Unreasonable Teacher.....

cinpin - "I however do not think that a child should be exluded for throwing a rubber."

You've missed the point here - if throwing the rubber was an isolated incident, then you're right, but it's not.

Low level disruption is the biggest issue in the school where I teach. It is also the most difficult to deal with - we have a fairly robust system of behaviour management, but kids will argue if you, as a teacher, impose sanctions for something they consider to be petty - like throwing a rubber, or too much talking. The biggest reason for imposing sanctions at school is "tooting" - talking out of turn. Thing is, every time I have to pull a child up because of that, I have to stop teaching.

Good luck for your daughter onceamai when she starts her new school. I however do not think that a child should be exluded for throwing a rubber.

Not all teachers are brilliant there is good and bad which is the same for independant schools.

I shou;d have hit 'preview'

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Closest I can get to a 'like' button.
Low level disruption is a destroyer of many other children's learning.

I'm afraid I've had to deal with the other side of your son's behaviour. My DD has come home in tears on numerous occasions because of low level disruption during lessons for almost two years which have prevented those who wish to be educated from learning. Rubber bands have been thrown, paper has been thrown, water has been flicked - and it is very upsetting for the children on the receiving end. It has ruined her transfer to secondary school and destroyed my faith in state schools in the UK. There is a minority in her year who have ruined the educational experience of the majority and teachers have taken a far too softly softly approach. In my opinion the children concerned should be permanently excluded to send a message into their communities that anti-social and disrespectful behaviour will not be tolerated. My dd is lucky she is transferring to the independent sector next year. I am very sad for the hard working, pleasant, well behaved girls who have to stay there and also for some absolutely brilliant teachers who should not have to spend their time dealing with disgraceful and disrespectful behaviour. I don't want to be rude OP but I hope you have actually considered the impact of your son's behaviour on other children.

OP's son is in a fortunate position in that this has all come to a head before he starts in the upper school. He should ensure he uses the opportunity to start off on the right foot. I've emphasised to my children the need to get a good reputation with the teachers from the start. Misbehave on day one and no matter how hard you try, you'll find it extremely difficult to shake off the bad pupil image.

Believe me - teachers do not have the time or energy to go out of their way to 'have it in' for kids. Teaching can be a slow drip of low level disruptive behaviour from several kids in one class and even as experienced and effective teachers it can take it's toll. Teachers just want to teach. Many parents would be horrified if they saw how their kids behaved in school and kids ARE NOT going to tell you that when they get pulled up for it! I was head of year for 7 years and am guilty of making THE PHONE CALLS HOME. I can tell you that if the school is repeatedly on the phone then there are issues going on - I did not have time to follow up insignificant problems. I would be open minded and ready to listen to the teacher in the class first.

Well your son sounds very much liked mine trouble is when they get a bad name it sticks.

This went on for weeks with my son saying the teacher had it him for him I was very supportive of the school, then they gave him a mentor who sat in on the lesson who agreed my son was singled out and picked on. So dont think your son is in the wrong all the time.

Yes, I agree with you. As I said in my first post, I don't agree with ALL the teacher said. (sorry for shouting that word, have had wine and finger control to embolden a word has gone...)

I gather from the OP the head will have words with the teacher in question. And the teacher will be made to apologize. Which is good and how it should be.

And I hope that OP's ds pulls his socks up because if he is a bright lad then the world is his oyster and he should not spoil it by acting the prat in class, whether he likes his teacher or not.

Then that's what she should have said, without reference to SEN children, or the implication that if you fail exams you will never make anything of yourself.

Goblin, I did not read what the teacher said as an attack on SEN kids, merely an indication of where OP's son would end up if he did not work - not making anything of his life when he is capable of more. I don't think the teacher was saying SEN kids don't make anything of their lives, she was illustrating to the OP's ds how lucky (in relative terms) he was to be able to do more if only he was willing to start work and stop mucking around.

Yes Goblin, I think so. He needs a short sharp shock to see what he is doing with his life. If he does not take education seriously at age 14 and thinks throwing rubbers around is an acceptable past time then he should not be surprised if he finds himself floundering around without a decent set of results in years to come.

I am sooo sick of this softly softly approach to teaching where every child is valued and pussyfooted around because 'he does not like the teacher' or 'he just does not like the subject'. These are not primary school children and in life he is not going to gel with everyone but will still be expected to get on with it.

A bright child who is capable of so much more needs to be pushed to fulfill his potential and a short sharp shock and some cruel-to-be-kindness may just do the trick.

Like I said, I don't agree with all the teacher said but can empathise with a frustrated teacher who sees a bright child fall by the wayside.

Get you, smuggaroony!
I used to get two or three a week. Then the frequency tailed off slowly and with much effort and thought from all involved.
I now have to go and look up that Saki story about the girl who was so horribly good that she won medals for her goodness and allowed to walk in a special park that was only for the goodest of good children.
She was eaten by an escaped wolf, attracted by the clinking of her medals.
I love Saki.

'Whilst I can see that what the teacher said was not kind and not professional, I can see why she said it.'

Really?
'"he was a failure, would end up in the bottom set with the SEN kids, would fail his exams and never make anything of himself".

You think that a valid warning to offer a disruptive and annoying child, and an accurate prediction of what the future holds for a child with additional needs?
A self-fulfilling prophecy, let's hope she never gets her revolting attitude near any responsibility for a child with SEN. Or if she does, let them have a parent who will challenge her on her stupidity and ignorance.

Pleased this has been sorted sensibly.

Whilst I can see that what the teacher said was not kind and not professional, I can see why she said it. You said yourself, your ds is a bright lad. But instead of applying himself he acts the clown causing teachers and HOY to phone you regularly. Your ds is 14. 14, not 4. In a few years time he will be an adult and expected to make a go of life himself. It is about time he grew up and pulled his socks up because once he is in employment he will have to work, regardless of a 'personality clash' with his boss/supervisor.

You need to side with the school. Your ds will thank you for it in years to come.

1 or 2 phonecalls a term is loads.

If English is his 'weak' area, and also the one subject in which his behaviour is poor, I would suggest that that two are linked - rather than a 'personality clash' with the teacher, which in my experience always means 'clash regarding expectations of behaviour and effort'. Perhaps he messes around because it's easier than having to work at something he finds difficult?

He needs to be reminded that English is an important subject that he needs to work at, and if it is is weak subject then he needs to concentrate harder than in his other subjects rather than pissing about.

Can his English teacher put him on a report card for a couple of weeks with targets to do with behaviour and effort for each lesson? If that gets sent home, then you can see if he is improving or still messing around

I find it difficult to believe that the teacher said that. I'm not saying your son's lying, but like all teenagers I imagine he's being selective when he paraphrases.

One of my teacher friends had her life made an utter misery by a child telling his mum that she had called him a 'special needs child'. My friend did not do that. The boy was being disruptive and she asked him if he was disrupting because he found the work difficult (she knew he wasn't).

Anyway, his mum went in 'all guns blazing' as you say and got a nasty shock when she was told that her son was causing low-level disruption across the board and realised that she clearly had a problem on her hands. It must have been quite embarrassing for her and she backed down quickly when presented with the evidence (to her credit).

If the teacher did say that she was being unprofessional.

I'd like to buy your son a cake of his choice, or whatever other treat he likes JustGettingOnWithIt.
Beautifully put.
I hope the teacher gets a boot up the bum for his choice of phrase.

My SEN son thinks your son's teacher's out of order.

He says the idea that SEN kids should have to put up with the likes of your son is typical and bang out of order, and he should simply be excluded from subjects he feels he can't be arsed to behave in.

His view is your son should apologise to the class and the teacher for disrupting everyone elses learning, and the teacher should go and apologise to the SEN pupils for even suggesting that they were so unworthy as to deserve him.

I don't disagree with him.

Credit to you for talking to others before making your descision though.

And am sorry to the teachers too, though if you read another thread on Queen's College i posted on, you may not judge me too harshly!

I went through a stage of disruptive behaviour at school. It was low level stuff, whispering 'clever' remarks to my neighbour, passing funny drawings around and squirting orange juice at the girl in front through a hypodermic syringe and when she bent forward, spraying the teacher instead. I am deeply sorry for the disruption caused to fellow pupils with my rubbish attitude to school. I was arrogant and thought I knew better than the school. I don't know if a good talking to would have worked at the time as I was 'right' and didn't really care anyway. We did have alot of problems at home

Sorry, no suggestions - just sharing.