ds's A Level choices drama rumbles on... help!

I remember going on a paid exchange, no children, it was a young couple doing up their house and they did this to subsidise it. So if the French for "pass me a bit of two by four and the tack hammer" had come up, I would have been fine!

I also went on some kind of county council scholarship scheme thingy, my memory is hazy but it involved canoeing down the dordogne with a very international group of people, on some kind of adventure holiday. I think school exchanges are often a bit meh because you have all your school friends around and you still have to go to school etc. so you can't sort of lose yourself in the adventure, though of course I can see why everyone does them as its the cheapest way. And I wouldn't want to have to lose myself in vacuum packed nut cutlets.

Still, back to OPs kid, employers do like both maths and modern foreign languages, and so do Unis. OTOH if he will be miserable, and/or get worse grades, then it may be wrong for him. As long as he has two good subjects in English and history he will be fine for Uni entrance.

My DD got a nice girl, with a very tolerant for a French family (she was vegetarian at the time). I think she had quite a good time, but spent far too much sitting next to the Swimming pool as her partner is a very serious swimmer.

Yeah, perhaps not the best introduction to la belle France, land of gastronomie.... Boy, he was unlucky!

Bt my French school exchange was likewise utter rubbish as I got a BOY ugh ugh ugh and we had zero in common.

I am not surprised! That would be my dc idea of hell.

Just remember to look beyond University entrance. Philosophy as a third a level will be perfectly fine as long as he is still doing English and history, wherever he applies, in my experience.

But to an employer, French would be more welcome, in my experience. S if it might also be easier for him, I think you ought to be sceptical about this advice that only native speakers can get a good grade. I'm not sure that is true.

They way to get past feeling like a dick when you speak French is (a) listen to the radio on French stations and (b) go there if you possibly can, ideally staying in a French family for a fortnight with no-one to speak English to :)

I know some schools do Philosophy and Ethics and fewer do Philosophy.
My dd is planning to take Philosophy so we chatted to students in both schools mentioned below at open evening and they were very enthusiastic about it.

My dd's school 6th form does RS: Philosophy & Ethics with Edexcel.
Course Content:
AS level Unit 1 Philosophy of Religion: The Design Argument, The
Cosmological Argument, Miracles and the Problem of Evil
Unit 2 Religion and morality, Utilitarianism, situation ethics,
issues of war and peace and sexual ethics
Unit 3 An enquiry based investigation with a choice of topic
A2 level Unit 4 Religious experience, ontological, critiques of religious
beliefs
Unit 5 Religion and morality, Deontology, natural moral law,
virtue ethics, objectivity, relativism, subjectivism, justice,
law and punishment
Unit 6 Implications of values and beliefs on religion and human
experience
Assessment
The course is assessed by examination only.

My ds's school does Philosophy with AQA
Course Content:
AS Unit 1: An Introduction to Philosophy 1
Assessment is in the form of a 90 minute written examination, with two compulsory questions on Reason and Experience and two further questions on the theme of Personhood.

• Reason and experience: What is the source of our knowledge? It is through experience or through rational thought?
• Persons: What is a person? What characteristics are required to be a person? Can non-humans be persons, for example Artificial Intelligence? What makes me the same person over time?

AS Unit 2: An Introduction to Philosophy 2
Assessment is in the form of a 90 minute written examination, with two questions to be answered on each of the following two areas of study:
• Knowledge of the external world: How do I gain knowledge of the external world? Do I ‘access’ the world directly, through my senses, or indirectly? Can I be sure that my sense-data is an accurate representation of the external world?
• Free will and determinism: Do we possess free will or are we determined to act, due to factors internal and external to us? Can I be both free and determined to act? If I am determined to act in a certain way, to what extent am I praise and blame worthy?

A2 Unit 3: Key Themes in Philosophy
Assessment is in the form of a 120 minute written examination, with two questions to be answered on each of the following two areas of study:
• Philosophy of Mind: What is the mind? What is the relation between the mind and the body? Is the mind a ‘ghostly’, immaterial soul, the brain or something else? If I can be sure that I have a mind, can I be sure that others have minds?
• Moral Philosophy: Are there moral truths and if so what is their nature? Can we deny moral truth altogether? Should moral decisions be made in terms of consequences alone, or do moral rights, duties and principles have intrinsic value independent of consequences?

A2 Unit 4: Philosophical Problems
Assessment is in the form of a 90 minute written examination, with two questions to be answered on the following area of study:
• Hume’s An Enquiry Concerning Human Understanding, with specific reference to:

1. Empiricism: the relation between impressions and ideas; the principles of association and what they are intended to explain; Hume’s fork; the nature of belief and imagination; miracles.
2. Cause and Effect: the role of custom and repetition in causation; the constant conjunction; Hume’s definition of cause; the necessary connection; probability;
3. Free will and determinism: Hume’s attempt to reconcile free will and determinism through compatibilism; what is meant by liberty and necessity.

Absolutely mummytime, I am sure it is not dry to the right person - that's just how it seems to me - so I was warning against it as an "easier" option than music or Latin - I think sometimes people think it is chatting about whether god exists (I did some philosophy at university and dd's does seem a bit dry, but she quite enjoys it!).

I did a Philosophy A'level about 15 years ago, and it wasn't dry, and was highly regarded by Universities. However the Philosophy A'level I have heard students doing recently is Philosophy and Ethics which is more like A'level religious studies than true Philosophy, but it's still reasonably well regarded. The Russell group booklet only suggests that two "facilitating" A'levels are a good idea. The do even take people with "Media Studies" which isn't quite as "noddy" as it is often portrayed.
French BTW isn't as rigorous nowadays as it was when I was at school doing my A'levels (first time).

www.trin.cam.ac.uk/index.php?pageid=604
www.ucl.ac.uk/prospective-students/undergraduate-study/application-and-entry/alevel-qualifications
As examples, Philosophy is on the list of Trinity's and UCL's approved A levels (and you don't need all three to be from those lists, even).Philosophy seesm to be considered a "hard" A level, but it is not a facilitating one (ie it is unlikely to be required for a university course). It seems to me to be very dry and technical though - I doubt it is easier to do well in than the others he is considering unless he "gets" it. Music and Latin are also on both those lists, btw.

An MFL as his third A level would open up another whole set of degrees according to the Informed Choices guide www.russellgroup.ac.uk/informed-choices/
but that only helps if he wants to do one of those degrees (MFL, European Studies etc) - and he will already have two subjects that open plenty of doors. If not, then getting high grades are most important (apart from the argument that employers prefer MFL at A level even if the degree is in something else - does anyone have a link to evidence for that, I am interested?)

I do think at some point dc have to narrow their options down - to do what they are best at and what they will enjoy. I would ask him to consider every subject he is good at - but I would not encourage him to continue a subject he doesn't like so that he will be able to apply to study more of it at degree level .

We went through the RG guide as a final check before my dd decided - just to make sure that any degree she vaguely liked the look of was still within reach (she hated French for example, so was quite happy to accept the consequences of not doing French A level - ie no more French!).

For example, the RG guide says for History degrees that History is essential and the following are useful: Economics, Eng lit, Philosophy, Politics, Sociology, Theology, RS or a modern or classical language. So he'd be fine with any of his options.

Sorry, long post!

"you are taking the UK SAT,"

US SAT, of course.

Music is an academic A level and is treated as such by Oxbridge.

I wonder sometimes if advice "bleeds" from one exam system to another.

For example: if you are taking the UK SAT, then the Spanish paper is to be avoided by anyone other than native speakers. There's a lot of people in the US who speak native-standard Spanish (the differences between the Spanish they speak and standard Spanish aren't significant for the purposes at hand) and the SAT is graded "on the curve", so an increase in the standard of the cohort will drive down the score that a particular standard will get. The SAT won't inflate, because the number of people who achieve 800 is pretty much fixed as a proportion of those taking it (there's some averaging over sittings). That's fine for the purpose of the SAT, which is not proving a particular standard, but just pulling off the top X% of the cohort.

But A Levels are criterion-referenced, not norm-referenced, and that's been true since the late 1980s. The grade available should be the same for a given standard no matter how good or bad the cohort. If people still think it's 1983 and A Levels have fixed proportions getting each grade, or that it's like the SAT, they may think that a cohort containing more native or quasi-native speakers will drive down grades a non-native speaker can get. I t shouldn't, and without evidence there's no reason to believe it does.

It's also worth pointing out that some selective universities will discount A Levels in MFL taken by people who are living in, have lived for extended periods in, or have parents who are native speakers of the language. A Level French is not intended for native speakers, and it would be farcical for a qualification designed to be taken by people studying for 6 hours a week (or whatever it is) to be benchmarked against people who have learnt it from the cradle, and that goes both ways.

I think it can be very hard for normal schools to find qualified language teachers. That said, I am worried by that advice too. It sounds like a bit of a cop-out, an excuse by the school.

Going on my experience of DS1s old school, it certainly isn't true.

But if the French teaching is dodgy where you are, OP, that's a factor it's best to be realistic about. Just, employers do love a MFL (they prefer German but I guess you can't have everything...)

but all the advice is that you are stuffed if you an ordinary student, as there are people taking it who have a French parent, or who have been intensively schooled

Who on earth is telling you that?

Interesting.

I did a degree in French and German without any foreign travel or parents .

It may be hard to score an a* in French these days unless you are very fluent, I don't know as mine were a long time ago. But I don't think it is impossible to get an A grade as a normal candidate? So a lot depends on where he is aiming.

But if you look beyond the getting into Uni thing, and at his employability, I would suggest he will get more out of a French a level than a Latin a level.

Maths is popular all round as it says you are not just good at essays but can also do analysis. But it's also true that A level can be scary if you are not a natural. Perhaps that would increase his risk and stress unnecessarily, and put his other grades at risk.

I would suggest you challenge and doublecheck that advice about not doing French. A million years ago, when I did A level, I spent one Easter holiday in France (by myself on an exchange) and it just clicked.

Titchy, that's what I meant to say, sorry if it was badly expressed. He has three things he might do as his 3rd choice and he doesn't really fancy any of those three options.

English and history- great.
Any of the other three- probably makes no difference so go for the one that gets you the best result with the least effort.

Or,
If he really doesn't care, he would get more bang for his buck doing maths and/or a MFL as his third option.

Oscar, he does have some talent in that area, that's the trouble. He's really pretty good, but not the-one-kid-to-watch in his year, if that makes sense?

He says his best bet at the Only Career He WantsTM is to do as much of it as possible, then aim for drama college.

He does not have a Plan B.

I would like to see some hint of a Plan B. Preferably also plans C to Z, actually.

But beastofburden the OP's kid DOES have two A Level subject he very clearly wants to do. It is which two of the remaining three subjects that interest him he is wondering about.

That is not the same as someone who doesn't want to do any of their three choices

This was advice to a specific kid, though, who doesn't really want to do any of his three choices of A level. And if he is not looking at three A grades, all the more reason to be careful what subjects he does.

I know some kids do retrain after their first degree. But there are many many more who just end up in non-graduate jobs. If we want to increase our kids' chances post Uni of not being in that group, one way is to guide them towards the most competitive subject choices we can. It would be different, perhaps, if the kid really liked any of the three. But we are told he doesn't.

On the more general issue, should they do what they love or what's sensible- I feel slightly passionate (if that's possible ) about this, as so many students close down their future options by choosing subjects that close doors for them. If you go outside the Russell group list posted up thread for too many of your A levels, you are going to have fewer options at Uni and when applying for jobs.

Universities like overseas students because they pay more (true overseas not EU). However the government will still pressurise them to take numbers of UK students.

Beastofburden I might agree with your position up thread except I know increasing numbers of young people who are completing University and then in their 20s totally retraining as they discover the only thing they really want to do is for example be a graphic designer.

I still encourage my DC to do what they are passionate about. Most people can't get A* at A'level never mind a great degree in something they are not really interested in.

But the proportion of overseas undergraduates is rising.

Hardly relevant for the typical humanities department, though. EU doesn't help, because EU demographics are more down-slanted than ours, and there's hardly a bull market in Chinese students coming to the UK to study history.