SATs levels question for year 9

That wasn't me Kez100 - the other schools are two with 85% A*- C and one with 53% (English and Maths is included in all my figures). The low attainers are all in these three schools and with none in the other two.

99% a to c isn't better that TT. TT is 5 inc english and Maths, a much more difficult measure.

The 5 A-C was the old measure from quite a few years ago now which could be created off the back of lots of vocational courses. They still quote it but it's much less transparent that the one inc E and M

There are low attainers in three of the other schools (including the school my DC go to) but I'm intrigued as to why there are none at all in two schools that don't supposedly select their intake at all. Is a high A*- C score putting parents off from applying?

The telegraph table is incomplete because it relies on self report by schools. It is published when the GCSE results come out rather the following jan when the official tables come out. If your school doesn't let them know their results then they aren't included.

She did say the local academy has 38% so, presumably, that is where they go. The set up doesn't sound like non selective comprehensives to me, but it does sound exceeding common (much like local Grammar and the rest go to the comprehensive, which is more like a secondary modern because of the intake it is effectively left with)

Sorry, I can spell 'comprehensive'. But Webwiz's point is interesting. Where are the 'low achievers' going in her town? Presumably there must be some schools which are skewed significantly towards low achievers, unless, like Lake Wobegon, everyone is above average. And how do the schools manage their intakes?

Webwiz earlier on the thread explains that the Telegraph table I looked at isn't complete, as it's compiled of results on the day they come out, and the final tables presumably include GCSEs taken earlier and the results of appeals etc.

I haven't a clue about any of it, and think it's fascinating how different tables show different headline results. Ann, if your children's school is achieving 99% 5 A-C passes (is that meant to be A-C?), then surely it, and not Thomas Telford, woudl be claiming the distinction of the best performing comprehensive. Unless it is not A, which might make a difference....

What I do think is interesting, too, is what 'comperehensive' can cover.

It's good to hear that your local comp is doing so well! We are more than happy with ours too - last years results were 99% got 5 gcses and 85% incl Maths and English. Again, non selective as admissions are based on distance and siblings etc. Reasonable catchment although the local private schools are over subscribed and a lot of wealthier bright children sent privately.

Singersgirl ds1's comp which doesn't have any kind of selective intake (unlike some mentioned here) claimed 99% 5 GCSE A-C last year and 91% A-C including English and Maths! Are they lying to us? Or is it possible that the Telegraph results are not complete? I know the school is astonishingly high-achieving given that they have a very mixed intake - lots of middle-class families who probably have the means to go private if necessary and lots of pushing and encouragement, but also lots of less fortunate families where the children face significant challenges.

So that's a high achieving comp that isn't a comp then.

I'm intrigued as to how two schools in my town have no selection criteria other than a few aptitude places and still manage to have no low attainers at all.

Thomas Telford is not a comprehensive school. It sets it's own admissions criteria. You have to live in particular post codes, then apply, enclosing your child's year 5 report. Then your child has to sit a NVR test. Places are then allocated.......!

So true Kez100 - I think the concept of the lower attainer seems to have escaped him as well.

It is useful to know though - Gove probably uses these as examples of what he expects from his average comprehensive school! (Bearing in mind he doesn't seem to understand the word average, he probably doesn't understand comprehensive either!)

I've just looked at the DfE site with the data about school pupils and only 2 children in the 2011 cohort at Thomas Telford entered below level 4, with 67% classed as higher attainers - there were only 2 statemented pupils and only 1 child for whom English is an additional language.

So it's not really a very comprehensive comprehensive school.

School league tables cover up a multitude of things...

I've no idea why I'm googling all this stuff, actually - I should go and pay attention to my real live children to improve their life chances....

That may be right, and might explain it. I did look at Thomas Telford, but their admission criteria are very vague too - all ability bands are represented but the headmaster decides who to take. Presumably if they get 98% they can't take many children from Band I, or whatever the lowest is.

I think the Telegraph table just contains data reported by the schools on GCSE results day so it isn't complete. Isn't Thomas Telford in Shropshire the highest performing comprehensive with 98% A*-C?

I depends how you define a "comprehensive" though doesn't it - there is a state boarding school in my town that calls itself comprehensive but somehow manages to have no "lower ability" children at all and so achieves 93% A*-C. I think the school has such an academic reputation that parents with lower ability DCs obviously just decide not to apply.

I was so intrigued by this that I've just googled last year's school league tables and according to The Telegraph table there isn't a single comprehensive school that gets 90% A* - C passes - the highest is just over 88% (which is still pretty amazing - it is a Jewish school so selects by motivation of family) Some of the next highest eg St Clement Danes select a certain percentage of pupils on musical and academic aptitude tests and apply a sibling policy; I guess the sibling policy means that once one child in a family is in on an academic place, their younger siblings get in under sibling criteria rather than needing an academic place, which will free up another academic place....

So where do all the other children go? The ones for whom A*-C is just not achievable?

Hi seeker. Yes the 90% is good isn't it? Dd's school has been graded as outstanding by Ofsted the last time they visited and i think the time before that it was rated as good. But i am sure the local catholic school is on 91%. There are a few privates around here and two are on 100% and one is 98%. The rest are about the same as dd's school. And i am a parent that would have liked dd to go to a private school but am not worried about it now.

Hi shootingstarz. Thank you for your kind words. Dd wasn't allowed to take a level 6 paper at her school. That is why she kept doing the level 5a. Her headteacher at the time tried to get it for her but was told it was defunkt. When dd entered high school her targets were 6a and have improved since then so school must be doing something right! I wouldn't say they challenge them though. Dd is in top sets and has the head of those departments for the teachers but all the children within those sets do the same work even if they are on lower levels iyswim. In dd's German class she is on the highest level. The teacher is giving her level 8 for her assessments even though 7 is the highest but others are only scraping a 5c. But they are all doing the same stuff. I suppose it may change as she enters year 9 as some of those children wouldn't have chosen German as an option. As for taking gcse's early. Yes she and another girl (there may be others i don't know) took their maths in year 7 but to be honest they didn't even get much of a "well done" by the school or anything and dd likes praise. So after doing that one she said she's not going to bother doing any more exams early!! :(

Best wishes.

I didn't realise the there were comprehensive schools that got 90% A*-C including English and Maths-is that actually possible?

And I speak as a massive supporter of comprehensive schools!

Hi shootingstarz.

Dd's work is getting marked with A and with nc levels. So looking at her German book it says A and the teacher has written "keep this for your gsce!!" and also marked it as 8. Dd has only taken maths gcse so far and so has another girl. Gcse work and options start in ks4 at dd's school (which is year 9,says on report) so from septepmber.

Hello everyone.

Kez100. Dd went to a primary school on a council est with high proportion of free meals etc (including dd). She is just very able and finds academic work easy. Wasn't really pushed as i don't think teachers like children to be "different". Sats were level 5a from year 4 and were the best scores the school had ever had. Maths teacher proably the best. She was giving dd year 7 work as extra homework but most of the time i was told to look on the internet. Thanks.

noblegiraffe. 90% is good and it has got better over the years because of a new head. I was told the last head wasn't that great and a bit "soft" but the new woman in charge seems quite strict to me and it is obviously is working. Unless the children are just different? I don't know really. The ones at the school at the moment seem quite ok and i don't hear much by the way of "incidents" but the school admitted when i looked around that a few years back there was a lot of bullying and "incidents". I understand what you are saying about the nc levels. Yes i think it is because a level has to be given. The school marks homework and assessments with nc levels and also gcse marks. So the last German mark was 8 (yes i know - you can't get an 8 but the school says it is called exceptional performance) and also A. History was the same. But when it comes to gcse's (she is only 12 still - youngest in her year) she might not even get any A's. All depends on they day doesn't it? Good luck and best wishes everyone to you and your children.

shootingstaz if your DD is working at a level 8 in year 9 then if she carries on working she should get an A* in year 11.

There is no point in having a NC level if you have already taken the GCSE .