Andy B’s speech

Id prefer he sort things out now. Such as with defence. What did he say about increased defence spending and what is being cut to fund it?

You cannot spend your way to growth. Each of those things will require a vast outlay in taxpayer funds.

He framed a publicly owned electricity grid, and deeper ties with the EU and shifting power out of the treasury and into the regions as being about growth. I'm sure plenty of people won't agree with that philiospohy - and that's great, its what a battle of political ideas should be about - but I just don't think it's true to say he isn't concerned with, or talking about how to solve, the economic state we're in.

I also don't disagree that much of the speech was about a pitch for the future - but to me that's exciting, I'd much rather have a longer term, bigger thinking kind of politics than the kneejerk populist tinkering of the last few years.

Of course it is. It’s a heads up for the next manifesto.

Maybe if regulation of the privatised industries had been effectively managed by - guess who - government - we wouldn't be in the mess we're in. It's highly ironic that we're now suggesting returning to state owned utilities to sort out the mess.

It’s all a GE pitch surely. Most of it is post 2029 GE.

What did he say about growth?

And completely agree with @PinkFruitbat point - how can he promise to end the triple lock in 2030 when he might not even be in government? That's not his promise to make. He doesn't even have a personal mandate for the next three years let alone beyond the term of this parliament.

Those things are hardly the same as civil service reform. Getting rid of Surestart didn't stop microchipping cats taking seventy billion years did it?

The Tories did nothing to improve the mess New Labour made of government infrastructure.

Austerity passed you by then? Demolition of Surestart, privatisation of the probation service, changes to the state pension age.

Billionaires have a lot to do with it @Pineneedlesincarpet. They own our utility companies now. Most of them are foreign so they’ve never lived here or paid tax on the profits they extort from us.

I don't think that's really fair. Sure, it was in the tradition of party conference speeches in that it was more about the vision than immediate policy detail but there was also some definte concrete policy for right now, on the VAT cuts to electricity, and the Great British Grid thing, for example. And he spoke alot about growth - albeit without policy detail, but that's to be expected pre-budget, right? I also think the Prime Minister's instincts are right, in that I think the public are tired of short term knee jerk politiking and want to hear a bigger, longer term vision (I know I feel that way). And let's be honest, I don't think we've heard anything close to a pragmatic solution to the current economic crisis from any political party yet (although I am genuinely interested to hear what Kemi Badenoch has to say in her conference speech, now).

Jam tomorrow. We are facing economic crisis and there is nothing proposed between now and 2030.

No hes talking about devolution from central government and putting more power in the hands of the regions. More state control. Don't know what "billionaires" have to do with that. Not that there are many left in the UK anyway. They won't be able to be used by the left as a knee'jerk response to everything..what will you do!!???

Maybe not 40 years, but the idea we've had a small state since 1997 is laughable. The Tories did nothing to improve the mess New Labour made of government infrastructure.

I don't know about taking control out of the hands of billionaires. We need to take back control from government bureaucracy and an inability to get anything done without endless reviews and consultations. I doubt Burnham's plans will improve that.

He’s talking about taking control out of the hands of billionaires. The state represents us, the people. It’s very appealing to those of us who have “enjoyed” the dubious benefits of a small state for the last 40 years.

For the first time in a long time, it gave me hope. I liked Kier Starmer and was dubious about Andy Burnham’s appointment, but as pp said, he has grown on me. It’s nice to see a real human with beliefs and not clever and sniping rhetoric all the time. I really hope that is a turning point.

Hes also talking about more state control not less. Devolution will mean greater state control and interference.

Well its all hot air until he can say how he will pay for everything. Even a decent suggestion. He doesn't need specific figures. But he didnt. Obviously people will be taken in by vibes. And hes definitely better than KS. But hes taking Labour to the left and needs to show this won't ruin the country. Which he hasn't.

That’s what budgets are for.

Of course all that detail is going to have to come, and I’m sure it will, starting with the budget. But that just isn’t what party conference speeches are traditionally for. From my perspective, it was much, much less of an empty vibes speech than I was expecting. I thought it was much more detailed, and much more substantive than any conference speech I can remember - from any political party at all - for many years.

Yes no need to suggest where money will come from to do all the things he says he will. Like devolution which will cost a fortune. And the bottom line is that everything needs paying for. So the speech is just empty vibes.

It would be pretty unusual for a leader from any political party to announce detailed, specific budget savings during a party conference speech, though, wouldn’t it? Generally, I feel like these speeches are all about setting a big philosophical direction, rather than laying out the details. In fact, I think one of the reasons so many people (myself included) were impressed by Andy Burnham’s speech was because it seemed to have much more genuine substance than I’ve got used to hearing. So many of these speeches are just leaders sniping about their opponents, and it was quite striking that he didn’t do that at all. TBF I hope Kemi Badenoch matches in kind with her own conference speech, so we can have some proper political debate about big ideas.

What savings did he announce would be made in this Parliament?

Is this an attempt at satire/ sarcasm?!

Because one of the things that a lot of people I’ve spoken to really liked about Andy Burnham’s speech, was that he didn’t say anything snide or sniping about his opponents. He didn’t need to - because he had an actual vision to articulate instead.

I do think Theresa May was right when she warned it was politically dangerous for the Tories to be seen as the nasty party, and - for the sake of our political discourse - I hope Kemi Badenoch (who I do think is an intelligent and capable politician) remembers it.

Just hope he can pull all of this off now. As ever, the devil is in the detail.

He played a blinder. It’s wonderful to see a return to conviction politics and a politician prepared to risk his political capital on the issues he believes in. And no point scoring.