So we did not get DS1 into any of the Catholic Boys Secondaries, and the reason was the baptism criteria. This will also be the case for ds2

Please excuse random !

Maybe they just let off a bit of steam on the bus then.
But if I caught DS behaving like that i would be most displeased! I think he will end up somewhere in the middle: Drayton Manor or Elthorne Park High school (Drayton is supposedly quite academic and ofsted !outstanding, but they come in as second worst in my observational behaviour study!)

Not that that's op's problem, of course.

Well, Gunnersbury = (very) good. Acton High = (stupendously) bad.

And I have only lived here a year, so only just getting to know the local reputations of the schools.

I am

Fillyjonk75 - My understanding (as a non-Catholic) is that any practising Catholic would be aware of the fact they are supposed to get their child baptised within 6 months of birth. It is a requirement of the church, not just part of school admission criteria. CofE schools do not have a similar requirement.

Are you in Ealing, Mavis? I'm guessing you never encounter any of the maraudering hordes from Acton High School, or the Gunnersbury boys wouldn't have entered your consciousness...

The banding used by CVMS is designed to ensure the intake matches the cohort applying, not the population as a whole. If the applicants are skewed towards high attainers the intake will be similarly skewed. KS2 results in Kensington and Chelsea are significantly better than the national average, although not be enough on its own to explain the CVMS intake. If low performers think they won't get in and therefore don't apply that would skew things further.

The bottom band at CVMS covers the bottom 25% of applicants. If those getting priority on faith grounds happen to be towards the top of the band (e.g. because those are the more motivated parents who attend church regularly to make sure their child gets in) that will again skew the intake.

I don't know if CVMS is fiddling the banding results. Without knowing a lot more about last year's applicants it is impossible to tell.

fillyjonk I don't think that many people in the rest of the country can have any idea of the strange world of admissions to certain popular faith schools in London. I can see from the church's point of view that they are trying to find criteria to distinguish between all the many Catholics who apply, and especially to make it hard to become a "strategic" Catholic, and they obviously seek to admit 100% on those criteria.

However the result is that those with the knowledge and resources jump through whatever hoops are raised whilst those who do not find themselves in OPs position. I do not think that invoking canon law is helpful when it is practise to baptise before six months in this country even for a family like mine who did it essentially to please the grandparents and great grandparents, whereas in other countries and cultures different practises prevail, and a family may have no idea that not baptising within six months could have any implications down the line if they find themselves moving to the UK. Faith selection is after all rare in the OECD (only the UK, Estonia, Ireland and Israel) so most families coming from Catholic countries have no experience or knowledge of faith selection.

Those with the resources tend to be white and middle class so the Catholic schools around here do very poorly on measures of social deprivation and ethnicity compared with neighbouring community schools. As I said upthread we could have played it strategically and exempted ourselves from experiencing the consequences of living in a borough where there was a shortage of place in good non faith schools (as in not OFSTED failing) and now a shortage of places altogether.

I find it all very bemusing because where I come from Catholic Schools are very inclusive of a largely immigrant community.

I don't know if is will make you feel better Quint, but I regularly catch a bus that is full of boys from Gunnersbury school, and they are not a good advertisement for the ethos of discipline of the school! I observe all the kids from all of the Ealing Secondary schools when they are out so can make direct comparisons IYSWIM? A lot of the boys from Gunnersbury seem rowdy and aggressive and they are not all polite to bus drivers or passengers. Based on bus behaviour alone they are worse than some of the supposedly rough (by Ealing Standards) comps.

Quint, you have been offered a faith school, albeit not a Catholic one. I don't know how far out its non-faith catchment stretches but as its oversubscribed I'm guessing you got one of the faith places. You would also have got StRR if you'd put it higher up your list (and probably still could if you go on its waiting list now.)

I have to say, if I was as concerned as you sound like you are that I couldn't afford two sets of school fees then I'd be looking a bit closer at those state schools. I'd concur with noUggscuse that being in a brand new school with no older children could be a great option in your position. Also, a train season ticket from Putney/Barnes to Twickenham would be less than £40/month. That is MASSIVELY cheaper than school fees!

My understanding is that Catholic parents have an obligation to baptise their babies as soon after birth as possible, it certainly always used to be the case- but I know things have changed, and this may be one of thm. But it certainly used to be very unusual to have reached 6 months unbqptized.

That's bonkers. Not only do you have to be regular churchgoers but they had to be baptised by 6 months? I had no idea church schools were so strict. I mean yes, obviously they want to discourage people getting their child baptaised just as you come to choose schools but 6 months seems very tight.

pure to get things back on track are you aware that the schools adjudicator have ruled Oratory's service criteria discriminatory? www.education.gov.uk/schoolsadjudicator/decisions/database/a00218628/ada2387and2389los They ruled that it was against the admissions code which states 1.9e proscribes criteria which ?give priority to children on the basis of any practical or financial support parents may give to the school or any associated organisation, including any religious authority?. It isn't legally binding and I do not know whether someone got another shot at admissions as a result of taking the matter to the adjudicator. However if Oratory respond it doesn't look as though you could start ironing the linen to get DS2 in (and before you start to pounce Russiansonaspree OP and I share this "irony" )

It sounds though as you could not invoke an implicit cultural / ethnic bias, rather than social bias, because the church is exempt from the equality discrimination, and can invoke canon law? but there certainly seems to be an issue here which is leading to an unintentional bias in the admissions process.

There is always unfairness....

My DS is autistic and I have now lost count of the secondary SENCO's who have told me that they will "struggle to meet" DS's needs. Loosely translated this means "his presence will affect our results"....even though I know they HAVE to give him a place and his needs CAN be met in any mainstream setting with the right support. This negativity included our local popular and oversubscribed non faith secondary school who are in competition with another school locally....neither want DS....because "unless he is pushing Level 4 he won't cope" And tbh I will not send my son to any school who are only taking him because they HAVE to.

Thankfully the local catholic secondary was not off putting and stressed they could be inclusive and care for DS while meeting his needs for an education, now clearly DS is also a Catholic but this is not the criteria under which he will be admitted to secondary school.

It seems if there is a particular issue...be it faith or any other need then there is unfairness.

He may not have been offered a place but perhaps the waiting list will be fast moving. Given that it is a new school, the environment might be ideal for a child who has experienced bullying. No older students to intimidate the younger ones. Best of luck whatever school he goes to!

Also, the 33 goes all the way to Twickenham station, as noUggscuse points out. Surely you are not too far from catching that, as you talk about being close to IPS? And that would make it one bus (I know it's a moot point).

Sorry that sounded snipey. The whole admissions system, as is discussed here at great length, is a massive, headachey lottery, and if you don't get the result you want it seems very unfair. But you already have a much greater choice than most people due to ability and desire to go private, and eligability for Faith schools. There are many, many schools which will take your son.

He can catch the bus there with his free Oyster card.