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Original poster

"National Security can't come at the cost of Social Security" - WTAF?

541 replies

Binnyforthewin · 09/09/2026 14:52

Surely our PM releases that without National Security there is no Social Security? One is entirely dependent on the other.

OP posts:
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EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:51

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:46

There are other decisions they can make which would have a positive impact on the economy that do not involve taxes.

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Yes, that would have been good at the first budget.

Switchnow · 09/09/2026 22:50

Worrall20 · 09/09/2026 22:34

Well you won’t need housing benefit if we can’t defend ourselves? His assessment of homelessness? It increased under his watch in Manchester.

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And the economy will be in worse shape if more people are homeless or in TA. There are other ways to raise the money needed for defence.

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:49

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:47

Anyone reading some of these posts would think that Sunak led the Tories to the most breathtaking GE victory we've ever seen. I mean come on, you are saying that the country got it so wrong and the Tories were right all along. They haven't recovered yet it was so bad.

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Just countering your posts on the policy. You didn’t answer, were you aware five EU countries are setting up similar?

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/09/2026 22:49

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:47

Anyone reading some of these posts would think that Sunak led the Tories to the most breathtaking GE victory we've ever seen. I mean come on, you are saying that the country got it so wrong and the Tories were right all along. They haven't recovered yet it was so bad.

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No the sad thing is that Labour have been so appalling that EVEN THE TORIES are now looked at by some with misty eyes as the last time we had a vaguely competent government. And yes. We really have therefore hit rock bottom.

Worrall20 · 09/09/2026 22:47

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Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/09/2026 22:47

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:42

No thank you. I’m not suited for politics. You can see that by how unpopular I am on this thread. I have no talent for saying what people want to hear rather than the unvarnished truth.

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Nothing wrong with saying what you believe in. And its not being "unpopular". It's just some people don't believe you are correct. Which is perfectly acceptable.

Be quite refreshing if politicians actually said what they believed in themselves. Unless they don't know (Andy Burnham Im looking at you).

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:47

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:41

Because Labour scrapped it on day one. You know that five EU countries are setting up similar? Possibly Rwanda, but if not the same type of location.

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Anyone reading some of these posts would think that Sunak led the Tories to the most breathtaking GE victory we've ever seen. I mean come on, you are saying that the country got it so wrong and the Tories were right all along. They haven't recovered yet it was so bad.

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:46

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:43

Not sure it’s too far from Labour tbf. But at some point someone will have to decide on tax hikes or not.

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There are other decisions they can make which would have a positive impact on the economy that do not involve taxes.

Frequency · 09/09/2026 22:45

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:42

No thank you. I’m not suited for politics. You can see that by how unpopular I am on this thread. I have no talent for saying what people want to hear rather than the unvarnished truth.

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In my honest opinion, that is what we need. Someone who will tell the unvarnished truth, i.e if you want things to improve, you need to put your hands in your pockets and pay for it. Also, stop whining about taxes; we have one of the lowest tax burdens in Europe, and it shows.

Switchnow · 09/09/2026 22:45

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/09/2026 22:12

Is that more important than the national interest? No it isn't. We should be concentrating on our own problems not getting involved in other countries' issues. Why haven't we attacked China? They've been carrying out ethnic cleansing. Why don't we have comprehensive sanctions against China? Because it's not in our national interest. But the PLP and Muslim vote are fanatical about Palestine. So we ignore the national interest this time.

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How it in the national interest to ignore an ally carrying out these actions?

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:44

Binnyforthewin · 09/09/2026 22:28

It's more trying to understand how a poster can deny a phenomenon exists that I and many others observe as being true in the real world.

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I’m denying the direct causal link you and others have associated with a real phenomenon. If anything, NI is the straw that broke the dehydrated, starved, lost camel carrying two tons of bricks.

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:43

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:42

No thank you. I’m not suited for politics. You can see that by how unpopular I am on this thread. I have no talent for saying what people want to hear rather than the unvarnished truth.

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Not sure it’s too far from Labour tbf. But at some point someone will have to decide on tax hikes or not.

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:42

BananaPeels · 09/09/2026 22:36

sounds like you should be chancellor then!

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No thank you. I’m not suited for politics. You can see that by how unpopular I am on this thread. I have no talent for saying what people want to hear rather than the unvarnished truth.

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:41

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:38

This is the period when illegal immigration on boats was soaring. I am genuinely surprised at the defence of this policy on here.....

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Because Labour scrapped it on day one. You know that five EU countries are setting up similar? Possibly Rwanda, but if not the same type of location.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/09/2026 22:40

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:38

This is the period when illegal immigration on boats was soaring. I am genuinely surprised at the defence of this policy on here.....

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We will undoubtedly end up with something similar eventually. Theres no alternative really.

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:40

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:35

It had been in place for two years by the time Labour got in. It was a total waste and everyone knows that.

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No it hadn’t, it was only just starting. But the deterrent did move people voluntarily.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/09/2026 22:39

concertinacornflake · 09/09/2026 22:38

You were in the wrong attacking the person for ages or retirement status, and you know that really. It's 2026.

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You've made your point. Move on.

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/09/2026 22:38

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:35

It had been in place for two years by the time Labour got in. It was a total waste and everyone knows that.

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The legislation needed to be in place for it to work. Which finally it was. But Labour then got in.

As @EasternStandard said, the illegal immigrants had changed their focus to Ireland so the deterrent effect had started to work. In any event many EU countries are looking to a similar plan as Rwanda. I expect that we will end up with something similar. Shame Labout had to make decisins based on ideology rather than practicality as usual.

concertinacornflake · 09/09/2026 22:38

Binnyforthewin · 09/09/2026 22:32

Classic mumsnet - fall back on an ism. It's not agism. She retired early. She might in her 20 for all we know. If you are out of business you will get out of date with what is happening in the real world.

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You were in the wrong attacking the person for ages or retirement status, and you know that really. It's 2026.

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:38

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:33

Yes it did it moved people voluntarily to ROI and that’s the most cost effective way.

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This is the period when illegal immigration on boats was soaring. I am genuinely surprised at the defence of this policy on here.....

BananaPeels · 09/09/2026 22:36

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:35

That’s not the case. I have helped many enterprises navigate cost changes and worse.

Why is it a given ‘taxes will change’.
It is a given that tax rates and even the kinds of taxes change. Note that change can mean hikes or cuts, new taxes or taxes abolished. The only constant in business is change on multiple fronts. That’s just the way the world works.

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sounds like you should be chancellor then!

nearlylovemyusername · 09/09/2026 22:36

concertinacornflake · 09/09/2026 22:29

Thanks for the link. The figures supporting disability benefits are higher than I'd expected, given the efforts from some parties to push support down.
It is clear why all the parties have an issue - everyone thinks the headline costs are too high, but not much support for cuts in reality and 63% say disability benefits are a priority for EXTRA spending.

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Yes of course.

Do I support higher spend on disability? Cancer, double incontinent non-verbal ASD, amputation - yes, absolutely, I'm struggling to imagine who wouldn't. This is what people mean when they say they support disability payments.

Do I support any PIP for acne vulgaris or constipation? not at all.
Success rates for PIP claims by condition

NullaEffugium · 09/09/2026 22:35

EasternStandard · 09/09/2026 22:27

You’re obviously not aware of any businesses that have found it hard with cost increases, not everywhere is £30m turnover or whatever.

Why is it a given ‘taxes will change’. If you and others want tax hikes it’ll be interesting to see how well it goes for Labour.

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That’s not the case. I have helped many enterprises navigate cost changes and worse.

Why is it a given ‘taxes will change’.
It is a given that tax rates and even the kinds of taxes change. Note that change can mean hikes or cuts, new taxes or taxes abolished. The only constant in business is change on multiple fronts. That’s just the way the world works.

BrandiedAromatics · 09/09/2026 22:35

Pineneedlesincarpet · 09/09/2026 22:33

Well thats rather due to Labour cancelling it the second they got in with nothing to replace it with.

Ideology rather than the national interest strikes again....

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It had been in place for two years by the time Labour got in. It was a total waste and everyone knows that.

Worrall20 · 09/09/2026 22:34

Switchnow · 09/09/2026 21:33

So you think paying for defence out of the housing benefit budget is the right thing to do? What about his assessment of the levels of homelessness that wound result?

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Well you won’t need housing benefit if we can’t defend ourselves? His assessment of homelessness? It increased under his watch in Manchester.