literate enough for school", what do you want to do about it?