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Original poster

Kent & Bexley Mums

37 replies

starlady · 09/10/2011 17:57

I am really curious how tax paying Kent and Bexley mums feel about out of borough children being tutored up to their eyeballs/ going to private crammers coming in and taking grammar places away from Kent and Bexley tax-payers?

OP posts:
Original poster
starlady · 13/10/2011 15:37

Also, in terms of the children in Bexley grammars, only 31% of these come from Bexley borough and 69% will come from out of the borough....
Seems to indicate out of borough kids tutored more. Fair system? Perhaps Bexley actually want to kids who come from pushy homes who can afford tutors. Many still get tutored afterwards too. System is a crock.

OP posts:
Original poster
starlady · 13/10/2011 14:45

Forehead I know it's true that many African parents care deeply about education, and I think it's interesting what troisgarcons say about Townley. But I don't think this is the case at other grammars - ie Chis and Sid - from what I have been told. And if what you said was true (ie loads of Afro-Carribean children going to grammars from Lewisham), it would mean there wouldn't be this unbalance in the school population.

I think the segregation in Lewisham is being caused by the proximity to the grammars, and the fact there are pockets of wealth in Lewisham where people ship 'em off privately.

Although if we had grammars everywhere my child would probably get in, but sorry, I still don't think it's right to select at ten, and fail 75% of all children. So I think we'll agree to disagree!

OP posts:
forehead · 12/10/2011 19:51

I agree with trois, there are many children of West African origin in Kent and Bexley Grammar schools.West African perents regard education as very important and they are prepared to pay in order that their dcs get into the best grammars.

troisgarcons · 12/10/2011 15:20

I would disagree -the heavily Black West African Christians do an awful lot of tutoring. As do Asians. Look at Townley - its roughly 1/3rd each White/Black/Asian.

I think grammars should brought back across the country. They are the best social leveller. Comprehensives cause 'segregation'.

Why do ethinic minoritories from out of Bexley bring their children to us, regardles of whether they pass their 11+ or not? We have children who travel from the Isle of Dogs and Tower Hamlets to get into a non-selective Bexley school. Hell of a journey - but their own parents don't want them mixing 'ghetto style'

Original poster
starlady · 12/10/2011 13:31

Actually qumquat, I don?t think I made myself clear. I am against grammars too, and I don?t live in Kent or Bexley. My point is if people from Kent and Bexley want and have voted for grammars, that?s fine. But I?d LOVE Kent and Bexley parents to stop parents from other boroughs muscling in on the grammars.
So many children going outside of their London boroughs is having a knock-on effect on the surrounding areas. In Lewisham for example, it?s leaving a racially segregated schools population.
According to the last census publishes 2001 ? around 30% of population are Afro-Carribean (OK, this has probably risen a bit in ten years ? we?ll see when the next census is published, and I?m guessing there?s a higher concentration of younger people in this 30% ). But, even given this, the three schools I?ve been looking at in Lewisham are closer to 80%.Afro-Carribean.
My children are mixed race, and in my children?s primary school, we are ?living the dream? ? 35% black, 45% white, rest of kids mix - Asian, Arabic, etc. Nearly all of them, who would otherwise be going to secondary school in Lewisham, have set the grammar test for Kent and Bexley. It?s pushy (usually, but not exclusively, white) parents behind the tutoring etc, hence the distortion of schools.
Have to say on the plus side a lot of these kids in Lewisham schools are doing well. But socially, I think it is a real shame.

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troisgarcons · 10/10/2011 18:30

I have no idea - I can ask tomorrow. The whole funding thing is very complex. There are other bounties attached to some pupil such as ESL/Statement/traveller. Travellers get the biggest bounty. School 'like' having them on their books. It massively increases the CVA.

Lasvegas · 10/10/2011 17:44

trois very interesting £2,700 is massively less than fees charged at private schools and no way is the differnece just profit. Does anyone know if this £2,700 is to include over heads like insurance, capital expenditure etc.

OP if I lived in LA that had a grammer I would feel that my council tax should be spent initially on providing education to those kids who parents paid council tax to that LA.

Personally I refuse to tutor my child to try and get them into a grammer school. As its not just about getting it, if they cannot pass entrance exam confortably, ie without tutoring, then once they are there I don't think it will be good for self esteem to always strugggle and be the bottom of the class.

troisgarcons · 10/10/2011 15:11

No, it fluctuates between boroughs.

I think the LA has a set amount it receives from the central government pot though. That is approx £2,700 per child Y7-Y11 and almost double that for 6th form. (I only 'think' Im not in school finance)

That however is not what boroughs pay each other.

Lasvegas · 10/10/2011 15:08

thanks trois. As I understand it Harris schools are supported directly by central Govt/charity and not by LA. So if a Bromley child goes to a Bexley Harris school does Bromley LA pay the Harris school? is there a set amount per child across the UK? I suppose not as it must cost more to educate in westminster LA than newcastle for example, staff must cost more etc.

troisgarcons · 10/10/2011 13:48

Well only 18% of the children in our grammars are from Bexley Borough. Don't have an issue with it myself. My son didnt need tutoring to get to grammar but I can see why some parents would.

Eg if a child comes in from Greenwich or Bromley - then those LAs pay Bexley per head for educating the child. The same applies if a child from Bexley goes to Crown Woods or Beaverwood.

What would you do with the Harris Academy in Falconwood (Bexley) that has a 1.7mile catchment - which is 70% Greenwich?

Lasvegas · 10/10/2011 11:32

I have no experience of state schools but thought that you had to live in a certain radius of the school and if there was places left then people who lived further away got the places, so that the school was not half full. It is weird how you pay council tax to one borough but can use the school in another, is there cross funding between the boroughs?

qumquat · 09/10/2011 18:12

People in other boroughs pay tax too. I'm not sure what your point is.

(I teach in Bexley comp, if I had my way I'd scrap all the grammar schools, so I guess you're pleased I'm not in charge!)