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Original poster

Independant and State grammar Seconday education

84 replies

MauAnt · 09/12/2011 08:50

Hi all

My son DD who has a conditional place at Eton in 2013 is going to a feeder prep boarding school in Oxford to complete year 7 and 8. We are by no means rich as we rely on scholarships and bursaries which thankfully he has for about 80% of the fees.

I have five children all who went or are in state primary schools and dd above is the 2nd, my daughter the older one who is 13 is in a state grammar school in Reading and her younger sister is in year 6 aged 10 is sitting exams for the same state grammar school as her sister and for some independent schools in Oxford. As she is academic we are hoping for a bursary/scholarship from the independent sector if she goes to one.

The question I ask myself is whether my other children aged 8 and 4 and the 13 year old in grammar school will feel resentment for not being privately educated as I intend to focus on only the state grammar schools in the future unless there are exceptional circumstances. I had to move my son to an independent school in Year 5 despite scraping 1/3 of the fees as he is very academic, a sportsman and needed that extra challenge. It transformed him from the boy who was bored at school and did not want to go to a very enthusiastic boy and one who eventually passed the initial Eton exam. My year 6 daughter is almost similar, aspires to be a writer has some of her work published in the Young writers books and I worry that in the state sector she will be suppressed. She is getting ready for the ISEB common entrance examinations in January and I am shocked at how little science is taught in state primary schools compared to independent schools which places her at a disadvantage.

I love all my children equally and do not want any of them to feel less favoured, I remind my daughter in Kendrick Reading about that. Just that these two children are different in their own way. Having said that if none of our bursary applications are successful and my daughter passes to Kendrick Reading (I am not taking it for granted) I will gladly jump at it. Also common sense tells me that I need to meet the 20% school fees for my son and not be looking for any additional fee commitments for my daughter. Help this confused lady who is trying to do the right thing but might be getting it all wrong

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MrsJAlfredPrufrock · 09/12/2011 15:07

Conditional upon doing what with CE though? Reaching "the required standard"?

www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/4793334/Time-for-some-common-sense.html

Yellowstone · 09/12/2011 15:06

Your kids are really young still though, they might assert themselves later on :)

MrsJAlfredPrufrock · 09/12/2011 15:04

Perhaps you could convert your back room to a fencing salle for your state school brood, to mitigate against festering resentment and class envy?

Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 15:03

He needs to pass the common entrance and I think is equal to the task. Conservative family no floppish hairstyles or airs in our lives and the kids thankfully agree with it. We leave that for the vain

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MrsJAlfredPrufrock · 09/12/2011 14:59

What are the conditions that make up the conditional offer? Have you thought a bit about what might happen to him if he fails at the final hurdle, when he's already adopted a foppish hairstyle and known as the boy destined for Eton? Is it not an awful lot of pressure?

Yellowstone · 09/12/2011 14:58

Frankly some people don't have the spare cash to do either lush holidays or tutoring, its not a case of either/ or.

I haven't needed tutoring for any of mine though, no need so no point.

Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 14:57

Thanks Colleger one of the few positive remarks I have seen on this thread.

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Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 14:54

When they means test you, they take into account how much is paid out for siblings as 'shown in your bank statement' and how much you earn. 11+ tutoring, kumon, GCSE and other things that parents embark on are sometimes necessary and not quite classed as private tutoring which currently in the UK costs £39 an hour. Some parents of course do not see this as so as they would rather spend their money on expensive holidays and not on their children.

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MrsJAlfredPrufrock · 09/12/2011 14:54

MauAnt -So you are already paying perhaps £4K per annum, plus uniform and travel for your little boy? Before he even gets to Eton?

Colleger · 09/12/2011 14:52

There is no way I'd turn down the 80% just so all your kids can have the same educational experience. Your other children are in top establishments or you are seeking scholarships elsewhere. Do not penalise your son, all he has done is achieve and he should be rewarded for this. I'm sure if your eldest wanted to leave to get a bursary elsewhere then that route could be pursued.

There will be benefits for the whole family if your child goes to Eton. Some rich Etonian boyfriends for your girls! Wink But seriously, let your girls be exposed to such an environment and it may drive them on to get into a similar school on a scholarship.

Yellowstone · 09/12/2011 14:52

Mau you really don't need to tutor bright kids who have the luxury of a very good school. Eats unnecessarily into free time and wastes a shedload of money. Of course if they've only passed the 11+ because of extra tutoring then I see that they might struggle to keep up.

Yellowstone · 09/12/2011 14:47

I didn't think these 80% scholarships were aimed at those who can afford private tutoring at every juncture for five kids?

Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 14:45

He is receiving an 80% one. And is strong willed and very forward unlike me

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MrsJAlfredPrufrock · 09/12/2011 14:39

Gosh. Eton really is embracing this meritocracy thing. Is your son very like you, OP?

As a matter of interest, is he receiving a full fees scholarship for the Oxford prep school?

Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 14:29

so you can relate with my reluctance to deny my son a place in order to please his siblings or appear fair. And what guarantee do I have that I will have pleased them .

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swanker · 09/12/2011 14:27

I do not judge people, other than on their words and actions; you judged my children in your post of 11:36.

I came to this thread because I was denied the opportunity of a place in a top school, and it has had a lasting effect on me.

Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 14:09

Good for you Swanker it worked for you and does not mean that you are less happy or successful than someone who went to a grammar or an indie. I would not judge you based on that or the number of children you have/choose to have or anything else because as I said life is funny the person you judge may very well be doing better than you. So live and let live. I am comfortable with what I term my famous five and would not have it any other way. So anyone contributing to the thread should not snigger at the number of children.

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swanker · 09/12/2011 14:00

I'm sorry, but your post of 13:56 is completely unintelligible to me comp educated as i am.

swanker · 09/12/2011 13:58

Well- that won't happen will it, because he's morally superior Hmm

Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 13:56

I am not judging anyones kids as being immoral. Lets be adults here. I am simply saying that reference to the number of children I have in this thread is inappropriate as I could very well turn out a larger 5 than a fewer 2 or 1 as an example. Equally it could be the other way round. In life do not judge other people because they do not fit into your idea of what life should be e.g number of children as you may not even be doing a better job of raising yours than they are their lorry load. Different strokes for different folks

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Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 13:49

Yellowstone. I would always opt for things like 11+ GCSE, A level Tuition whether the child is in a state or grammar school for reasons which should be obvious to every parent. My son who moved into an indie after year 4 was still sent for 11+ tuition to learn the technique so it is not about state or private school.

The independent days schools in Oxford are equally high ranking and if sibling resentment is in the pipeline for Eton, it will be if he goes to one of them. He actually got into one of them. The only way to make everyone happy is to have refused he go to any of them but rather go to the local state school or grammar school in order to be fair.

What if he grows up resenting his parents and the siblings that he was denied the opportunity because of?

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swanker · 09/12/2011 13:49

Gosh- i'd love to know the basis on which you're judging your children's morals over those of my children?

I'm staggered anyone could make such a statement without having met them.

I agree you're hardly looking for advice here are you?

Makkapakkaakkawakka · 09/12/2011 13:42

In theory I feel strongly that one makes choices based on the individual child and that whether that is state or private should not come into it. Mine are currently in state and we are likely to pull DD out at the end of yr2 because the school isn't meeting her needs and will leave the others there. At 11 DS1 will probably go to one of the top state comprehensives in the country because it is an amazing school where I will think he will thrive. It's unlikely DD will go there and DS2 is too young for us to make that decision. However, I feel comfortable doing what I have mentioned because ultimately both schools are excellent, have a similar mix of children, offer great extra curricular and I don't feel that one will be disadvantaged over the other. Crucially, we are not making that decision on economic grounds, we could put all 3 throgh private from 4 - 18 with no problem.

However, I think that your situation is different and the experiences your children will get are so extreme that it is not something I would do. If you are happy with the grammar for the girls I would send your DS to one of the good independent day schools in Oxford where he will have every opportunity and the gulf between him and his sisters will be much smaller. I don't know Oxford schools but I suspect that the difference between a day school and a grammar are small and is unlikely to cause friction.

I can see that the opportunity to have a child at Eton is amazing for you but despite that I just think that for family parity it may well be worth reconsidering as you have some great options in your area.

Yellowstone · 09/12/2011 13:40

Mau you're on a wind up I think. You've just said 'it is not just any state grammar it is Kendrick' yet it's teaching is evidently so poor that you're going to buy in extra GCSE tuition Confused.

The eldest seven of my eight children are all at the same school and I hope that the eighth will follow. I certainly wouldn't have done what you're proposing: AMumIn Scotland is absolutely right, it's inherently unfair and not a distiction based purely on aptitude or merit, which for your younger ones can't yet be known.

Original poster
MauAnt · 09/12/2011 13:24

On a different note when do you enrol children for private GCSE tuition. Is it in year 10 or now. My daughter is in year 9

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