OMG!

SMA, I can see that with the DLA change. Very weird. The fact that it's not happening until 2013 = time to campaign against it IMO, though.

The trouble is vesela that for me the dodgy things are not outweighed by the benefits. I can see the LD influence but its so barely there it's incredible.

So the memebrshipc ard is being returned tomorrow. Specifically for the number of scared e-mails I had received within two hours of the DLA decision (17). Exactly what NC told me was against LD belief and whereas I relaise he does not have all the say it's too much for me to support.

Lib Dem policies in the budget:

increase in personal tax allowance
increase in capital gains tax
banks tax

all of them less than ideal level (although personal allowance to rise further) but wouldn't have happened at all if was just the Tories.

Not that there aren't some dodgy things in there too, of course.

sorry to hear all that expat.

They are doing what they always do. Even on the bbc news they said it...the budget has effected the lowest paid and the high earners have hardly been effected.

LL, labour only did that if you believe they did that...it depends on what you read [imo].

I think they had a long plan, a long game and every bit of hard work they have put into reducing poverty in the UK; the Tories have ripped every bit of it away today and will continue to do so.

They have lied about the NHS; waiting lists for example, education, SS, welfare...everything. They simply do not care. full stop.

Tarty thats horri; I have two with same DLA amounts as you and a hell of a lot of other bad luck to boot (DS2 lower elvel SEN, DH redundany) but I can quite clearly see why LL would be bitter about her lot: in and out of care, epilepsy, child with SN on top........ nah get a grip isn;t appropriate.

Although wrt to voting Tory- er yes this was going to happen. Which is why I am so glad I didnt; belelive a word of their claims. Shame to be proven right though; would have loved to be proven wrong, esp. as the LibDems are now their buddy-buddies.

LL. Celibacy schemellibacy!. You will cope with 4 in a 3 bed- nan managed 16 in hers (!!!). And you're being sterilsied anyhow so what is the point of yelling if you cannot be bothered.... er she is being bothered.

Oh, I dunno, LL. All those pictures of Cameron with Thatcher were enough to convince me.

Exactly, lego. We are working poor. We live in social housing. I am foreign-born, this was my first time being eligible to vote in a general election.

And I didn't buy their line of bullshit for a minute.

But I'm sorry you did, LL.

We're very fucked, tbh.

We're done having kids (DH had the snip), but nonetheless, between VAT hike and freezes and the paltry £1000 tax threshold hike we're fucked. Especially because it will cost more to heat our home. We can't afford to carpet the wood floors and are stuck with the crap electric storage heaters in here.

Oh, and now DH's and DD1's DLA will be re-assessed (can't imagine the cost of that!).

I won't even go into the whole neighbour crap.

The flat below us is used by the council to house every thug going.

The tories said a lot prior to the election. They always do. It's how they operate.

ok i forgive you! I had a feeling a lot of people who voted Tory were to young to remember them being in power .I on the other hand am middle aged and remember the hell of the 80 s very well.

Wasn't having a go LL,just saying dh managed to get the snip after one child and at a fairly youngish age.

It might be worth considering an appeal as expat says.At least you wouldn't be worrying about contraception failure (I've also had a one of those,shes 15 now ).

Lots of us struggling so many of us can understand.

Blimey. LL, yabu to vote Tory.

It sounds like you won't be much worse off, when everything's balanced out.

Entirely understandable to need a mope every now and then about the shitty hand you've been dealt.

but, you'll be fine, really.

Londonone, LL was using hormonal contraceptives and condoms. Are you seriously saying she should have had an abortion?

I am sorry but this is your fault and all the others who voted Tory. Why did you vote for them ?
Working class people are their own worst enemy sometimes or did you read the sun newspaper.
Sorry am not in a very good mood can you tell !

Lol at "children happen"

Oh yes they do! I have a very unplanned child who has only just fallen asleep.

no jollypirate everyone isn't having unlimited numbers of kids, because most people take responsibility. Unfortunately there is a growing set of people who don't take responsibility and feel they are entitled to have the state pick up the tab for their life. I do not however agree with your statement that "children happen" they don't.

londonone - my sister is epileptic, has had a number of unplanned pregnancies, all despite being on pill and using condoms, two carried on despite morning after pills being taken (condom failure in those cases!) (although sadly none have 'stuck' yet), and had an abortion after one of them seemed likely to stick. She now has counselling to get over the abortion, which truly fucked her up. So the country is still paying for her pregnancy, even though she is still childless. She's working at the moment, but has had periods of unemployment in the past due to her condition. It's a horrible horrible disease/disability. Invisible to the naked eye too, which makes it worse. Don't judge loudlass until you've stood in her shoes for a while.

muminbeds - we are overcrowded as it is the population cannot simply keep expanding. I have no concerns that the world is suddenly going to run out of people!

... and my neighbour is tuning up as we speak. The dogs are out and barking, she is holloering for them over the balcony in her delicate tones in between shrieking at the three year old who is sobbing (as usual). Did I mention she is expecting another?

Oh...and let's not forget the music! [cross]

Yes - social services are heavily involved.

I WANT LL TO MOVE IN NEXT DOOR. Honest ll - it's three good sized bedrooms, no garden but we are opposite a park. Oh and the SN support here is fab.

londonone if we go from the point of view that to sustain ourselves we need to have children, and that the birth rate is falling and it presently below replacement level wouldn't you think that helping to support one parent/couple bringing up four children would be cost effective for the state than helping support four parents/couples in bringing up one child each?

If that one family with four children has at least one working parent then that must be a good thing, right?

...not everyone in the country IS having an unlimited number of children londonone - I work with families year round and don't see many with four or more. Shock horror - some of those who DO have four or more have working parents. And even worse they get some tax credits.

Get a grip yerself and look around you. If the only people who had children were those who could afford to (ie the well off) this country would grind to a halt in the next 25 years.

I cannot afford my ONE child at present - he has SN and I only work part-time so I can support him. Does this mean I should not have had him? The taxpayer (ie YOU - ooh and me as well as I pay tax) gives me a little over £600 a month in tax credits, CB and DLA. It still does not equal what I would earn if I worked full time which I cannot.

If nothing else I can see and understand that one size does not fit all. Surely ANYONE can understand that children happen, life changes and sometimes people need support. LL needs the support - she's taking nothing she is not entitled to and her children are being raised with a working parent who demonstrates that you work to earn money. It's not going to be forever either.
Personally I save my wrath and annoyance for people like my neighbour who has four kids she cannot cope with and police presenting themselves at the door every five mins to take away this that or the other partner, stolen property and drugs. Now THAT is a problem to society and the taxpayer NOT loudlass and her family.

yes nickschick the pot of gold required to pay for everyone to receive support for having as many children as they fancy ragerdless of whether or not they can support them.

You voted Tory?!

Sorry, but after reading that, I have to agree with tartyhighheels.

As far as bitching about your housing situation, you're lucky to have a secure tenancy at all, seriously.

I know people with 5 children in two bed council houses. They just get on with it.

And there's an appeals process for the sterilisation thing.

It's all water on the bridge now.

They're in power, they made the budget. We're very working poor, too, so I'm not surprised by all their cuts.

That's why I didn't vote for them!

But regardless, time to see what we can do to live with it all.

And you can't just jack in work and go on benefits.

You have to be made redundant or get sacked (not willfully, either).