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Original poster

How to ask for more challenging work?

83 replies

dalziel1 · 23/02/2014 08:00

DS is in year 7 at an outstanding comprehensive. He says he isn't really being challenged in any of subjects like English, maths, science, MFL, geography, history, ICT etc but the ones which are streamed (or is it setted?) are better than those where he's in a mixed ability class.

The teachers do differentiate but DS rarely has to put much effort in even for the most challenging objectives.

Other parents tell me that their children are averaging three hours homework per night, whereas DS maybe does an hour per week (but he still does everything - I check).

The problem is that he's getting bored in class and it makes him feel frustrated when things get repeated over and over. Out of school, he's not bothered at all if there is no challenging work for him as it just means more time doing the things he enjoys. So, the answer is not to leave him to decide whether he fancies doing a bit of extra work at home on one of the websites for which the school has bought licences.

I know I should bring this up with the school, but my question is how do I do this without sounding a) critical that they aren't challenging him and b) like the pushy mother from hell.

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reallifegetsintheway · 05/03/2014 19:23

I am a teacher (Science not English!) but i would email the Head of English and enclose a copy of the email to your DS's teacher- drop the massive hint by implication that he/she has not replied. Explicitly state that you are not happy and you would like DS to be given extension work at every opportunity. We have had a family join my school recently and parents have asked specifically for DC to be challenged, especially in science , maths etc. It is an indy but think like a paying parent- you are not happy with the education being provided.
Hope that helps- if this doesn't work, you need to higher up- SMT.

Original poster
dalziel1 · 05/03/2014 08:51

Not sure if anyone is still reading this thread, but I have a question.

I emailed the English teacher last week voicing my concerns and asking him for help on a way forward and since then I've been awaiting his reply, which has never come. He hasn't even acknowledged my email.

However, he did speak to DS in class yesterday about one aspect of the work which should help challenge DS a little. Also, maybe its coincidence, but he's also shown the class 8 lines of original Shakespearean text, so I can't say that they've never seen a word of it now.

So, what do I do now? Take the view that he's taken my points on board, or consider that he's done just enough to make me look like an idiot if were to I contact anyone else in the school with my concerns?

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Original poster
dalziel1 · 28/02/2014 13:02

It turns out that DS does not want me to contact school as he thinks any consequent change will result in the whole class getting more challenging work.

He says that although there is extension work set, its no more difficult than the other work.
He thinks that the other children will look for who is responsible for their work getting more difficult, and, by a process of elimination of the other highly able children, they will work out it is him and blame him.

Although DS doesn't know it, I've decided to give the teacher another chance - but this time its in writing - and I have emailed him this morning about DS feeling unchallenged and how we need to get to the bottom of it as English is too important to ignore.

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Dancingdreamer · 27/02/2014 17:45

Read this discussion with interest as reminded me of my experience at school also at comp. We were unstreamed for all subjects in year 7 and until year 9 for English! I didn't become disruptive but can remember being mind-numbingly bored.

Unfortunately what can happen is that you become complacent and think you are much cleverer than you actually are! I had a real shock when I moved in 6th form and realised how far behind everyone else I was. I never really recovered from this poor start and ended up struggling badly at university simply because the groundwork that should have been done at school was just not there!

Pythonesque · 27/02/2014 17:05

I wonder what the school will do when your son starts becoming disruptive in lessons because he's getting bored? Because that's what tends to happen in the situation as you describe it. Or he stops working altogether.

Either way, I think you need to make clear to the school that you expect him to be given sufficient work that he doesn't get used to not working - speaking from personal experience!

Original poster
dalziel1 · 26/02/2014 16:30

I've already spoken to the English teacher (and maths) at parent's night about how DS feels that he could be challenged more. Ds was right there next to me, so I'm not sure what could come out now.

Maths response was that he should log onto mangahigh in his spare time. He did a bit last week, but that's not the point as he wants to be better challenged in school.

The english reponse was what i said below. viz there's a limit given the spread of abilities, it will be better next year and DS has to tell the teacher in front of the class if he wants to be challenged further.

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Original poster
dalziel1 · 26/02/2014 16:25

ditto lljkk. But remember that its my 11 year old who started this by initiating a conversation about how he's not being challenged and he wishes he would be!

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lljkk · 26/02/2014 15:45

I would try to involve my 11yo in such decisions. Not his decision alone, but his life to live.

Martorana · 26/02/2014 13:16

Can I just say that, frankly, it's not up to an 11 year old whether you talk to the school or not. You don't have to talk him round- if you are unhappy with the level of work he's getting, then something needs to be done about it. You don't even have to tell him you're doing it. But honestly, do it sooner rather than later. There needs to be some sort of plan in place for him as soon as possible.

One tiny warning, though,from a very experienced mother and aunt. When a child begs you not to talk to the teacher about something they are complaining about at home, sometimes there is more going on than meets the eye.

lainiekazan · 26/02/2014 13:06

It's a difficult one, isn't it? My ds, too, was full of complaints about English but pleaded with me practically on bended knee not to say anything to the school for fear of his card being marked.

The pupils were set for GCSE years, but prior to that ds was so frustrated with the level of discussion in the class.

I did actually have a word with Head of English on an open day, and she waffled on about the brightest bringing up the level of the weakest students. I did not identify myself, but said rather coldly that my child was not at school to perform charity work. Shock at my own daring! Normally I am the meekest of the meek.

Original poster
dalziel1 · 26/02/2014 12:43

I spoke to DS about it last night. He said the form tutor and English teacher are both off sick at the moment (there is a bug going around), so there is no point until they are both back at work.

DS said that the replacement English teacher yesterday was much better and they even saw a few lines the play(!). However, DS really doesn't want me to speak to the school because he likes the teacher. So, I will need to try to talk DS round too.

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Martorana · 25/02/2014 23:01

How did you get on?

Martorana · 25/02/2014 13:19

Form tutor is the place to start. Email outlining the issue and asking for a meeting. She can then talk to his other teachers and come to the meeting prepared.

Original poster
dalziel1 · 25/02/2014 13:17

The head of year, I suppose?? But she's an art teacher and more generally she seems to deal with behavioural and settling in difficulties. Or does that not make any difference?

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wordfactory · 25/02/2014 13:14

OP frankly I think that is terrible advice to give a young lad!

And I'd say the teacher advised that simply to pass the buck to your son. Shit thing to do.

I'd advise a meeting at school. Is there someone who has overall responsibility for your son? A tutor? Head of house? Someone who can consider your son's education in the round?

Original poster
dalziel1 · 25/02/2014 13:10

Yes, he keeps all his work at home and just packs his bag with the relevant books each night. He doesn't have a separate book for homework but the he has a homework diary (which i have to sign) and also the teacher emails him any homework (and then DS emails it back). All of which is done on the PC I am using right now (and I now the passwords so i had a good check to see if I was missing something).

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Original poster
dalziel1 · 25/02/2014 12:56

The thing with Shakespeare is that once you've got past the language, he tells really fascinating stories!

I didn't read any of his work until I was 15 and I found it hard going when I did. I can easily see why 11 -12 year olds would find it daunting. But then the question is why study it all in year 7? Why not just wait until they are a little older and pick another well-written, content appropriate play that they can actually read? Or if you really want to do Shakespeare, but you feel the children won't cope with a whole book, why not look at the plot, watch a DVD and study a couple of soliloquies??

I spoke to DH about what he remembered the teaching saying on parent's night and there was something relevant I had forgotten. He said that if DS is finding it too easy, then he should raise his hand in class and ask for more difficult work.

I'd forgotten about it because knowing DS, he'd never do that. Its not that he wouldn't like harder work, its more the implicit declarations that he's clever and that the teacher didn't get it right first time.

I remember now suggesting that perhaps DS might wait behind at the end and speak quietly with the teacher, but the teacher re-iterated that he should do it during the lesson.

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EmmaGoldmanSachs · 25/02/2014 11:11

As a sideline, back in the dim and distant past when I was at school, we didn't read / study Shakespeare until we started the O level course in 4th year. I'm quite surprised that it is the norm to study the plays at age 11.

In fact though it is a long time to think back, I'm sure most of the 1st year (yr 7 equivalent) work was english language (grammar / spelling / letter construction / writing poems to a set form etc).

EmmaGoldmanSachs · 25/02/2014 11:08

Does your ds bring home his school book with class work in it? DD's English teacher is very anti homework, & sets very little beyond completing any class work that has been missed / not finished. But I can see from a scan through her books that they are doing plenty of things in class.

Martorana · 25/02/2014 10:08

Oh, sorry- just a bit mor side tracking. My ds had to make an advertising leaflet for a production of Romeo and Juliet in Shakespeare's time for homework last year. I was a bit Hmm- but they were expected to research contemporary actors, price of tickets, what sorts of fast food were available- all sorts of stuff. It was really interesting- and challenging to get a good mark.

Martorana · 25/02/2014 10:05

For what it's worth, though (English graduate and ex teacher- although from a time before many of you were born!) if there weren't other issues, I wouldn't worry about not actually reading the text in year 7. Shakespeare is very hard to read and doing so might well put a lot of kids off for life. I can see how watching some extracts on DVD, maybe listening to a bit being read, and working on the story and the themes would make brilliant lessons. People forget how very difficult the language is, and (dare I say it?) forget how they probably felt about it at the age of 11!

But the OP had other serious concerns and should take them up urgently with the school. Sorry to sidetrack!

Phaedra11 · 25/02/2014 09:55

I can absolutely believe that a Shakespeare play was "studied" but not read.

My DS had always been in the top set for English but was put down in Year 10. I'd assumed that his SATS results hadn't been good enough to stay so didn't say anything at first but when I did, I was told by his new teacher that it had been a mistake but she'd dissuaded the Head of Department from putting him back in the top group as he was "doing so well" in that he'd already reached his target in the new group and was helping the others meet their's! As you can imagine, I wasn't impressed and DS did return to his original class!

Whilst DS was in that lower group, he was taught Romeo and Juliet without reading the text. They watched the Baz Luhrmann film, learnt a few quotes and discussed some themes. All apparently without reading in class any of the actual text. The only homework he was given was to finish off work that he had already completed in class with plenty of time to spare (which was when he alone actually read the book). They were given copies of the book that were absolutely ancient, falling apart with annotations right at the back of the book. The top set had nice modern editions with illustrations and annotations alongside the text. They read and analysed the text all the way through.

wordfactory · 25/02/2014 08:52

OP, contact school!

Don't feel bad about it. Remember that the law says quite clearly that you have responibility for your DC's education Grin. Not the school. Not the governors. You!

Explain to them exactly what's happening and how it is adversly affecting your son and his education.

Martorana · 25/02/2014 08:47

Yep- that's crap. Unless the school has a policy (some do) of minimal homework. Or unless there's loads of homework he hasn't done?

I really suggest emailing his form tutor, then arranging a meeting when she's had a chance to talk to his other teachers.

My ds is (sorry, not boasting, honest) one of the few very bright boys in his year. One thing I have done is a bit of social engineering-encouraging him to be friends with the other bright boys. They tend now to work together when it's group work, and the teacher can't help but notice that they need more! Don't know whether this might help yours?

Original poster
dalziel1 · 25/02/2014 06:52
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