Change law to kick out Rochdale rapist, No 10 urged

So your solution is that we keep this scumbag in Britain. In fairness that is probably what will happen.

The govt talk tough but they won't follow through. There are too many people who think Britain should not be able to negotiate robustly with other countries because of our colonial past. I'm not one of those people. I don't want Britain to be weak and pathetic.

I am British! I know we tend to think we are superior and certainly have tried to bully other nations in the past! I would use the term about anyone if it fits. 100% I would. No one seems to hold back from calling Trump a bully.

In this case, the poster I was responding to wanted all aid cut, no visas issued etc and I believe that’s bullying and not likely to get a good response from Pakistan. It’s not diplomacy and it’s not going to work. Pakistan has referred to colonial overtones - that’s on the record so we cannot pretend it’s not happened. Of course Pakistan isn’t whiter than white but in diplomacy you deal with what is in front of you now, not 75 years ago, but when a poster says we need a hard line against Pakistan to get what we want, I very much do not agree that’s going to work.

It’s a much bigger issue in many ways that people seem to believe that changing our laws means other countries will agree to deportations that we now deem legal. It’s patently not the case so why do we think our laws override their views? Is it that we think we are superior? We make a law and others jump to it? That’s not going to happen!

@Twiglets1I put that comment in “ “ because I could not find another way to express it. What other way is there when a nation says we are acting as a colonial power? Ie telling them what to do. It’s clearly a valid argument in their view and it was pointed out to us. I’m not convinced it’s relevant 75 years on but I’m not in Pakistan. Comments like that are inevitable too.

I think bullying is more about taking aid away and stopping visas. Reprisals are never a good look - look at Trump!

Yes, most countries with a colonial past don't give a flying fig about it. Don't see why we should have to wring our hands and kow-tow to all and sundry. Its pathetic and its not what people want.

@5MinuteArgument Pakistan have already played the colonial card. Of course they will see it as imperial power and bullying. I’m not bothered one way or another but Pakistan will be.

Calling Britain a 'bully' is a bit of a stretch. For the most part the govt of this country is weak, spineless and pathetic, turning this country into a soft touch and a magnet for people who wish to do us harm.

@5MinuteArgument A bit but not as much as you think and removing it is throwing out toys out of the pram. Soft power is not going to swing this unless we are very very lucky. There’s no real advantage to Pakistan at all.

We have virtually nothing Pakistan cares about.

I'm sure they care about the millions in aid that we give them. Supposed to be part of our 'soft power'. Stop giving it to them. Let them redirect the resources they put into their space programme to helping their own people instead.

@5MinuteArgument Don’t believe they are strong levers at all! Pakistan can get what we export from somewhere else: ever heard of China? What do we import from them? Not much I think plus trade wars? So Trumpian. It won’t happen. Visas? To empty our universities even more? To have nhs staff shortages? Well qualified people don’t have to come here, they have choices. We have virtually nothing Pakistan cares about. This whole thing is tub thumping and pretending we have more clout than we do. Being bullies is never a good look.

Yes, but only because of the weakness and spinelessness of the UK govt. They have 3 levers to pull: aid, visas and trade. We have the cards, to quote President Trump. If we refuse to play them, more fool us.

As for handing over dissidents: hard no.

I would bet what Pakistan wants won’t be palatable to us. I would bet we are stuck with him and our Aid has not smoothed the way for anything! We can change our laws all we want but if the receiving country won’t play nicely, it’s to no avail.

Yes, Mahmood is great at tough talking. But it's actions that count. I think Labour will make all the noise about removing this scumbag and then the upshot will be that he won't be removed. Because they don't have the will to use the levers available to them: aid, visas, trade.

More gaslighting from Labour.

@Twiglets1 People live on the same street as all sorts of awful people. Ones who haven’t been caught for example! I don’t know if the sentencing guidelines have been altered in the intervening 14 years but people are clutching at straws if they think Pakistan is taking him back. We have imported these problems so it’s our problem.

and the first real sign I have seen that this govt (or any other) gives a toss about the safety of women and girls.

More like the first time they've realised that seeming to want to protect women and girls while at the same time throwing an immigrant out of the country with a great fanfare will be a massive vote winner in multiple sectors of the voting public.

I seriously doubt that many on the left in politics believe that throwing out a man who's lived in this country 53 years to a country with even more vulnerable women and children which doesn't want him is the correct thing to do.

Well at the end of the day, he did the crime and he’s done the time. Maybe the time wasn’t long enough but it was considered ok at the time - well not sure I remember it being called in for being unduly light. So we have him here - hopefully being monitored.

Yes, that's what I think might happen. I suspect this rapist ringleader will still be comfortably back amongst his community in the UK for years to come.

@5MinuteArgumentWhy do we expect to offload our dirty linen? Pakistan has draconian sentences for his crime but it’s not stopping Pakistani men. We don’t accept people here knowing they are rapists. Pakistan has enough of their own and they are not gojng to be told by us what to do. The government has little option but to put up our sentencing tariffs at the longer end because other countries are not interested in taking our criminals. Governments always try and look tough in these situations, wait for the fuss to die down, and then quietly fail!

Yes, let's hope they follow through on it. It would send a clear signal that the UK actually cares about the wellbeing of its citizens.

Looking on the bright side, once the law has been changed ...

1. We can deport this animal and all the others who have been convicted of equally vile crimes. If that means we refuse all visas until Pakistan changes its mind, so be it.

Both excellent news, and the first real sign I have seen that this govt (or any other) gives a toss about the safety of women and girls.

About bloody time !!