To move at 11 or 13?

It is easy to assume that selectives/super selectives are full of nice eager, well behaved children swotting away morning, noon and night. But often the super bright are boundary pushers, loose canons, questioners of everything which I suspect could become tedious, and of course quickly bored. Many of these schools make an effort to broaden the individual subjects as much as possible but even they can't avoid eventually knuckling down to the requirement of the exam syllabus and the super bright often find the prescriptive requirements tedious to say the least and this does not necessary result in impeccable behaviour!

Thanks - I would definitely consider both those schools if we lived closer but not on train or bus routes there

These may be unhelpful ideas depending on where you are but Kingston Grammar and Reigate Grammar are on the up and might suit him as really go out of their way to see the individual.Check out the transport links.

These may be unhelpful ideas depending on where you are but Kingston Grammar and Reigate Grammar are on the up and might suit him as really go out of their way to see the individual.Check out the transport links.

We've not told him exactly what's wrong with his DB otherwise he'd look it up in a book and start worrying. It does affect him when he's in hospital but generally his main focus on school is learning and I wish he'd enjoy himself a bit more. He does relax at home though and act like a 3 year old. Others have said he is a serious soul but he does have a fun side they don't see.

Thanks for all the advice!

Should have been a "?".....

OP Don't answer if you don't want to but could part of his unsociability be because school fun seems a bit superficial compared to worrying about his Db?

He does sound a serious soul. But you do still have a little time to think surely!

He says he wants to go to a school where the children are well behaved. Doesn't help much. He likes being friends with girls but won't admit it so I think co-ed would be slightly preferable. He is very competitive, to the point where he doesn't want to take part in case he loses. Not so much with academic stuff though, as he's more likely to be near the top in class. He's very independent, never needed me much but is very naïve and more interested in encyclopaedia's than x factor.

There are not many private schools which are easy to get to from where we are. Apart from being boys only, RGS would suit him, but obviously not thinking he will get in so need one back up at least

Things may have changed since my DS did the entrance exam, OP, but most of his year will have taken the 11+ entrance exam at the same time - including the majority who entered at 13. Presumably the school then compares them like for like with the boys who will be their year group, whether they come the next year or 2 years After that. That's my guess, anyway.

Sorry x'ed!

I'm not doing anything urgent so I'll bore you some more...

Start with the boy - not the schools...

What is he telling you - by his behaviour rather than his words?

He's currently at a mixed school. What will suit him best next? Is he competitive? Independently minded or mummy"s little shadow? (Sorry) You've said he's in his own little world. What makes him talk?

Decide what he's like. Then look for some schools that fit him.

(And be grateful you have some choice. I'm very aware that most people do not.)

Thanks Zero. He loves science, history & geography so will be good at that in future probably. He also struggles with friends as I've noticed that he prefers to talk to adults. He just loves his teachers! I would love to send him to the most selective school possible so he could meet like minded children but worried about the pressure of the tests as he does worry.

In terms of boarding, I just wouldn't want to not see him. We've had a tough year with my younger DS being diagnosed with leukaemia, and I just want to make the most of them at the moment and spent time with them. Plus the cost of boarding is so much more

This won't be helpful exactly.... But my instinct is that if a nine year old boy is causing this much puzzlement (to his Dm and a bunch of interested onlookers) he probably does have something interesting about him. And that it might be worth considering all possible options - not just the most obvious.

I was struck by your saying he's not gifted. Bet he is! At something. Maybe he doesn't know yet.

Boarding is not "sending away" btw... Something to think about in the new year?

Summerends - maybe I was naïve in thinking he'd find more like minded friends at the generally non selective prep. His year of boys are a bit boisterous for him!

Zero - I hadn't really thought about non-selective kids v selective. I guess I need to think a bit more about what will really suit him. It's hard to get an idea of what a school is like from an open day though. I'm not so keen on boarding due to selfish reasons - I don't want to send him away, although I might change my mind by the time he's 13! Also, he's a very different child at school to at home, and really needs home time to unwind as he's very serious at school. I think he would struggle being in a school environment all the time. Also, as happygardening says, he 's getting better at sport but is never going to be a sportsman so would hate to have to do it all the time

Happy - he does seem to be very choosy over his friends, they have to be as well behaved as he is! And if there's no-one he likes, he's happy on his own. But everyone needs friends so he has to be encouraged a bit.

Beckandcall - I really have to think whether the state secondary would be the same as his junior school in terms of disruption. It would be a different town so different children as we're moving, but it could still be similar

That's good to know that about RGS putting all the new boys together. DS's tests indicated (at the moment) he is borderline for RGS standard so not pinning my hopes there. Trouble is, we don't have many other choices near by, within easy travel distance. I didn't know you could take the 11+ the defer - I thought you had to either do an 11+ paper or 13+ and choose before taking it as they are different?

Hi OP - some thoughts to add.

If your DS found the primary school disruptive and he was unable to concentrate, how would it be any different at the local non selective secondary? It'll be the same kids and more.

And many prep schools do help to prepare for the 11 + intake - by way of example - many boys from Cranmore or Barfield or Danes Hill for instance take the RGS exam at 11 and either go straight up or defer til 13 - so your HT should be able to help you with that. In my son's case he took the 11+ exam and secured his place and stayed at his prep because I didn't think he was ready for the move. He didn't then take the common entrance exam but obviously followed the same curriculum.

So you do have options for either route. The proportion of the intakes obvious varies by school, but for RGs for example, at 13 + entry the new intake of boys are all put into the same forms so all are in the same boat. ( about 3 forms worth out of 6). They then all mix together for all lessons from the fourth form. (At least they did a few years back). So i imagine other schools follow something similar. So no problem making friends and integrating.

I second the boarding thing for the quirky. Boarding schools usually have a wider range of extra curricular opportunities to choose from, the quirky are often more accepted as the other children have more time to get to know them and friendships are not just based on time spent together mainly in classrooms. The only thing I would say is that at nearly all boarding schools sport is integral to the curriculum, most children will spend at the very least four afternoons a week doing some sort of sport and usually for younger children in particular choices are limited to the main sports rugby football cricket rowing etc. This can be a source of unhappiness for the very non sporty specially those who loathe team sports.
Of course boarding is significantly more expensive than day.
I also second the second the idea of bright quirky children in selective schools, I'm convinced the reason DS2 is very happy is that not only has he found like minded friends at his super selective school, he also has learning opportunities on a scale that could not be offered in a non selective.
Having said this you need to decide whether your DS would be happy should he find himself in the middle or lower at a selective or happier at a the top of a non selective. This is probably a difficult question to answer.
The quirky probably are slower to make friends and have fewer friends, often through choice, than the gregarious conventional rugby obsessed child but I think it's quality not quantity that counts for them and again IME they are popular with other who I suspect quite like someone who's different but they are often slower to form strong friendships. He has only been there a term it's not long and is in yr 5 surely you can keep all your options open for a bit longer.

Agree with everything summerends says....

I would be reluctant to send any very clever child in my own family to a non-selective school if they could get in to a selective. I'm sure they could access equally good teaching at the non-selective but the peer influence would be different.

You've said that it's the learning that's making him happy at the moment. At a selective school everyone recognises that everyone else is there because they are good at learning. 11 year olds are quite keen to acknowledge cleverness. So it will be quite clear that doing well brings respect all through the school.

I am not saying the non-selective won't have clever children. Of course it will. But there will be other cliques who get respect for other things... I think that can be confusing for a socially insecure child. "Which gang do I want to be in?"

Ps Are you sure about boarding? Can be very rewarding for a quirky child.....

mumtogremlins in answer to your question about selective versus non selective, taking into consideration that he finds it difficult to make friends in a non selective prep it is likely that he will find a greater proportion of potential friends in the selective than the non selective. However it is also worth considering that if the selective has a very quirky intake that might accentuate similar traits in your DS (not necessarily a bad thing).
I'm not convinced that close friendships are necessary for happiness at that age particularly for boys as long as they feel integrated and can join into group activities.

There is normally a designated teacher, called something like 'director of studies' who should be able to help. Its possible they have lunch time/after school sessions for 11+ preperation. Which area of the country are you in?

I moved ds from state to private in Yr 5. He's now yr 7 and will sit CE in 2015. He is also quirky/geeky. I'd say its very difficult to judge after 1 term, in fact ds didn't settle into friendship until yr 6 and beyond and has chosen to make his friends mainly in the year group below. He also found that once his peers realised his strengths and that their marks improved when in a group with him then he found much wider acceptance, particularly since the start of year 7 when they became seniors.
So, try not to be too hasty, ask your ds how he feels about his school, my ds didn't mind the lack of 'friends' because he enjoyed the teaching and style of learning.
Also, its worth remembering that schools going through to 13 don't usually prepare for 11+, which can be quite different in style to CE.
Plus, if hes going into Year 9, he will usually be part of a fairly large intake. One school my ds is registered with starts with 2 forms at Yr 7 and expands to 5 forms in Yr 9, so they are part of a new cohort rather than 'tacked on' to an existing one.
Regarding the non selective schools, they can be great for all levels, though do ask how many of the A*/A grades are in that 90% and how they cater for able students.
One of his friends left in Yr 7 after being at the same school since reception and has struggled with state secondary (his commrnt being the kids seemed far more 'streetwise')

If he finds it hard to make friends it will be hard to go into a school in year 9 when a lot of friendships have already been formed. Much easier to make friends when the whole year group are new.

You've answered your own question . Surely you can ask to prepare for 11+ in Yr5/6 and then withdraw if things change.