Why is music never a top priority?

Mordion

I don't think it is good for most, well not up here anyway. London and the South seem to be a different ball game. However, ime there is definitely a widespread deterioration in provision for music. I know many teachers of music and regularly contribute to music forums and you only have to read a few posts on tes to see the scale of the problem.

@pugs (again - sorry) you are right about strings though - the opportunities in the local area for string players are far greater, plus the local suzuki group is very active.

@pugs At DD1's school the 6th formers doing music A level are encouraged to take ownership of some of the ensembles (eg chamber group). DD1 is only in Y10 but she has now been tasked with setting up a proper recorder ensemble because there are now several decent players in the years below who have never had the opportunity of playing in a recorder orchestra or smaller ensemble - there is a very good standard recorder orchestra in the area (well, I would say that) but I can understand why the younger kids aren't keen to join since the age profile of members is skewed towards much older adults - at 45 I'm one of the younger members although we do now have some in their 20s and 30s and hope to get more - some of them travel from very far away to play with us.

One sad thing I have noted is that DD2 is the only child from her primary to go along to the new in harmony initiatives but on the other hand her school has just started its own small orchestra so there is genuine encouragement there. When DD1 was at the school she was one of only 3 or 4 children at a decent (Grade 5+) level. None of the kids there now are at that level but some will get there soon with encouragement, I think.

@teacher Your experience sounds much like my own, and my DDs (the little one is only 9 though!). I grew up in a london borough that prided itself on music, and which kept free instrumental lessons long after most places had given that up as an impossible cause. We also had the benefit of having one of (at the time) Europe's top concert venues and I regularly played and sang there both with school and with LEA ensembles and also borough 'adult' ensembles which were open to kids good enough to join. We now live somewhere completely different, but by combining school activities (good, including a very decent SATB choir that does challenging stuff like Carmina Burana (well, I say challenging ;) ), LEA stuff, a national ensemble and the conservatoire 'scheme' DD1 is having a magnificent variety of experience. She is also, as I said, 'helping out' with the new In Harmony initiatives. DS's school also has a good choir (which he is completely uninterested in) and a variety of ensembles but as he is jazz focussed that's what he sticks to.

The only issue with national ensembles of course is that they tend to have their summer and easter events/courses at the same time. And the cost can be a real issue (DD1's last NYRO summer course was at the other end of the country to us and the rail fares for taking her there and getting her back (too young to go on her own) were eye watering.

I still maintain that the cost of instruments is a real issue - DS isn't serious about his music in the way that DD1 is, but a decent clarinet and a decent sax come to money. DD1 now needs either a good intermediate or conservatoire grade flute and that is serious spoondoolics. And then when you add in decent recorders - a good (not great) bass can come to about a grand.And that's just one of a minimum of 5 she has to have, before you even think about getting specialist models. She has been lucky to be able to inherit/appropriate some of mine, but even then.......

Having gone to an excellent comp myself that had outstanding music activities, nothing was able to compete with the county youth orchestras that I attended in my spare time. It is a tall order indeed to find a school (state or private) that is able to provide a full symphony orchestra capable of playing Brahms symphonies, a wind band capable of playing the Bernstein Symphonic Dances from West Side Story, a string orchestra capable of playing Barber's Adagio for Strings and provide an SATB choir capable of singing the Faure Requiem. These were all opportunities that were provided to me via the excellent LEA county music ensembles when I was at school.

I honestly think that with playing a minority instrument, ensembles which have a wider catchment area are the way forward. Also there is the National Youth Orchestra programme if your DD shows real promise. In my humble opinion as well private school can make it much more difficult to join other local ensembles as they tend to have extra curricular activities of their own that go on much later in the day/evening and have matches on Saturdays etc.

My experience is that music is put before sports. My son has missed so many matches and school trips because he's been involved in a musical engagement.

@morethan It's not very good for some. I'm not sure you can say it's not very good for most. The part of London I grew up in, the best school for music was the state school i went to, not the well known private schools. This is still the case. Where I live now, the schools both my older DCs go to are pretty good for music. They aren't as good as the school I went to myself, but that's a very high bar. I'm definitely criticAl of some of the aspects of music provision in my LEA but there are lots of music opportunities for young people. I know it's not the same in every area, and I know you think it isn't the same where you live, but that doesn't mean it's awful everywhere.

What is really worrying people right now is the future - there have been hard won gains in some areas due to widening opportunities, sing up, in harmony etc (none of which had much of an impact on my kids except Dd1 is now involved in 'helping' with one of the in harmony groups) - but they will all be lost if the new 'key' curriculum is seen to not include music. But this would be a problem for many private schools - they really aren't all good at music whatever you may believe.

Yoko.

Just wanted to say you are a credit to your profession and I hope things improve for you. It must be so soul destroying to battle on regardless when you know there is very little hope of a decent future in something you are so passionate about.
I know many teachers of music who are like yourself and for the parents who care, believe me you are truely appreciated. Unfortunately, you are unable to deliver what many would require and this is extremely sad for all concerned. I know that we are a different case as no school could be expected to provide the amount of music our dd experiences daily but something in school would have been good and encouraged many others to enjoy and participate in music.

Pugs.

I wish that provision was better than it is especially in state schools, but alas it isn't very good for most.
Is it possible for you to have private instrumental lessons, or do your LEA operate a music service outside school.
I know this may not be ideal but it has certainly worked for us.
Bearing in mind the problems Yoko suggests and that these are not isolated and common in many schools, it may be better to go elsewhere.
My dd does LEA choir, string ensemble and singing lessons. None of this was available at her school. Piano and string instrumental teachers are private. No particular reason for this it just worked this way. Dh teaches her saxophone and we both do Aural and theory with her. However, her teachers would do these if we were none musical. Also I think LEA music services do theory classes. Also don't forget some families are entitled to subsidized lessons and the instrumental hire scheme can be worth it in the early days, rather than having to buy. Some music shops offer tuition at reasonable prices too, they are usually local peri's earning some much needed extra money.

We have the opposite issue in dds school. They get two hours a week in class then out of class there is so much support and encouragement to do extra. Dd gets subsidised lessons and free instrument hire. She does 4 clubs a week and her the head of music would like her to do two more. It's taking over life and we've had to really support dd in being able to stick up for herself and choose a different sort of club on one of the days.

I'm Head of Music in a state secondary. I am genuinely worried about the future of music in schools. All of my extra-curricular clubs are usurped by sports/other clubs, most parents are unwilling/unable to pay for one-to-one tuition on an instrument and kids can't even attend music lessons due to controlled assessments in other subjects. I've put most of my energies into developing singing as an extra-curricular offer (fun and free -and popular due to Glee/X Factor). I'm really proud, however, of the enjoyment levels in KS3 lessons, and the depth of understanding/quality of compositional work my students demonstrate...I just wish we weren't limited to an hour per week!

Seeker.

I don't think that instrumental lessons should be free, but I do think that music lessons in the classroom should be available to all.

For the record indie schools charge more for music lessons not the actual instrumental teacher who usuallly has a set rate. The indie schools take alot of this money for building projects. What attracts teachers of music to the private sector is the security of a job.
Of course I would take a talented gymnast out of school they wouldn't be helped much in their future career as a gymnast at school. Music is different though and still only just though, part of the nc.
I have some really good music tutors for dd some teach in private schools some in state and some in none at all. They all charge about the same price and they do so irrespective of who is paying.

Any choir schools in your area OP? I've a chorister, and music is put above everything - not just the cathedral stuff but the school choir, music lessons, orchestra etc. Sport still figures fairly highly, but not ever at music activities' expense.

I have a musical child too- who benefitted hugely in Primary school from both teachers in his school and the charity Music for Schools.

But I think it's important to remember that a cash strapped school can't cater for everyone. What if you had a talented gymnast, for example. Would you be saying that you had to pull your child out of school because, shamefully, they couldn't teach her?

And the only reason private schools can cater for musicians is that their parents pay megabucks for it!

Teacher.

I find it so sad that music isn't really available to all. We are fortunate to be able to afford music lessons and they are a priority in our household. I do have to say though that we are a low income family and we can still do this.
I think more parents can afford lessons but believe they should be free. I have heard this myself at dds past school.
I have a problem with the facilities offered at state schools in comparison to private. My dh used to teach in the private sector, at some exclusive schools and he said the difference was unbelievable. Surely if parents are prepared to pay, the services should be available irrespective of which sector of education the dc belong.
The divide has the effect of giving people like us no choice but to leave state schools and seek music education elsewhere.
I do think that most LEA's cater well for music provision in terms of services out of school and anybody can access these and they aren't expensive. But participation within schools is a lottery.

I forgot to mention, before my PGCE I was a peripatetic teacher for our LEA. These music services are criminally under funded and subject to ludicrous targets and systems. I was told that it was going to be LEA policy to scrap all individual instrumental lessons for those below grade 5 standard. In 10 years of music teaching I am yet to see someone GET to grade 5 standard in a group lesson environment.

I love my job, but currently work in the independent sector, I would not return to state school music teaching at the moment, it is too uncertain. (see my previous post re:redundancies)

Many schools have open concerts that you can attend to get an idea of the standard and hiw involved the music staff are.

Must say our local secondary has plenty of concerts but the actual music staff are a little bit....can't quite put it into words!!

DS2 is very musical and sometimes feels let down by other pupils that don't want to meet every week to practise. He gets to go to a few regular outside arranged by the local Music Services - IMHO these seem to be more reliable than just the schools.

I would say that the kids who do well at sport at DD1's school are given more prominence in eg newsletters than those who are accepted into national ensembles or who win things at music festivals etc. But the musicians have several performances a year - the sports people have matches but only the parents know about them till the newsletter comes round.

In Harmony (the people running the English Sistema scheme) are also becoming more active, so that's something else that kids in state schools can plug into if they want - the problem there for the ones who are already high achievers is that the activities tend (IME so far) to be accessible to all abilities so can be a bit basic for the more advanced kids - but, in DD1's case, she is essentially acting as a tutor alongside the (paid) teacher, which is actually brilliant for her as she wants to do music as a career and getting involved at this level is good experience.

For me the biggest barrier to participation will always be the cost of decent instruments though. And that is more difficult to solve (the VAT free scheme isn't nothing but it's not enough to make an instrument affordable for many people, in my view)

DCs school has lots of sports teams, it also has 3/4 Choirs, a couple of orchestras, as well as Jazz band etc. The latest new build was the Performing Arts block. And it isn't the town's specialist music school.
Students awarded honours ties are probably 40% sport, 40% Arts (Music, Dance etc.) and 20% other (including saving someones life).

Teacher123.

Oh such music to my ears. I can't disagree with a word you say.

However, to those who can't access music within school most LEA's have music provision and it needn't be too costly. To receive an LEA lesson in school is the same price as outside. The choirs and ensembles don't cost too much. Obviously if you choose to join several it will add up, but surely this is the same for sport. Provision here isn't that good within schools that dcs wouldn't have to go outside to other clubs if they wanted several activities.

I just think that the overall provision in schools is lacking, in any of the art forms and this is a pity.
When I was at school I struggled with anything academic, music and drama were my saviours. I am not on my own and for this reason if no other participation should be encouraged not over looked.

Maybe we should start a petition.

Speaking as a music teacher in a secondary school it is a constant struggle to see music placed as any sort of equal to sport. And with comments above about how it's easier to cheer on hockey players than violin soloists just highlights this attitude. Music provision in schools is constantly being eroded, and is just not seen as a priority by many heads as anything other than a PR exercise. I have had 4 Music teacher friends threatened by redundancy in the last year with schools trying to save money by getting other teachers with 'some musical experience' to teach. I know I am biased but it is a subject where you need a specialist. Within schools it is very difficult to get ring fenced time to practice for extra curricular activities when you are competing with sport, and often musical children are sporty as well!

My advice to those looking at senior schools and concerned with the music provision is to talk to the teachers. Ask what concerts they do, how inclusive they are, how do they stretch their most able musicians outside the classroom. Swanky facilities mean almost nothing in my experience. I have worked in amazing looking departments where the attitude was that of absolute apathy, and a department that was almost condemned when the roof caved in with the most inspirational and committed head of department you could ever hope to meet. Also ask management about their attitude to music and how do they help the all rounders to achieve in every capacity.

Both my secondary age children (different schools) can and do have music activities every day of the week at lunchtime and after school. They both learn instruments at school, and also outside school and are involved in a variety of ensembles. DD1's best friend is both sporty (playing in the school netball team) and musical (although she does less than half the activities DD1 does - just choir and jazz band, plus one instrumental lesson). DS's school also prioritises drama and 'performing arts'. However I was quite annoyed that I had to have a bit of a battle with his SEN mentor to get his sessions with her scheduled against PE rather than against music or art.