ughhh! School advising DD to 'up' her number of A-levels because top Universities want them....

I learnt recently that our IB sixth formers often do an Open university module as well, in the first year of sixth form - something that ties in with what they want to study at university. Sounds very hard work to me.

Hmm I'd want to see their sources for this strategy TBH.

DD1 did oxbridge applications last year etc and they would rather see high points in 3 A2s than lower in 4 and we understood would only offer based on 3 (unless you did math/further maths but the oxbridge maths girls saw that as 1 A level course anyway).

She did CT and enjoyed it at AS and an EPQ in upper 6th as well that was helpful (those who didn't do an EPQ did do GS or CT at A2). THe school thought these taught useful skill and did have some baring on applications unofficially- I think a lot of it was to keep bright girls busy and focussed though!

She did get interviewed at Oxford but turned down after - so the strategy as far as it went worked. She got A A A at A2 and A in EPQ. ( So f** knows what Oxford didn't like about her LOL anyway she's V happy At Nottingham!)

at dd's school they are offered the option to do AS in Critical Thinking as an option in Yrs 10-11 (i.e. replacing a GCSE option), not as a Sixth Form option

Sadly, not all students attend good schools, Yellowstone. As someone working with students in London's poorer neighbourhoods, I can assure you that some schools there do guide students towards GS or CT (though not both) as A2s. The idea behind this is to ensure their students end up with three A-levels of some sort and get into university. This works against brighter, high-aiming students, though, and parents need to watch out for it.

Good schools teach students to think critically across all subjects unimother, it's essential at A2.

Surely General Studies or Critical Thinking are both almost unheard of as a third A2?

I'd agree with what Oxford PPE admissions tutor said earlier (I went to Oxf and am admissions tutor in a humanities subject at a Russell Group uni). I would see 3 good A'levels at the norm, better than 4 not so good ones. No real point in Critical Thinking or General Studies - we are generally looking for a really promising basis for continuing discipline-specific (as in academic disipline, not corporal punishment ) skills and knowledge development into level one at Uni.

While Oxbridge tutors agree that GS and CT do not count (because they lack academic content), some will admit off the record that both can be useful to some students. General Studies does give applicants a basic understanding of social issues, useful for many courses, including medicine; CT encourages logical thinking, a skill tutors will be looking for at interview, especially in PPE and Law. Applicants from a non-university background are most likely to gain from taking GS or CT, but the thing is not to take either as a third A2.

I seem to remember reading Critical Thinking has extra funding for schools?

Irregulareregular

My DS (who is 14 coming up 15 ) wants to do PPE . Can you give me any advice for him. ? I am sure you are overwhelmed with this kind of thing but

would appreciate it . Will completely understand if you don't .

Bearcat I think Oxford prefers not to ask about EPQ in the interview. DS's was an interview for Medicine elsewhere.

My DDs didn't do any EPQ other than in term time in Y13.

If I think any of my younger DC are attempting or being put under pressure to attempt too many subjects I shall counsel caution very strongly indeed. They should enjoy Sixth Form, not have it made into one long flog.

DS2 did the EPQ over the summer between AS and A2 in 2009. It was really hard work and he basically spent the whole summer on it (150 - 200 hrs he thought), but at least it got it out of the way before he started his A2 year. He got an A*.
He did go for interview at Oxford, so his TSA score was obviously good enough without doing a CT A level. He just did a couple of practice TSA's on line. He didn't get an offer from Oxford. He was asked nothing about his EPQ at interview, even though it was an economics project and he was applying for Economics & Management.
He did do 4 A levels and didn't drop any after AS.

Agree about the EPQ. Two of my DD's have done it so far and found it very worthwhile and DS1 has just been quizzed on his at a university interview on Friday, even though he made only a passing reference to it in his PS (largely because he hadn't started it when he put in his form).

I'd prefer the school to drop General Studies altogether if they're putting pressure on for a fourth A2 as well as the EPQ. In those circumstances it seems to add remarkably little. Unfortunately schools seem to be good at the moment at adding things on to the exam load and workload and not very good at taking them off. I'm not in the least keen on four A2's as well as the EPQ unless a student is dead keen themselves to do all five. Three and the EPQ seems fine.

X post with ellis - slow reader here

Back in those distant days when I was a pupil, in my school every A level candidate was entered for General Studies as a matter of routine. But other than including it in the mocks, it was not a taught subject - just a chance to show in examination what it thought we should all be capable of tackling based on the knowledge we all should be picking up in and around our chosen subjects and from an alert attitude to life in general.

It was made clear that no-one should rely on it for their main University offers though - even then it wasn't considered a "serious" subject - more of a "nice to have".

If the school is offering it on that basis, it's harmless. If they're diverting teaching time from the main subjects, then it may be more of a concern.

personal statement

Doing the Extended Project can be a good thing. If she knows what she wants to do at uni (or even has a rough idea) then she can choose a project subject that is relevant (and should enjoy doing) and can then mention it in her personal assessment.

The extended project is a chance to explore one of their subjects in more depth and to look at an area outside the normal curriculum. That can be useful in showing they can work independently and is something to discuss at places that interview/ to put on a personal statement to show interest in a subject. It also, of course, increases the UCAS points and pushes the school up the league table again

It's possible to do most of the work out of term-time (unless your school require it to be done in term time) so you ought to seriously consider this one.

My DD's school insists that all students do an Extended Project as well as their A levels. The IB students do an Extended Essay as part of their course. There is no General Studies or Critical Thinking, though the IB students obviously do TOK.

What dreadful advice from the school - what sort of school is it?

Clearly using your daughter to boost their league table position.

Do three A2 levels 9with the extended essay if possible or 3 plus wide ranging reading

General Studies and Critical Thinking are pretty much ignored by top universities.

There is nothing wrong with Critical Thinking as a subject, but few students take it seriously. If they are studying a Science or Humanity, they should be able to think critically in those subjects.

NotnOtter your DS seems to have the right approach, better than the school. There are a few universities (including one or two Russell Group) that accept General Studies as an A level and slightly more that accept Critical Thinking as an AS level. Part of the TSA is like criticial thinking but the main reason for doing either/both is that it increases the school's average points per pupil and that pushes them up the league tables.

Outreach person for Oxbridge said quite clearly that you should only do more than 3 if it wouldn't prevent you getting good grades in 3. they do like to say a 4th subject to AS level. If looking at Maths top unis will expect further maths and probably STEP.