A few questions about Grammar schools

Bizarrely, the non-selective schools in Kingston-upon-Thames are referred to as 'modern' on both league tables and ofsted reports. Though with the 2 superselectives taking only a very small percentage of local children, they are much more comprehensive than schools in other areas that are referred to as 'comprehensive'.

Kent is not being honest when it calls its non-selective schools Comprehensives - they aren't by definition. They are secondary moderns, but the fact that they won't use the word reminds you just how much the system of grammar v secondary modern was hated back in the 50s,60s and 70s. Grammar schools were fine until your child failed.

I went to a grammar school in Kent. It was ok - quite enjoyed it. I was in the middle there and felt neglected - clever ones got all the glory and the bottom ones got the encouragement, but perhaps that is the curse of the middle anywhere! I never felt any pressure - it was just school. I did feel like a failure though as I wasn't one of the glory ones.

My brother still lives there and he was so keen for his boys to go to a gs(my brothers went to local comp). However, he has seen both sides as his eldest child got in no problem, but younger one didn't. He ended up at local "comprehensive" and it is not good. When you compare facilities it is unbelievable. Not sure he is so keen on them now.

I disagree with their existence now though and am thoroughly relieved I live in an area where we don't have them. I just don't understand why you have to take 25% of children to a different school to teach them.

I'm lost. I was too lazy to look at the other thread just had a hazy idea that you had one small DS.

You got me Yellow. I've been lying about the age of my son and how many children I have :)

:o at your obvious delight at your gotcha moment.

I have two children. They aren't 5 now. I posted that they have been doing Kumon SINCE they were 5. I usually mention my oldest because he is the oldest and things happen to him first.

I'm curious as to why you would think that I would lie about how many kids I have and how old they are.

Fiddlesticks to the mock papers PooshTun.

I've noticed your other thread. How many DC do you have and how old are they? I'm confused. I thought you had only one aged 5 who was already being tutored?

Just to point out that Gloucestershire also has Grammars, and a border with Oxon!

WHY DO SO MANY POSTERS ASSUME THAT A TUTORED DC WILL STRUGGLE SHOULD THEY BE ACCEPTED?

It is an argument that gets presented quite regularly in threads about tutoring. My DS scored about 60% in his first mock paper. After 6 months of home tutoring he was averaging 87% to 93%. He was offered a place at a highly selective school and despite his peers being mostly prep boys, he was recently ranked in top 20% of his year in their mid year exams.

If he had some of the MNetters present as parents the kid would be at his local comp because, in these people's opinion, a kid that only scored 60% without tuition is 'obviously' not suitable for a selective education.

What a lot of people miss is that the difficulty in getting in usually bear no relation to the pressure once you are in.

For example, when I was applying to Uni my offer was BCC. The demand for places has meant that AAB offers are now typical. This does not mean anyone with less than AAB will struggle to keep up. The offer grades have merely been hiked to reflect the demand for places.

Same with 11+. One off DS's friends got in via the waiting list and at the recent mid year exam he was ranked near the bottom of the year. The parents shouldn't have placed him in such a selective school I hear you say. Well, even though he is near the bottom the kid is still predicted As for his GCSEs.

A 'struggling' kid there would be a top student elsewhere so its a bit silly labelling such kids as not being suitable for a selective education.

Well I'd say a pretty useful method would be: don't tutor. If she gets in in the ordinary course of things (bit of parental interest, encouragement and a modicum of practice for the tests) then pressure shouldn't be an issue, superselective or not (assuming no personal problems).

Don't recognise Hamione's experience at all (and I have, or have had, seven at a superselective grammar - three girls, four boys - so my experience is relatively broad).

yes belle I live in an area like that - students either get into the grammar, pay for private or go to the local comp which is just everyone who can't afford private and arn't bright enough for grammar - in general don't have very good names for themselves in the local area and have alot of disruptive students etc. I went to one as part of my teacher training and it wasn't a comp in the true sense of the word.

Yes, I would say that is the case in Kent. Our nearest comp is effectively a sec mod - tho a good one.

The closest town to us has a Girls Grammar and a Boys Grammar and a very highly regarded Comp.(smile)

Oh, and no bullying in either.

My own girls' grammar and my dds' had/has no peer pressure about looks - NaiceHamione's experience is not typical.

Good for academic kids but not nec otherwise.

As said above, you'd have to really pick your spots if you were seriously thinking about grammar schools when living in Oxfordshire. Reading's commutable from one corner, Bucks from another. There are some good schools in Oxon though.

I have one in grammar school, one in a comp. The academic standards don't compare. I'm sure that sounds horribly snobby.

Belle both my children are at grammar; I wasn't bothered if they went to grammar school, but my DH was very keen for them to go.

From being ambivalent about them going, I am a convert! Our school is one of the best in our county and both my boys are enjoying their time there. They are different characters - one academic (although he doesn't have to work particularly hard, grrr!) non sporty and one bright and exceptionally sporty.

The school fits them both and I am glad they went there rather than our local comprehensives.

We live near the Buck/Oxford border.. My elder daughter goes to an Oxfordshire comp and is very happy. It's a well managed school, obviously isn't single-sex and doesn't overburden her with homework (compared to her GS friends) so she has time for her first love - her pony.

My son will go to one of the Bucks boys' grammars in the autumn. He's a different character: very academic, slightly geekish and plays rugby to a high standard. He'll fit in perfectly.

Anyway, unless you live near somewhere like Henley (as mentioned) or Thame then it won't be an option for you.

If you're moving to Oxon you'll need to be v close to the Bucks border, eg Henley.

I think for certain children they can be good. Children who struggle socially may do better if they genuinely can't cope with the environment of a comp. That is if they can find a cluster of similar boys . If I also had a very sporty and very academic boy who was a behaviour concern in a state comp, I may consider it.

No different areas, my children are at state schools.

That is interesting NiceHamione.Are your 2 at a state school or private?
Were both Grammars in same area?

I live in Kent and went to grammar school and did my teacher training in another grammar school. IME it's great if your DD is very academic - I found school a hard working competitive atmosphere. I think it depends on your DD and the school though. I went to a very very academic grammar school and tbh found myself quite average/below average for the school. If I worked rally hard I never seemed to do any better in lessons and opinions of me from teachers than if I didn't do much.I was never in the same league as the oxbridge people and found it actually worked the opposite way as I gave up working thinking I'd never be as good as the clever ones (which was prety much everyone) no matter what I did. I felt alot how bamboozle did.

Conversely, the school I did my teacher training at was very much more a holistic school and I think I would have done much better there.