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My 14 year old daughter has changed from confident to reclusive in Y8/9

39 replies

bilibob · 03/11/2011 13:38

I am at my wits end regarding subtle bullying in the form of total exclusion of my daughter. Lots of friends through primary, unpleasantness through Y7 & 8 and now in Y9 I predict she will soon start refusing to go to school. If being excluded completely from all social plans is bullying then that's what this is. Pairing up in lessons is excruciating - why do teachers persist in this? Last term she was at another girl's house who logged onto a vile website and proceeded to "interact" with a series of men via webcam. My daughter hid under the table in complete horror and told me the minute I picked her up. I thought about it for a week and then contacted the police for advice.The subsequent police interest resluted in my daughter becoming even more of a pariah. They move into her place on the school bus and laugh when she has nowhere to sit.... it's never ending.

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3littlefrogs · 08/11/2011 09:12

I think it depends entirely on the individual school, the individual HT.

I took my ds out of a state school with a really bad racist bullying/general bullying problem. HT insisted there was no bullying at the school. All staff colluded.

I sent him to a prep school where there was zero tolerance of any kind of bullying.

I don't think the fact that the school is private or state has anything to do with it.

However, if you are able to pay it is much easier to vote with your feet.

If you can't pay, your child may have no escape route.

I had to make huge sacrifices to get my seriously distressed child out of the school he was in, and I will always resent the fact that I had to do that.

As the op is already able to pay, she is in a good place to solve the problem.

pastoralacademia · 07/11/2011 09:51

bilibob, I don't want your OP to be diverted to a private/state debate but as a teacher in the state system do you think the private sector deals with bullying softly? I only have experience with the private sector, my DCs have only been in a prep school so far. I have friends with DCs in a comp but they don't seem to have any problems. Yet I hear a lot of unresolved bullying problems in the private system....I don't want to jump to conclusions here from my limited data

mumslife · 06/11/2011 21:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

marriedinwhite · 06/11/2011 19:14

I don't understand why any parent persists in continuing to send an unhappy child into an environment where they are bullied.

I would say you phone your daughter is sick tomorrow and quote the reason as bullying related stress. You set out your concerns in writing and request an action plan to deal with it within five working days. In the meantime, ring around a few schools and identify some options so you go in forearmed.

If you are in SW London pm me; we moved dd at the end of Y8 because of behavioural issues and the transformation has been breathtaking.

SophiaMurdoch · 06/11/2011 12:04

Move her to a different school now or homeschool her until a place becomes avaliable.

I went to an independent all girls school since the age of seven and I was bullied about being a lesbian in year 9 even though I wasn't.My parents knew I wasn't happy but thought I should just ignore them as the school was academic,but it wasn't that simple.Staying there until i finally left in year 11, did nothing but destory my self esteem.I couldn't cope and was very depressed.Which manifested into self harming and this did have an impact on my gcse grades which were'nt terrible per se (4A's 7 B's 1C) but not what was my true potential as I was predicted all A*'s and A's. As a result I thought for a long time that I wan't worth anything and this did impact my thinking for a while.

mumslife · 06/11/2011 11:14

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

bigscarymum · 05/11/2011 21:25

We moved DD at the start of year 10 for similar reasons. Best thing we ever did. No problems fitting in with GCSEs or socially. We have our lovely girl back SmileSmile

girliefriend · 05/11/2011 21:18

What does your dd want to do? Would she like to move?

Has she not got any friends? I found the best way to get the bullies to leave you alone is to find a mate and to stick together, its when you are on your own your f*ed! Bitchiness at that age is terrible at any school and I imagine at an all girls private school it will go to a whole new level Sad

Talk to some of the local schools and find out if they could take her so at least you know if it is an option, take your dd round to have a look and keep talking to her, its when she stops telling you stuff that you need to be really worried.

Loshad · 05/11/2011 21:07

Move. We moved one of our kids at the end of y9 from one private school to another. Not bullying but the situation had become untenable.
Yes there is always the worry that why do they have spaces, but tbh most private schools will make a space if you make a good case. I would suggest co-ed for your daughter.
It has been the making of my son - we moved him to an allegedly much less prestigious, much smaller school. He likes being known and recognised and has really flourished - he was failing academically, behaviourally and in all sorts of ways. Got 6*, 2As and a B at GCSE, and appears to be making a success of y12. The school allocated a couple of lads to look after him and i won't deny the first couple of weeks were hard for him but he knew how awful it had been at his previous school so was prepared to try and make a go of it.

pastoralacademia · 05/11/2011 15:43

I am so sorry your dd is going through all this. IMHO Co-ed schools are far better socially than single sex schools. The girls tone down the boys' testesterone and the boys don't let the girls get a way with the B.....ness.

MigratingCoconuts · 05/11/2011 14:42

could the school with 'problems' do, if you also employed a tutor??

Tortu · 05/11/2011 14:39

Move.

Seriously, it sounds so destructive. Do the schools which have 'problems' have as many problems as your daughter's school? In an all-girls bitchy school, if you don't absolutely fit in, you absolutely destroy yourself and the evidence of eating disorders etc. suggests that this is a big problem. In my experience it only gets worse throughout GCSE.

I now work in a 'problem school' where, yeah, it is low achieving, majority of students ethnic minority and EAL etc. One of the problems we don't have is eating disorders or serious female friendship fights.

mummytime · 05/11/2011 08:36

You can appeal at anytime, ask the admissions gurus (Admissions etc.). If you have a record of the bullying, and have taken any of her anxiety to the GP it will help in your appeal. Schools which are fulll will not say they can take an extra pupil, but may well have one after appeal, and normally do very well by them.
I would be very careful about which school you try for, as a girl from DD1's primary has just moved to her senior school because of bullying, this girl was previously at a mixed one (which I had predicted she would be bullied at, but her mother wasn't listening to anyone).
Not all mixed schools are better. In fact friends of mine moved their daughter from a mixed school to an all girls one, which helped with her issues.

But a school which is not top of the league tables, but does well by its small top set might be suitable for your daughter, so do look carefully at them.

I also know of children move into all kinds of "full" schools outside the normal admissions raounds.

MigratingCoconuts · 05/11/2011 08:13

God I feel you you, its what we want to do, isn't it? Give our children the very best.

I agree with everyone in that I think this is fairly typical of all girls together and have also heard stories about self harming and anorexia. What a hell!

there must be options better than this current school? Independant Co-ed ones? Maybe if you post a new thread asking for advice about all the different schools in the area, you may find a solution you'd not considered from other's experiences.

I agree that your DD's confidence will be shot to pieces and starting somewhere new would be hard....but the relief for her of getting away from this school would help enormously.

3littlefrogs · 04/11/2011 23:19

I thnk you have been brainwashed into thinking you have no options.

If you are paying you will be able to find a nice school that will take her.

The school she is in now is appalling, by anyone's standards.

I took my ds out of his (primary) school halfway through year 4. He was offered a place at three independant schools within a week.

I have 4 friends who took their dc out of school at varying stages of secondary school and got them into good private schools instantly. Schools are happy to take your money. You are the customer. Don't accept anything less than the best.

bilibob · 04/11/2011 23:06

Silverstreet hits the nail on the head.. Queen Bee scenario big time, except there are lots of them!! Moving her is a problem though. For 2 years we have discussed it - the local schools are full to bursting and the ones that aren't have big problems. A nice normal sec school would be fantastic but getting her in now when all the appeals have almost finished is very hard. I worry too that her confidence is now so low that she would go into a serious decline in an unfamiliar place. There are 5 year groups and approx 26 in each class in this school so not small. The classes were jumbled up last year and things are just as bad now because the way they were mixed just beggars belief (considering last years trouble). I've been horrified at the number of girls in her year who had self harming / eating issues last year in Y8. At least my DD has a good home life and is able to offload on me instead. The result of that though is I'm an anxious wreck. This is the first time I have ever posted anything anywhere and I did it because I just needed to know whether other people genuinely have had a similar problem. It does seem to be a thread that runs through girls schools - also the material aspect of those who have more money, makes everything worse for the struggling ones!! There is a whole lot of really bad promiscuity going on at a young age too - I imagine it happens in most schools now - without sounding like a prude, mums who've had cosmetic surgery and Queen Bees who end up in the papers on footballers yachts etc etc. Think I'd better stop now before I go on....Sending her all those years ago in reception seemed like such a good idea.

OP posts:
balia · 04/11/2011 22:35

I'm biased - have had appalling private school experiences. Why do you send her there? How much misery can she be expected to cope with? Move her to a nice, normal secondary school. There are more of them about than people think.

Silverstreet · 04/11/2011 22:30

OP I have been there too, you could be me. If you do not conform to the queen bee groups in a girls school you are at best on the edge, if you speak out you are dead. We moved to v good mixed comp and was best decision ever, DD now 100% confident, different child. You cannot change the school's attitude either from what you describe. Please investigate moving her to a large intake mixed school. Boys break this sort of behaviour up and there are far more different types in a larger school so she should find more like minded friends there. Happy to talk by PM too more specifically about moving, notice, admissions if you both reach that decision.

livinginlondon2 · 04/11/2011 19:43

It sounds like she is having a horrible time, and it sounds all to familiar. My daughter and many of her friends seem to have gone through much the same sort of things in year eight and nine of all girls schools. My gut reaction is to say move her now, howevr I think that depends on what the other options are. In our case we didn't move our dd after much discussion because we felt that she would not necessarily interview well as her confidence had taken such a bashing ,and we were worried that would choose a school in a hurry because it had a place available and not necessarily because it was thee right school. We also felt it would thin be difficult to move her again for sixth form.

In the end we left her where she was, but, year ten bought with it so many changes that the bullying behaviour has drifted into the background. In the first instance the forms were all switched around, breaking up the groups that had formed in the first three years. This helped. However, the more obvious thing was that thanks to gcse option, the girls all move classes all the time throughout the day. Up til now she has had the same girls for all classes except magus, the only class that was setted. Now every class is different, and the girls that had made her life a misery just are not there all the time, and are themselves distributed across all the classes and so are less of a obvious group.

This is a long winded way of saying that I would council moving, and like everyone else I would strongly consider a mixed school; however if that isn't possible I would look at her own school and see whether the structure of her day will change dramatically next year.

In our case I thinker should have moved our daughter, but she is much, much happier this year, so lthough we havent done the right thing, it has worked out.

In our case the school also did little to help, despite the fact that a large number of girls were affected eby the generally nasty attitude in the class.

kalidasa · 04/11/2011 19:26

I think a mixed school is a good idea if you move her. I was ostracised in a fairly low-level but persistent way through most of secondary school and a move to mixed-sex at sixth form was a huge relief. I made both male and female friends at that point, but I admit that it took me many years to feel comfortable in a group of girls/women (rather than just one-on-one) and in fact - perhaps not coincidentally - I chose a profession which is quite male dominated and doesn't include too much group/team work. That's a long-winded way of saying that this kind of thing on an ongoing basis (for more than just, say, one school year) can have a long term effect. If the school isn't big enough for her to find a different 'group' then I think you should at least discuss with her the possibility of moving.

Tortu · 04/11/2011 19:10

In defence of the school (though they sounds dreadful!), it is notoriously difficult dealing with girls and friendship fights/ bullying. I have worked in, what sounds like, quite a similar school and it was a nightmare. I would deal with at least one crying girl each day- and it really was like their whole world had ended. I've never seen adults become so upset when they've split up with their husbands as when groups of girls at this age split up. Distraught.

And the biggest problem? Most of it is entirely in the girls' heads (and I mean the bullies as well), so you can't prove anything. There is usually nothing substantial, so girls sobbing because 'somebody handed me the maths book in a funny way and I just knew they hated me and everybody had been talking about me' was not unusual.

I would also move her. I hate all-girl environments for this very reason. I think your daughter needs to find some new friends and it doesn't sound like there are any options in this school. She possibly needs to be in an environment mixing with boys who won't stomach this kind of nonsense. I would look for a large comprehensive with a bullying policy and a wide variety of children.

MigratingCoconuts · 04/11/2011 17:24

I'm amazed that you are paying for this experience!!! I feel so sorry for your girl Sad

noblegiraffe is right, moving now would be much better than waiting into the GCSE courses.

As a teacher I wouldn't always say moving schools is the best solution but I would in this case, with so little school support and these ringleaders being allowed to remain in power and control of the situation.

good luck sorting it.

CrosswordAddict · 04/11/2011 17:19

OP Firstly, I think you may need to lean heavily on the school to do something to earn their fees.
Secondly, private schools cannot afford to lose pupils in the present economic situation so this should make them a bit more proactive.
Thirdly, if your daughter is moving schools, then she will need to do so for the start of Year 10 as most GCSE courses are two- year courses.
I think she will probably benefit from a change and the sooner the better.
You have my sympathy, fwiw. Brew

noblegiraffe · 04/11/2011 16:27

Moving in Y9 might be difficult, moving in Y10 or 11 would be much worse because of GCSE courses.

If you think she is going to start refusing to go to school at all and the school have been useless in sorting the problem, then I'm not sure you have much option. Has there been any suggestion of moving classes to get away from these girls?

Francesca22 · 04/11/2011 14:36

Moving schools is a unnerving option but it sounds like it might be best for your
daughter and I think she might find things easier at a co-ed school (one with pretty equal numbers of boys and girls!!). If you move now the timing is ok in terms of exams -- your daughter will have time to settle down. I think having boys around tends to diffuse the bitching in the school environment and your daughter may find she makes friends easily with them as she may be suspicious of girls for a while. The bus journey sounds horrible but I suspect it's because it's a small group in a small space that the boys are involved. I can't tell you how many girls I know who have gone through what your daughter is going through and I don't think it's a coincidence that they are bright and attractive. One of my close friends is going through this at the moment and has just given notice for the end of term. Her daughter is Y8 too.