Homework, sigh...

Well reading lists that we've had tend to be suggested titles but the DC are still able to choose something else if they want (apart from set texts obviously).

Wrt changing mum approved to mum suggested, that's semantics unless they're allowed to ignore your suggestions and choose something completely different

I do find this very interesting. How do people feel about schools issuing reading lists? Is that OK?

Could I substitute mum approved for mum suggested?

Rabbit yes, as I said, I acknowledge that we inevitably have some influence over what they read and listen to simply because they are exposed to our choices in the course of family life. But both my DC also take a lot of books out of the school library, buy books with pocket-money, and listen to music that I have never heard of! And I absolutely leave them to it. I would never make them read/listen to anything.

Where theatre is concerned mine and DD's taste genuinely overlap so it's never an issue.

DS (Y8) would rather go to a football match and I'm not about to start insisting he goes to the theatre. I think he'll come to it in his own time much as he did with reading for pleasure. He came to that fairly late but now reads a lot and I think that's because he was left to read whatever he wanted (even if I sometimes despaired of his choice!)

There's approved and approved though. DD1 has given DD2 strict instructions not to talk about some of the books she has read at school. Mind you considering the debacle with the Unsuitable Book she brought home last term, I think that we don't really need to worry.

But Hak, if I was going to institute a coercion zone (and having also checked with DD1 last night she reminded me we did have what could have been a daily dr who coercion zone when she was about 5 but after the first ten minutes it became less coercion from me more enabling a nascent addiction) I wouldn't waste that on Brahms or King Soloman's mines. I'd be looking at introducing stuff they wouldn't get automatically at school.

I think there definitely is a case for widening horizons, but in a non coercive way. For the AS short story thing DD1 is the only person who has plough end her own furrow and not chosen one of the writers suggested by the teacher. This has been regarded as completely off piste and daringly envelope pushing. To me, the author she has chosen is hardly outrageous. And she herself thought she was going for a really safe choice and was amazed it was regarded as daring.

It's not the amount of time spent that bothers me though, it's the whole notion of 'approved' music or literature and that only those can be looked at in that time, however short.

Different children need different rules. All my children are totally different and change all the time so I have to keep adapting.
Xboxes should be banned during the week IMO, that hour or two could be spend doing something more productive or even just resting.
My DS1 is now on his Iphone more since I took the xbox away, what can I do take the phone? Its a never ending battle....... I just want him to do his bloody homework ahhhh

Marni - I pretty much agree with you about books and music. But there's no denying that the stuff my kids read and listen to is ultimately determined by me largely because I buy it or fund it. But I don't force any one of them to listen to a specific bit of my choice in music - Or to read my specific choice in books (Hak - neither of the girls have ever touched EBD or AF :( Luckily they both adore DWJ so that's ok). I choose the plays and shows we go to, too, in the main, because I'm not shelling out money on something I don't want to see except in exceptional circumstances. But on the other hand, if one of them makes a case for something I've not necessarily been wild about, I might change my mind.

"Well for me 'mummy-approved' books/music etc crosses that line. I'm not trying to be goady Hak, and I know it works for you but it makes me deeply uncomfortable."

Really? Even if it's only for an hour a day and only then when there isn't an hour's worth of homework to do? Of course finding your own tastes and interests is important- and there are loads of hours left in the day to do that!

Well for me 'mummy-approved' books/music etc crosses that line. I'm not trying to be goady Hak, and I know it works for you but it makes me deeply uncomfortable.

I discussed this with my Y12 daughter last night and her face was like this . Her view was that the act of exploring these things and developing your own tastes is as important as where you eventually end up, and that unless you were seriously culturally-deprived you'd come across them in the course of your normal life. She's chosen English as one of her A Levels and is exceptionally well-read, but she has chosen to read those books herself (although many of them were on our shelves already).

Where involvement in homework is concerned I think it's less clear-cut and I wouldn't class checking planners etc as 'controlling' and certainly not in the early years of secondary. It's just that I don't think it's the best approach although I accept it works for some people. I do think, though, that by the time they hit Y10/11 they have to be taking responsibility themselves, not least because the amount of work makes it almost impossible for a parent to be on top of it. Ditto Sixth Form.

hak I think it's always just beyond what each of us are doing by way of support .

rabbit I think lots of teens actually do want us to keep them on line. They know on their hearts they don't always make good choices.

How much we do depends on our own upbringing, our personalities, our DCs personalities, our situations, our culture ...

I don't understand why people even own x boxes. I really don't. It's just buying trouble (at a hefty price).

Elephants - well, I take different approaches with different kids but yes, DS needs to be more independently conscientious and hopefully he will be but right now he needs to get into good habits so being a bit more 'do your homework' with him than I am with the other two is necessary right now otherwise he won't get to college, Uni etc. He's already more diligent than he was.

DD2 discovered the 'games' option on my maths last night after ballet and we spent ages being crap at snooker. It was brilliant and also, apparently, educational! although in our case we learned v thoroughly that we can't do computer snooker. And neither can the other two. One of the kittens did a better job when she walked across the mouse pad.

Worstmistake - hmm. I wonder if buying the x box isn't the answer to your username? When we banned minecraft during the week DS was a bit grumpy but before the end of the evening turned round and said actually it was a good idea. He is, incidentally, bigger than me (I am quite wee).

Interested at what point "supportive" becomes "controlling" in people's minds.

marni I deliberately used the word disinterested to counter the deliberately derogatory language chosen by elephant . The clue was in the wink.

And of course you can choose that route. And if it works great.

Whatever works for each child and facility is a success story .

I just don't see why parents have to be insulted if they chose a different way. And all the predictions of doom....

The reality is that teen brains have poor impulse control. They find it harder to think long term. How we guide them through that period and help them develop their impulse control is up for debate.

There isn't one route to success and one to crash and burn.

This is a familiar refrain here on MN though.

But Word you can make the decision to let DC be responsible for organising and doing their own homework and taking the consequences of missing deadlines or handing in sub-standard work, and still be a supportive parent. I consciously choose to adopt that approach because I believe it's the best way for DC to learn to take responsibility for their own work. It's not because I can't be bothered.

And some of us 'disinterested' parents have also run the gauntlet of exams without mishap.

worstmistake not at all.

In loving supportive families, the children know the parents want what is best for them and trust their judgment (even when irritated).

For all their bluster most teens don't want to be fully independent. The OPs son is 13 I think. At that age they're still finding their way , however tall or noisy they are .

elephant you are using very derogatory language here - control, nag, mummies. Then predicting disaster!

The fact is that many of the supportive parents on this thread have already run the gauntlet of exams and university without their children failing spectacularly or becoming unhappy.

The reality is that there are also many parents who left their DC to it and their DC didn't do well. Their disinterest didn't serve their DC well. And their DC wish their parents had been a little firmer

worstmistake I do wonder if these very involved controlling Mothers aren't storing up trouble for GCSE, A level or university.

At some point their DCs are either going to fall down because mummy can't always be their to organise nag and control everything or they are going to get pissed of (and probably pissed) and rebel.

Or else living up to their parents and their own expectations makes them (like DDs DF) stressed and ill.

As you say I can't, physically make either DD do anything. We live in the sticks, so I can ground them very easily, but have never had to, but I can't force DD2 to pick up a German book and learn anything!

I have a DC who does it all herself since yr3, too. I take absolutely zero credit for this.

Don't your kids refuse to go to school at all if you take away Xbox etc?
Am truly amazed that things don't escalate horrendously. Violently, even.
DS is bigger than me and I'd have to take every last item to the charity shop to keep his hands off them (if their removal was supposed to be a punishment).
and then he'd refuse to go to school for the next year.

Boring addition to the thread but if your schools haven't yet signed up for Show my Homework online - try and suggest it. All teachers submit their homework online and every child & parent can access it from home, tablet etc. Its made a massive difference for all those children who won't/can't write down their homework in enough detail or time! And much faster to set as a teacher!

You're absolutely doing the right thing.

Suggestions:

He has to do 30 min work a night regardless of whether it's set or not, if not he does reading or practice papers/questions. If he knows he's working anyway, he'll be more inclined to just do the work needed.

Choose your praise wisely, really read what he's written and compliment him on an improved technique or a challenging skill he has mastered.

Use his interests to motivate him- he does well in an assessment, he can go and visit xyz. Learning and education doesn't have to be stale and boring and he should link what he does in class to the more exciting adult world.

Hak speaking of mum approved music - DD1 is singing Fear no more as one of her grade 8 exam pieces! :) but she won't let me test her on the words. Annoyingly.

I agree with the pp who said their son wanted to work and do well - but not now! (sorry I can't name check you - but you are so right!)

In theory DS has 2 hours homework a night - but tonight's maths homework has taken an hour so far and he has done approx 11/26 questions. And he will continue 'til he's finished (his choice, not mine). Which, I guess, means the other 2 preps will carry over to the weekend. Again.

In terms of getting him to actually sit down, I find treating him like a toddler works quite well. I mean telling him how long he's got to eat/watch tv and then giving countdowns.

Well, that works sometimes. Sometimes it results in shouty trauma. You never can tell with DS