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Original poster

Independent middle School entry for boy from state comprehensive. Remote chance??

34 replies

Annabellina · 12/11/2013 12:46

Hi - Has anyone any experience of this situation? My ds is in Yr 8 at our local all boys comp in South London and we were pleased when he got a place there. Many of his friends went there and generally a lot more children of educated parents were in the mix. Great arts provision, his passion is music, and he is provided with some good opportunities and is well supported. School also excels in dance, drama etc. He seems to be making some progress in the subjects that they are effectively streamed in, but the school does not seem to stretch him at all and he is - as is quite normal amongst teenage boys - pretty lazy about doing just what is asked and NO MORE. He is very dyslexic, but highly articulate and imaginative and I think school just think he is doing fine, considering. I am absolutely sure he has more to offer and to discover within the academic sphere (humanities - he's never going to be brilliant at maths). The school has quite a lot of playground aggro, so much so that two of his best friends left last year (for an alternative state school). His best friend is moving abroad forever at Christmas. He can generally handle the aggro, he's small but surprisingly strong (he's a gymnast and drummer so very developed) but it definitely adds a layer of tension to his days. I have just cracked and thought he should have a shot at our local private schools which are highly selective. We deliberately didn't pursue it for year 7 on ideological grounds, plus we couldn't have afforded it. Now I'll sell a kidney or something and hurl my principles into the compost, but we've left it so late. Not sure if we can even secure the services of a tutor for the next 6 weeks - they're all booked up. However, he simply won't have covered all the curriculum that the prep school boys will have.... Is it just an absurd thought? He has mixed feelings. Likes the prospect of a electric guitar bribe but not sure about the upheaval, the going to a 'posh' school thang (both his parents were privately educated), change of friendships, MASSES OF HOMEWORK (currently gets virtually none). Likes the thought of ' a less hectic atmosphere', oh and one of them is co-ed and he likes the idea of the girls.... Any thoughts would be very gratefully received.

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Original poster
Annabellina · 24/02/2014 00:46

Yes fizzly , all of that pressure must be so debilitating for all concerned. I was very glad we opted out of it all for Year 7 entry. Horrendous. But then ds was nowhere near ready to apply himself at that time even if we'd been interested. I am fairly sure DC made some big allowances for ds since he had not had a conventional Prep school approach and they are keen to expand the pool.... I will be speaking to the head of middle school about what ds needs to do to get up to speed and I fully expect him to have a list of ds's gaps. But yes - I hope it lets others know that you don't have to get too hysterical about it all for too long, if it is the right place for your dc. Thanks for your lovely message of congratulation.

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fizzly · 23/02/2014 09:26

Amazing. Well done to your DS. I'm also quite buoyed by the fact that your DS got in at 13 with just 6 weeks of preparation - worth people noting this when you look at the neurosis and years of tutoring and prep that seems to be more and more 'normal' in south west London at least. He is obviously a smart boy with lots to offer. I hope he has a wonderful time.

WorkingItOutAsIGo · 21/02/2014 23:12

Well done to him and I wish him much happiness and success x

Original poster
Annabellina · 21/02/2014 23:07

Roseformeplease

What a lovely post! I am really happy to hear what you have to say. My ds was particularly impressed by the kindness of all the staff he has met so far and we have heard that from several sources. I am beginning to let myself be excited by the prospect!

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Roseformeplease · 21/02/2014 22:44

I used to work there (long ago) and it is an amazing school. Very diverse intake and wonderful staff. I loved working there. The boys were great fun - clever and quirky and all individuals. I have worked in other Public Schools but Dulwich really is special.

Good luck. I wish I lived close enough to send my son there.

Original poster
Annabellina · 21/02/2014 22:39

Thank you. Despite living comfortably on a very modest income indeed we are actually in the unusually lucky position of being able to afford the fees because we have an asset we can liquidate (had been thinking it would put him through University, but we'll cross that bridge...) Also we feel particularly grateful that ds has had a pretty damn good FREE education to date. Since it has become a possibility he has admitted that he very much wants to go to DC and that actually having to put up with the daily aggro and conflict at school is exhausting. So that decides us. It's been great hearing all your contributions - I feel particularly gratified that my - super-privileged first-world - problem has prompted such sympathetic and insightful responses. And suitably chastened by the horror stories of families where the different path was not chosen.

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Helpyourself · 15/02/2014 13:08

DC is very good. Many boys start in Year 9, from all sorts of schools and they have a real push to integrate them- it's a new start for everyone.
Fantastic facilities and academics and pastoral.

Taz1212 · 15/02/2014 12:54

IdRatherPlay, we very seriously looked at moving last year to a better catchment (we're in Scotland and it's catchment school or nothing) but both DS and DD have a collection of lovely friends here and other than the local high school, we are happy with our location. DD was very upset at the thought of moving.

The local school has positioned itself as a vocational school- only 7% generally pass enough Highers to go onto university and various uni courses such as medicine and veterinary medicine are shut off to students because the school doesn't offer all of the required Highers and Advanced Highers. It's also one of the schools limiting courses in S4 to 5 (you take 8 in DS' new school). All of this is fine if that is what suits your child but I was deeply unhappy at limiting my DC's choices at such an early age. DH disagreed but I put my foot down and said it was not negotiable. Grin

I'm sorry your family had such disagreements as well- it's a very upsetting fight to have!

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 12:23

Also with my cousins one had an amazing opportunity to go to top public school on a sports scholarship and her parents were dead against it...she too holds a bitter grudge against them!

IdRatherPlayHereWithAllTheMadM · 15/02/2014 12:21

Taz your post sent shivers down my spine.

You feel very strongly about your local school and that must say something about it. In my own family My DF was totally against private education and my DS was sent to local comp, which was horrendous...but it was in line with his principles a decade on and two decades on it was a decision which has destroyed our family and she very much sees her future was sacrificed due to his principles. she has never reached her potential...and is still very very bitter about it all.

you can say its the child and this that and the other, but knowing her and the school she could have gone too, yes it was a mistake that has had catastrophic fall out and they have not spoken for years.

Taz1212 · 15/02/2014 10:28

Congratulation to your son! We were in a vaguely similar position. DH and his family had massive objections to our sending DS to a private school this year. DS had been in the local state school but high school was approaching and for many reasons I was determined that he would not go to the local catchment school.

At every step, DH fought me on the decision to go private. His family were (and still are) very vocal with their objections because of their moral objections to private education. DS started at his new school in August and it is the best decision we have ever made. The difference is like night and day and even DH is completely won over! Shock His family are still quite awful about it but DS and I can handle that.

Best of luck with the decision, but if you've gone this far, I suspect deep down you think this school is probably best for your son. Grin

miss600 · 14/02/2014 17:18

Sometimes this talk about "principles" when it comes to state vs private is a red herring. The reality is that some parents (not saying you fall in this category though) hide behind "principles" to shield themselves from the guilt they feel about not being prepared to scrimp and sacrifice luxuries to pay for private education and so find it easier to criticise the "principles" of others who do so to justify their own choices.

This is real life and unfortunately there will always be inequalities: being rich or poor, having black or white skin, being male or female, disabled or able-bodied, ugly or beautiful, tall or short genes, naturally gifted or not, and most of all having competent or neglectful parents.

Private vs state education is just another factor that probably has less impact on how kids fare than most of the above.

Just do what you think is best for your individual child and your family and be honest with yourself about it.

And congratulations on his achievement!

WorkingItOutAsIGo · 14/02/2014 17:18

Huge congratulations to your DS! Obviously the school feels it is the right place for him and that he would thrive there. You started this because things weren't so good at his current school so it is worth giving this one a shot. No one can say it's right until you've tried it but you know the current one isn't!

yotty · 14/02/2014 16:46

If you don't go for it you will always wonder whether you missed an opportunity. I would go for it and tell yourself you can always change back to state system after GCSE's if you don't feel it is right.
Regarding the principle, well it's not a fair world. Your child has already benefitted from your ability to pay for gymnastics and drums. A child in poverty wouldn't have that opportunity. Similarly, I bet you have bought him books, there must be plenty of kids who can only go to the library. Choosing a private school is just taking that a step further.
I also think that having offered him the opportunity it would be really unfair on him to tell him that he can't go because of your principles.

gingerbeard · 14/02/2014 16:35

I doubt if you would have gone to so much trouble if you didn't (in your heart of hearts) know that it IS the better school for him. Congratulations to your son. You're only really looking at private education til 16 - then he could easily switch back into the state system for sixth form.

Original poster
Annabellina · 14/02/2014 15:44

Just to finish off this saga and to thank you very much your comments... have come home to discover that ds has been offered a Yr 9 place at Dulwich College. Very proud of his achievement but utterly thrown by the dilemma.... is it really the better school for him?

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WorkingItOutAsIGo · 04/02/2014 10:58

Wishing him lots of luck!

Original poster
Annabellina · 03/02/2014 23:18

Thank you very much for your supportive comments and congratulations to ds. Don't worry, we are very proud of him, (and he has been royally rewarded) that he has been able to focus sufficiently to get this far - really no mean feat for a squirmy, severe dyslexic who only really wants to be doing backflips or rocking out on his drum kit. As an exercise in increasing his study stamina it has been immensely useful. We only decided to pursue this in the middle of November so he really has not had much time to prepare. They tell us that the boys will be asked to read a passage before the interview, so presumably there follows some sort of comprehension viva. We have been reading from a selection of texts over the last few nights and discussing them. He's pretty good on current affairs, fairly articulate about his academic interests. But, yes, as you suggested WorkingItOut, getting him to big himself up over some of his achievements is proving to be the most difficult bit! I think he wants to go now, pretty unequivocally, and, if he is offered a place, that decides us. My fears and scruples will be overridden, quite properly.

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WorkingItOutAsIGo · 03/02/2014 21:22

Well done to you both! Have you helped him prepare for the interview - nothing terribly sophisticated but think about obvious questions and make sure he has answers at the top of his mind, and remembers the great things about himself that he wants to get over to them. Lots of helpful threads on here and a couple of hours preparation can really help. Remind him he must not be embarrassed to talk about what he is good at! Good luck.

ChazsBrilliantAttitude · 03/02/2014 18:29

Annabellina

You can only work within the system that exists at the moment. Yes, in an ideal world all schools would be equally good and well resourced but currently they are not. Consquently, as a parent will all do our best to navigate through the options available to us to get the best outcome for our children.

Good luck to your DS for his interview. If he gets a place its because he has earned it and whatever the result you should be proud of him for getting his head down and preparing well.

StressedandFrazzled · 03/02/2014 16:12

Go for it. Don't worry too much about your principles. Yes it is unfair, and it would be more fair if everyone had access to the best education, but you're half way there now, so you have obviously thought about it a great deal and decided to go for it anyway. My DS is also in Year 8 at london Independent. He arrived in Year 7 from a state primary, and I know he has enough foundation from that experience to understand that not all the best people come from rich privileged backgrounds. And like someone else said, some parents scrape the fees together, others are supported by grandparents or bursaries etc etc.

meditrina · 03/02/2014 15:58

Congratulations to your DS!

Unfortunately, I can't thinkof anything that would help your dilemma. You'll already know that it's bursary provision is one of the more generous, but of course the majority of pupils are full-fee (some affording it comfortably, some making sacrifices and scraping by, some supported by grandparents etc). And you could go for another look around on an ordinary day, but you probably won't see it that differently from earlier look arounds.

If private school is against your principles, then that is what you have to reconcile with the eventual decision.

Original poster
Annabellina · 03/02/2014 15:41

A little update. Ds managed to do some extra maths over Christmas (nearly killed both of us) and sat 13+ exams for Alleyns and Dulwich College. Alleyns was no-go (unsurprising - they were only taking about 10 children) but Dulwich have offered him an interview on Wednesday. We are very proud he has got this far, but thrown into even further confusion by the possibility that they may actually offer him a place. He is beginning to say that he thinks he would like to go, but I am slightly horrified at the lack of social mix and what that means for the breadth of his education. On the plus side, I think their learning support is very good. We have just had to deal with a major violent bullying issue at his current school and though he can handle it with a certain equanimity I am not sure i can. The fundamental issue of how unfair it all is bothers me tremendously. Thank you very much for your helpful comments.

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Helpyourself · 13/11/2013 19:16

It depends on the school- very very few places at Alleyns, good chance for Dulwich Emmanuel and St Dunstan's. the day will be longer, but that's not necessarily a bad thing as there's time to fit everything in, but consider travel time!

purpleroses · 13/11/2013 19:10

2 children left my DS's school last year at the end of Y8 to go to a v selective private school. I'm wondering if we should have given it a go too but really are too late now. I don't know how much preparation they did but they were medium bright - middle of the top set (a set is top third of the year) according to DS.