NHS should be a co-pay system.

End of life is rarely nice, very few fall asleep and die. You can't blame the NHS for how horrible death is....the Liverpool path way was deemed barbaric also truth is other than putting you down it's rarely a quick thing

I have family members who use MN so I will not be detailing the family members trauma here but it was the very definition of barbaric. An A+E doctor has asked that this person go on palliative treatment because he had cared for her a lot previously as she had been in multiple times but he was over ruled by a consultant and one family member was never going to be on board with palliative care so very extreme measures were taken.

This patient was a 36kg adult less than half of her normal weight at this stage and they had multiple very long inpatient stays at the hospital. The A+E doctor was 100% correct she should have been put on palliative care at that point.

I don’t think I said that at all. I said that the PFI payments are covered by the income from the work it generates.

The NHS used to work has little to do with migrants.

The UK has and aging population of which migrants are generally younger and healthier.

Government policy failure

The increase in long term illnesses cancer, diabetes, dementia and other conditions that would traditionally have killed people.

A lack of personal responsibility, although pplicy hasn't helped

Misinformation and waste in the nhs.

.

You said the facilities could not have been provided without PFI. I don't believe that is correct and I explained why in my answer.

I think a significant part of the problem for social democracies is how older age cohorts are treated. Elderly people with multiple health conditions, no real quality of life possible and yet multiple inpatient stints are being treated and treated and treated.

I cannot put into words how barbaric a family member’s end of life was due to these policies and one single outlier family member who wanted the person kept alive at all costs.

But the wards she was on when she was an inpatient were filled with other patients in similar circumstances. It is brutal and barbaric but it is happening is hospitals everywhere.

The NHS used to work. It doesn't because of increased population caused by immigration. Immigrants need treatment and age. The indigenous population can take the roles. We have home trained medics who are desperately seeking work.

Individuals earning less than £35,000 are not net contributors, low wages caused by flooding the market with cheap labour. The main issue is those receiving a multitude of state benefits which is a massive drain on the economy.

In summary, stop immigration and reduce benefits. Return to a set up that worked.

100%

No it should not. Free at the point of use.Lets fight to defend that against these shadowy thread starters from god knows where.

Indeed. I've just checked. Our local health board has an official, registered charity that manages over 300 funds for equipment, research, treatment and patient care.

Health
1/3 behaviour
1/3 environment
1/3 genetics

At best people can influence a minority of their health outcomes. Much is down to luck.

Most hospitals have charitable fund. Pay aDD to your local one then.

??

I understand the importance of having a healthcare system like the NHS that supports everyone, especially those facing conditions they cannot control, such as cancer or certain disabilities. I struggle with the idea that people should contribute more purely because they earn more. In many cases, how healthy someone is as an able-bodied person can be influenced by personal choices and lifestyle. While not every condition is preventable, some healthcare costs diwn to individual responsibility. It seems reasonable to question whether contribution should be based on income, rather than also reflecting personal accountability. We have enough taxes which reward lack of personal responsibility whilst pubishing productivity.

This!
Am astonished at the number of people wi just ‘give up’ and some that from the age of 40 itbud an inevitable decline so funny bother bc with nutrition or exercise and csee it as ‘normal’ to have multiple hospital appointments.

More emphasis needs placed on people
taking more ownership for their health from childhood to the grave. The waste that is strangling the NHS should not only be considered from.the perspective of money being spent by the government or mismanaged resources.

@paolo2145 Could I ask where you got those stats for healthcare please? There are some surprising statistics there (to me!) Thanks.

This

In what way is it incorrect? The figures are there in the trust’s annual report every year.

Have you seen the numbers being treated for cancer in the UK, I think you'll find that the system is being overwhelmed. Cancer treatment often lasts years...if not a lifetime. Surgery, chemotherapy and then hormonal suppression drugs etc. ...you are never truly cured....in remission yes....cure is something doctors rarely use for cancer.

I don't think this is correct. The PFI deals are only an alternative way to borrow money rather than do it through the Treasury. Anything that was bought with PFI money could have been bought by raising National Debt but governments preferred not to do it that way at the time.

It still needs to be funded, the NHS is massively underfunded. I'm a higher rate tax payer but I can still recognise a system that offers exceptional value.

The innovation medicine term phrased relies in previous posts relies on being able to pay for it. Germany is a good example of this and one particular clinic offers state of the art kidney cancer treatment....the cost is 1.4 million euros per patient. No insurance scheme is going to fund that and in comparison the NHS is adopting it, albeit slowly, at no cost to the patient. In the real world which seems to be void from many posts, is it's the NHS that is a world leader in researching such treatments.

If people want better healthcare tell your MP you want to pay 30% tax like in France. The thing about British people is that that can't seem to relate how much healthcare actually costs and how much it costs them. If you are earning less than 35k you won't be contributing towards anything....you are a net burden to the state, if that's not an argument for tax increases to fund things then I'm lost. So if people want better healthcare changing the funding model will do nothing because the money isn't there to pay for it.

France doesn't have a better healthcare system than the UK and they pay huge amounts in tax to fund it. They don't have the same cancer care provision...no where near.

And yet they have some of the best survival rates in Europe, quite a lot better than the UK.