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Original poster

Which is more important now: political reform or the economy?

264 replies

FrakkinTheReturningOfficer · 08/05/2010 16:18

Political reform is going to be bad for the economy, in the short term at least.

Sorting out the economy probably means putting political reform on hold.

Which would you choose?

OP posts:

longfingernailspaintedblue · 08/05/2010 17:01

policywonk

Greece spends more than it gets in tax, so it needs to borrow.

Who exactly is it going to borrow from if it tells the markets to fuck off?

Maybe if it got its own finances in order, it could then be some sort of airy-fairy socialist utopia. Till that time, it is utterly dependent on the international financial markets, and there is nothing it can do about it.

policywonk · 08/05/2010 16:59

I think the Greek situation rather illustrates my point, actually. Chinless investors and Goldman Sachs conspired to fuck up Greece's economy, and now ordinary people in Greece are asked to carry the can while said chinless investors sail off into the sunset on solid gold yachts. Why people think we should conspire with this crap ('oooh but we've got to think about what the markets want!') instead of fighting against it is completely beyond me.

Chil1234 · 08/05/2010 16:54

Want to share that thought with the Greeks...?

policywonk · 08/05/2010 16:50

Agree with coolfonz - nothing to do with each other. And frankly I am extremely fucking tired with right-wingers implying that the 'markets' are entitled to tell us what to do. Investors don't run my country - the electorate does.

Cartoose · 08/05/2010 16:48

Economy

Coolfonz · 08/05/2010 16:48

It's even quite odd people are trying to compare one with the other.

Ooh let's not move a tiny way towards being a democracy one day, we have to protect business interests first. it shows how pernicious the prevailing political ideology is. capital is god.

you could quite easily change the electoral system and do X Y or Z to the economy.

longfingernailspaintedblue · 08/05/2010 16:45

The economy is much more important.

I think the best political reform is that so many disgraced MPs have gone, and new, younger, more independent MPs in all parties are now elected.

I wouldn't mind seeing a House of Lords elected using PR, many more open primaries, equalised constituency sizes, and similar. I am fundamentally opposed to massive STV constituencies. The fact that an MP serves only 80000 gives them at least some serious connection to a local area. If they serve 500000 then they won't bother with solving tricky but mundane problems for constituents - it just isn't worth their while.

But none of that is as important as starting to cut the deficit.

Coolfonz · 08/05/2010 16:45

absolutely the markets caused this. the entire right wing ideology of deregulated markets caused this. no one serious doubts that. the huge deficits are the result of bailing out massive financial institutions who held a gun to the head of society.

nothing to do with tax revenues. dear oh dear.

MmeTrueBlueberry · 08/05/2010 16:41

The markets haven't caused the economic meltdown. It is simple spending more than you earn, ie government spend exceeding tax revenues.

MmeTrueBlueberry · 08/05/2010 16:40

The economy, above everything else.

Political reform is not for the benefit of the country - just small parties, including nutter ones.

Coolfonz · 08/05/2010 16:38

its the markets which caused this. this is the socialising of losses created by private institutions. if they go down, big deal. life will go on.

Original poster

FrakkinTheReturningOfficer · 08/05/2010 16:28

Okay rephrase to 'tough measures designed to control the deficit, rebuild market confidence and encourage economic stability', which IMO isn't compatible with political reform.

Markets hate change...

OP posts:

FlyingMonkey · 08/05/2010 16:22

Without political reform we may not see any decisive action on the economy.

Coolfonz · 08/05/2010 16:21

The two aren't exclusive of each other. Sorting out the economy isn't in the power of elected politicians, they don't control it. Moving slowly towards democracy is something they can control to a degree.

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