Help protect children from gaming harms.

Take our survey

Please or to access all these features

Politics

Social security spending out of control?

305 replies

Wizeman · 15/03/2026 15:06

The UK spends about £334 billion on social security. Around £177 billion of that goes on pensions, which as a young person I’d definitely want when I’m older — especially if I’ve worked all my life and paid into the system. What I don’t understand is why some younger people are against older people getting a pension, because one day they’ll want one too.

About £145 billion goes towards working-age benefits, which is a massive amount of money. Around £76 billion of that is for disabled people, which I think is fair and necessary. But you hear so many stories about people taking advantage of the system, and a lot of those stories turn out to be true.

They say about 1 in 3 people in Britain are on some kind of benefit. I’ve personally been in hospital with serious injuries and had operations that put me out of work for months, and it never crossed my mind to claim benefits. I’ve also been out of work for about a year before while working towards getting a new job, and I just lived off my savings.

That said, I’ll be honest — I’ve always had support from my parents, like being able to stay at their house. I know not everyone has that kind of support.

But it does feel like fewer people want to work and some would rather claim benefits.
I also don’t think removing the two-child benefit cap will really solve the problem.
In Poland, for example, people get tax breaks for having kids, which encourages people to work.

Either way, £334 billion just sounds like an insane amount of money to me.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
JohnofWessex · 02/05/2026 23:28

A quick search gives a figure of about £45 billion for Tax Evasion compared with £9.5 billion for Social Security Fraud AND ERROR - and believe you me the DWP excel in not looking at whats in front of them!

cotswoldsgal1234 · 02/05/2026 23:12

Zonder · 15/03/2026 15:32

They say about 1 in 3 people in Britain are on some kind of benefit

This includes child benefit, which is pretty important to a lot of families.

A very small proportion is benefit scrounging in any form. Far less than is lost through tax dodges by the wealthy.

Where are the facts?
HMRC state that around 7.4 billion is taken in benefit fraud.
in comparison around 5.5 billion is lost in tax evasion.
Both are shocking.

BIossomtoes · 18/03/2026 16:38

Badbadbunny · 18/03/2026 14:05

A very quick google shows that half a million pensioners have an income over £50k, so that's quite a lot who don't "need" the full state pension benefit as they have incomes of around £40k or more from other sources, presumably such as occupational pensions, buy to lets, investment portfolios, etc.

In which case their state pension is recovered in the tax they pay.

Badbadbunny · 18/03/2026 15:48

DrivinginFrance · 18/03/2026 14:17

You have to have made NI contributions for state pension. How much have the non working UC lot contributed?

No, you have to have "earned" NIC credits, which can be accumulated by being on benefits, being part time on low wages, being a carer for young children, etc. So, no, there's no actual link between "paying" NIC and getting a state pension.

january1244 · 18/03/2026 14:25

But pensioners who have that level of income will be paying significant amounts of tax. Personally I wouldn’t remove people from being able to receive a pension, I think it would have far worse effects. Like a PP said, people would stop making provision for retirement, people would feel more resentful. The people with these levels of pension have most likely been net contributors for a very many years.

ive got three decades til my pension at least, and id be very cross if it got means tested

DrivinginFrance · 18/03/2026 14:17

Badbadbunny · 18/03/2026 14:05

A very quick google shows that half a million pensioners have an income over £50k, so that's quite a lot who don't "need" the full state pension benefit as they have incomes of around £40k or more from other sources, presumably such as occupational pensions, buy to lets, investment portfolios, etc.

You have to have made NI contributions for state pension. How much have the non working UC lot contributed?

Badbadbunny · 18/03/2026 14:08

january1244 · 17/03/2026 16:16

But it isn’t benefit bashing. People who are working are seeing less of their wages due to taxation. Cost of living is going up. Everyone is struggling. The difference in what people receive in benefits and what people in work receive net is not much. I can see where the resentment is coming from

Nail on the head.

Add into that, the general consensus among todays youngest workers who believe they won't get an automatic state pension when they retire in 40 years' time, i.e. it'll be means tested or age raised into the 70s!

And you can definitely see where the resentment comes from.

Especially as they're being "nudged" into workplace pension schemes where they have to pay a few percent of their wages ontop of tax and NIC and on top of student loan repayments. Of course, the boomers didn't have student loan repayments and weren't forced into paying into workplace pensions as they expected the state pension! So two new "taxes" that boomers didn't have to pay.

Badbadbunny · 18/03/2026 14:05

BIossomtoes · 17/03/2026 16:09

How many pensioners do you know on £60 or £100k? All you do with this spiteful nonsense is disincentivise people from making provision for their old age.

A very quick google shows that half a million pensioners have an income over £50k, so that's quite a lot who don't "need" the full state pension benefit as they have incomes of around £40k or more from other sources, presumably such as occupational pensions, buy to lets, investment portfolios, etc.

BIossomtoes · 17/03/2026 23:16

Yellowshirt · 17/03/2026 20:24

Very sensible. Keep throwing money at pensioners. Meanwhile uk debt is rising and youngsters dreams of owning expensive homes dissappear.
But its ok. As long as pensioners are comfortable the youngsters can pay all the debts back and continue in expensive rental accommodation and struggling with the cost of living

The state pension is hardly having money thrown at you. Anyone with a private pension is a taxpayer anyway.

Yellowshirt · 17/03/2026 20:24

BIossomtoes · 17/03/2026 16:03

Very sensible. Way to go to discourage people from saving for their old age and paying into pensions. Pensioners with savings lose them if they need care and you have heard of this thing called inheritance tax?

Very sensible. Keep throwing money at pensioners. Meanwhile uk debt is rising and youngsters dreams of owning expensive homes dissappear.
But its ok. As long as pensioners are comfortable the youngsters can pay all the debts back and continue in expensive rental accommodation and struggling with the cost of living

Smeuse · 17/03/2026 18:17

january1244 · 17/03/2026 18:01

Do you have any stats to back up any of your assertions @Smeuse? 8.3 m people are on UC, not all of them can be disabled or caring for disabled surely?

I didn't say that, I just asked a question.

I simply thought you might have some information on it as you quoted the numbers

JohnofWessex · 17/03/2026 18:10

So...........

There are a few statistics that matter

Firstly the percentage of GDP that goes to wages which has dropped since the mid 70's while the percentage going as profits has risen

Then the distribution of those wages which has increasingly gone to high earners.

The rise in house prices and rents in real terms while

The cost of building has risen in line with inflation

In short a perfect storm

january1244 · 17/03/2026 18:01

Do you have any stats to back up any of your assertions @Smeuse? 8.3 m people are on UC, not all of them can be disabled or caring for disabled surely?

Smeuse · 17/03/2026 17:54

january1244 · 17/03/2026 17:49

@SmeuseI don’t think a lot of people would have a problem if people were working full time and needing top ups. But the statistics show that’s broadly not what is happening. Rather, only 37% of working age UC claimants work at all, and with the AET thresholds set where they are at to qualify, a large amount of this won’t be minimal hours

And how many of those claimants can't work more hours due to health issues, caring issues etc?

january1244 · 17/03/2026 17:53

Actually sorry just to correct those figures - the latest report came out for December 25. Only 32% of claimants are in any type of work, and a majority of those who do work are very part time. 180,000 didn’t meet the AET of 18 hours work

january1244 · 17/03/2026 17:49

@SmeuseI don’t think a lot of people would have a problem if people were working full time and needing top ups. But the statistics show that’s broadly not what is happening. Rather, only 37% of working age UC claimants work at all, and with the AET thresholds set where they are at to qualify, a large amount of this won’t be minimal hours

Smeuse · 17/03/2026 17:45

january1244 · 17/03/2026 17:39

@Smeuseis it easy to have a full time job and juggle raising a family and working full time? Do you not think those people deserve to get more net than those who choose to work 16 hours AET or not work at all? And there are some that make that choice

As I have been saying, people should be paid enough not to need a top up.

Sure, a few will live on benefits as a 'life style' but that is not the majority.

If you want people off benefits you will need to provide the services to support that. I haven't seen Reform or Conservatives mentioning any of that, have you?

january1244 · 17/03/2026 17:39

@Smeuseis it easy to have a full time job and juggle raising a family and working full time? Do you not think those people deserve to get more net than those who choose to work 16 hours AET or not work at all? And there are some that make that choice

Smeuse · 17/03/2026 16:52

january1244 · 17/03/2026 16:16

But it isn’t benefit bashing. People who are working are seeing less of their wages due to taxation. Cost of living is going up. Everyone is struggling. The difference in what people receive in benefits and what people in work receive net is not much. I can see where the resentment is coming from

Ofcourse it is bashing when you make out it is so easy to receive and live off benefits.

Nobody likes paying tax and nobody likes crumbling public services so let's blame benefit claimants.

BIossomtoes · 17/03/2026 16:17

DrivinginFrance · 17/03/2026 16:14

You can't take away state pension from those who have sufficient working year NI contributions (I.e move the goalposts at the last minute). Especially if you continue to offer pension credit for those who never paid in.

Realistically you have to change the system for those starting out on their careers ( with the NI contribution diverted to their private pensions) .Although as another poster said Governments just kick the can down the road.

Well you can - you only have to look at what Osborne did to WASPI women but it would be completely unethical.

january1244 · 17/03/2026 16:16

Smeuse · 17/03/2026 15:34

I am aware of the backlash and the promises from the likes of Reform and Conservatives, as I said benefit bashing is easy.

pressed post too early

Benefit bashing is easy, providing solutions to help people off benefits are not. Especially as many services have been scrapped, remember austerity

Edited

But it isn’t benefit bashing. People who are working are seeing less of their wages due to taxation. Cost of living is going up. Everyone is struggling. The difference in what people receive in benefits and what people in work receive net is not much. I can see where the resentment is coming from

DrivinginFrance · 17/03/2026 16:14

Badbadbunny · 17/03/2026 16:05

I think that ALL benefits should be means tested. There are far too many OAPs who don't "need" the state pension, but automatically get it. The means testing of the WFA was a good start - shame that Starmer took fright and u-turned on it. I don't care if people have paid NIC all their lives - it's just a tax, and a huge number of OAPs havn't paid much, if any NIC at all, and still get state pension due to unemployment credits, caring credits, credits due to part time work under the threshold etc. We just need to set the threshold for means testing at a relatively high level, such as the same £60k that workers suffer where they start to lose child benefit or £100k where workers lose the tax free personal allowance and free childcare.

You can't take away state pension from those who have sufficient working year NI contributions (I.e move the goalposts at the last minute). Especially if you continue to offer pension credit for those who never paid in.

Realistically you have to change the system for those starting out on their careers ( with the NI contribution diverted to their private pensions) .Although as another poster said Governments just kick the can down the road.

BIossomtoes · 17/03/2026 16:09

How many pensioners do you know on £60 or £100k? All you do with this spiteful nonsense is disincentivise people from making provision for their old age.

Badbadbunny · 17/03/2026 16:05

Yellowshirt · 17/03/2026 15:53

Exactly. And these pensioners who have not paid enough also got extremely cheap houses which they were able to pay off whilst still relatively young . They were then able to save for retirement.
So alot of these pensioners are in a win win situation and not struggling.

I think that ALL benefits should be means tested. There are far too many OAPs who don't "need" the state pension, but automatically get it. The means testing of the WFA was a good start - shame that Starmer took fright and u-turned on it. I don't care if people have paid NIC all their lives - it's just a tax, and a huge number of OAPs havn't paid much, if any NIC at all, and still get state pension due to unemployment credits, caring credits, credits due to part time work under the threshold etc. We just need to set the threshold for means testing at a relatively high level, such as the same £60k that workers suffer where they start to lose child benefit or £100k where workers lose the tax free personal allowance and free childcare.

BIossomtoes · 17/03/2026 16:03

Yellowshirt · 17/03/2026 15:56

I've not seen any improvement under labour for working class people.
I would slash benefits tomorrow and tell pensioners with savings to give something back either now or when they die.

Very sensible. Way to go to discourage people from saving for their old age and paying into pensions. Pensioners with savings lose them if they need care and you have heard of this thing called inheritance tax?

Swipe left for the next trending thread