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Original poster

'State schools are creating amoral children'

718 replies

BurgenSnurgen · 15/05/2014 10:16

...because state schools are under so much pressure to improve results that there's no time to teach them right from wrong.

So says Chairman of the Independent Schools Association

Bit speechless really. It's giving me the absolute RAGE.

OP posts:
hedgetrimmer · 15/05/2014 10:48

Parents should be teaching their kids right from wrong,not schools,Yes there needs to be discipline when things happen but i hate the way schools are bringing kids up these days,its getting worse and worse.

Reason 1001 to Home Educate!

Theas18 · 15/05/2014 10:44

I see so school is responsible for instilling morals into children? surely that's a parents job!

Actually PHSE is full of stuff about making the right choices in life etc so I'd say they were fulfilling that role well.

SoFishy · 15/05/2014 10:41

OMG if you could see the amount of personality-improving guff our state primary sends home and all the requirements for DS to so something vague to help his community every other minute... I could do with slightly less morality tbh.

Although being serious I do think it's good that they put a lot of effort into teaching them about caring for each other, respect, thinking of other people's feelings and so on. It's a big improvement on when I was at school. And when I am in the school without fail DC will open doors for me, pick up something I've dropped etc. and they are always polite.

And yes what does going to private school teach you exactly? That if you are (generally, scholarships aside) the financial elite you get to be creamed off and avoid the unwashed hoi polloi. How very... moral Hmm

KissesBreakingWave · 15/05/2014 10:39

Meanwhile, in the private schools...

Basically, the flagship of the private schools is actively excluding any child with actual morality - such a child would see through the repellent prospect of describing atrocity as 'necessary' and 'moral'.

Original poster
BurgenSnurgen · 15/05/2014 10:39

Yes, true, it seems to have been the way the speech is being pre-briefed. 'Amoral' comes from the Times article but didn't link because £££, it's here

Still, the implications behind 'failing to provide children with a moral compass' seem fairly clear.

If that's what he ends up saying of course

OP posts:
mummytime · 15/05/2014 10:35

Rubbish - my DCs secondary has a very high ethical standard and it is communicated very effectively to the students.

You could argue that private schools are bad at giving students a moral compass as their students do not have daily practise of interacting with those who are: of different Intelligence levels, have special needs, and of a different economic background.

I believe both schools and parents have a role in communicating morals to young people. It isn't something that is purely "taught" in a seperate lesson, it is taught through every interaction.

Bramshott · 15/05/2014 10:32

I agree that 'amoral' is a strong word, but reading the Guardian article I couldn't see any quote from Richard Walden using that phrase - just in the response from the NAHT. But then again, he hasn't even given the speech yet Hmm...

Original poster
BurgenSnurgen · 15/05/2014 10:31

Agree that Y6 is a pointless test-fest Grin

When I was young our impression of private schools was that their pupils were test-drilled constantly. Is that no longer the case?

OP posts:
motherinferior · 15/05/2014 10:29

My daughter's comprehensive is covered in posters about refusing to tolerate homophobia. I'd say that was pretty damn moral.

ouryve · 15/05/2014 10:28

I read one of the non-DM versions and it looks like a poor "trash the opposition" style advertising spiel.

IrianofWay · 15/05/2014 10:28

I prefer to teach my own children right from wrong. And IME my children are very 'moral' in that they have a strict code of ethics as to how to treat other people.

I do agree that the pressure on schools to churn out results might well lead to lack elsewhere but IMO it's parents and peers that help to develop a sense of ethics not schools.

angelos02 · 15/05/2014 10:27

Erm...isn't that the job of the parents?

pebblyshit · 15/05/2014 10:27

I think he has a point about a rounded curriculum. People are always saying what a crock Y6 is because it's all about SATS. I'm not sure how that translates in secondary though, when you are tested on a broader range of subjects.

I'd be surprised if there was a golden age when 'right and wrong' was specifically taught. Wouldn't it just come up in RE/Eng Lit/PSHE and generally existing as a community?

Original poster
BurgenSnurgen · 15/05/2014 10:26

I know what you mean Bramshott and I don't have much experience of private schools myself so have no idea really, but aren't they also under a fair amount of pressure to get their pupils into top-flight unis and so on?

It's a bloody big leap though to go from 'teachers are under pressure' to 'children are amoral'.

I think it's just extraordinary to label vast swathes of children 'amoral'. Absolutely extraordinary. Smacks of a very nasty agenda indeed IMO

OP posts:
Sparklingbrook · 15/05/2014 10:23

What a load of cobblers. In my experience.

NigellasDealer · 15/05/2014 10:23

besides with all the stories popping up daily about goings on in private schools I think he had better keep quiet about 'teaching right from wrong' know what I mean?

Bramshott · 15/05/2014 10:22

Hmm - the headline is crappy, but I sort of agree with what he's saying when he says that state schools are under so much pressure to deliver on results that they have no time to deliver those parts of education which are vital but not measurable.

NigellasDealer · 15/05/2014 10:19

what rot, my dd's school spends a lot of time on PSHE.
Besides is it not really the parents who teach right from wrong?

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