We need your thoughts on Finance lessons being dropped from Schools Bill

I'd be amazed if good teachers weren't already using real-life finance examples in lessons. My primary school age son is often doing maths homework based on money examples. And at secondary level you could use a credit card bill, mortgage or a savings account as illustration for a lesson on compound interest. ... if you owe £2000 on a CC, the APR is 18% and you pay off the minimum amount of 1% of the balance each month how long will it take to clear the debt?... etc.

Trouble is that, however good your base knowledge of finance is, it doesn't necessarily stop you spending money you don't have. That's down to personal discipline and values, not mathematics.

For every child who benefits from lessons about financial management, there are ten more who already know this stuff.

I like the fact that teachers can currently judge which aspects of PSHCE will most benefit their class, and don't like the idea of it being a compulsory subject at all. I don't understand why competent children have to learn irrelevant (to them) lifeskills when they could be doing proper academic subjects.

Jax76 - is it possible that those statistics include student loans? These are taken out to pay for tuition/living expenses whilst in higher education and are not repayable until earning over £15k. I always think that these shouldn't be lumped in with feckless borrowing on credit cards, unsecured loans etc because they are both unavoidable and affordable.

I think the comments here are really interesting - and personally feel that although a parent can try and teach their children about finances - that's on the assumption, they themselves understand finances.

In a country where statistics show the older you get, the more debt you get into - it's unlikely, as a whole, we can teach our children the right financial lessons - and that actually - school is the best place for such essential education to be taught.

New statistics from ClearDebt,confirmed last week that the average 18-21 year old is already starting life on the debt ladder with an average debt of £8,195 - which accounts of a whopping 91% of their earnings from part or full time jobs. If this is what our children are doing based on the example we have set them, surely a financial education in school is proven to be essential?

To read more on this report see: goo.gl/fb/nhxtP

Only just seen this thread but I agree with custy so I'm going to quote her all over again

"educate the parents ffs. i keep banging and banging on about this - but it is WRONG WRONG WRONG to parent by proxy through schools.

please keep schools the institutions which teach our children traditional academic subjects.

if we are a society which needs to parent via ourschool system there is something seriously wrong with it.

universal parenting classes on reciept of child benefit is the way to go.

to many children leave the school system without even the basic skill to read more than a page or simple maths.

make all our children, children who have basic numeracy and literacy before they leave the school system and leave the bloody teachers alone and let them get on with it.

stop wasting public money on this kind of farce and direct more into the education system."

Personally I think it's a shame that so many people are prepared to throw up their hands in horror and lobby the government for compulsory finance education, but not for compulsory sex education (i.e from the age of 5, without parental right to withdraw their kids).

I realise that this is an old thread, but missed it the first time round.

PSHCE is currently a non-statutory part of the national curriculum, which results in schools picking and choosing those elements that they feel their pupils would most benefit from (the PSHCE curriculum is very broad). I think its right that schools should have some autonomy, and many of the issues can be taught implicitly or through other subjects.

Most primary schools use the DARE project to teach children to avoid alcohol/tobacco/drugs with questionable long-term results, why does anyone think that a few lessons on financial management would prevent irresponsible borrowing?

Our local secondary school decided to make this subject a compulsory GCSE option and my niece is now learning about stuff that has no relevance to her whatsoever.

Good idea will check it out

Also think there should be education in Tax - What kind of taxes we have,how we pay, why we pay, what happens if we don't pay etc... Would you call that Civics.

Sounds good JSB

Thanks to all of you for listening.

Going to defect back to my own site on this now.

Have a good weekend

Martin

Martin Congratulations on such early success!!

I asked because I've just started to volunteer for them. I'm planning be a Business Advisor in September (maybe helping the next Martin Lewis) but until then I'm volunteering on their 'Learn to Earn' course. here. Which covers some basic personal finance.

Oooh, 'ark at Martin. National finalist indeed

Thanks for the info

@jackstarbright.

In 1988 I believe i was one of the 24 Young Enterprise national finalists

I think young enterprise does a great job however its focus is entrepreneurship and i think we need a dedicated teaching of PF

In many ways entrepreneurship and personal finance are opposites.

Yet this isn't about volunteer groups its about the curriculum. Business studes is a very popular course but pf doesn't exist.

Martin

Martin - Thanks for raising this important subject. I wondered what you think of Young Enterprise - a charity who go into schools to build awareness of personal finance and business? Young Enterprise

@tehersend - I would say it makes it more pertinent, except i'm 100% in favour regardless so 'more' is impossible

@foureleven - 11 is young, though some of the concepts would work with a bright 11 year old but its really aimed at year 10-11

Ps Thanks for the Teen Guide Martin, what age would you reccommend it to out of interest?

Is 11 too young to learn about this subject?

Thanks for the link, really interesting.

How does the raising of the age of compulsory education from 16 to 18 affect your views?

I see it as making it all the more pertinent, and think that removing it from the curriculum is a catastrophic mistake.

Sorry I should've said in the last post - that article was written when compulsory financial education was on the cards - before the plug was pulled.

Hi

With regards to the danger of bank sponsorship thats a key isue for me too.

Hopefully its ok to link you to this which is my full piece on why I believe in Financial Education

Financial Education's a must

Which covers all those issues

Putting it in the curriculum would mean schools can devote their own resource to it. The reason banks can leach in at the moment is precisely because its not compulsory.

Martin

Eggy and daphne, where do you stand on the teaching of foreign languages?

Is teaching financial management not more important? There is definitely room in the curriculum. Prepapration for Working Life is already an examined subject in some schools- why shouldn't finance lessons form part of the syllabus?

Eggy, using the foreign language teaching as an analogy, if this were taught at 'the point of sale', it would consist of chucking people a phrasebook on the ferry to France. That would be wholly inadequate.

Your assumption that lessons which happen before an engagement with a subject writes off the efficacy of teaching languages, sex education and any skill teenagers will need in later life.

Martin, my main concern as regards the teaching of finance in schools is that it is not in any way linked with financial institutions or companies- there is a lot of PFI in education at the moment, and this is likely to increase under a tory government. I fear that finance lessons may morph into an horrendous advertising exercise for the banks- what you are saying about educating young people must stick, and no sponsorship from any bank must be involved.

But sadly daphnedill, as we can see from the state of the economy, parents have not been passing on the right messages as a whole. I agree it would be ideal for children to learn finance at home and I do lead by example with my own children. However, lessons need to be learned from our history and apparently this is one area that parents can tbe trusted in.

Schools have more important things to do than teach Finance Lessons. They're not a substitute for good parenting and/or life experience.