Importance of Gorton and Denton

The big picture is the collapse of the old parties, Conservatives and Labour, along with the "centre" of British politics. Voters in both parties, appalled by the dismal efforts to provide a better economic future, have abandoned the mainstream parties, and are seeking change that will improve their lives.

Reform promises to make Britain Great again by stopping immigration, reducing taxes, reducing public services, and hoping that will result in the growth of jobs and opportunities. They propose to cut workers' rights and protections, and make Britain a place where billionaires and multinationals will want to invest in.

Greens promise to make Britain Great again by taxing billionaires and multinational companies, and investing in the economy to create jobs, housing and opportunities for the ordinary people.

The economic arguments for both approaches are debatable. Each has positives and negatives. So it comes down to an emotional, rather than an intellectual decision. What sort of country do you want for you and your children?

A country built for the benefit of the super rich, with ever increasing levels of obscene wealth and obscene poverty dividing the country? Or a country built for the benefit of it's citizens, with ever increasing levels of equality and social justice uniting the country?

So the importance of Gorton and Denton, to answer the original poster, is that it's the first insight into which way the voters of this country might lean. Which has been obscured by smoke about the particulars of whether Labour may or may not have won if, but, blah, blah blah....

The old centre parties that have held British politics in a stranglehold for a century are dying, and a new politics is being born. In front of our eyes. Reform and the Greens may be irrelevant in ten or twenty years; everything is changing so fast. Whether it's the Brave New World, or the last nail in the coffin, is a purely personal political viewpoint.

There’s only Radcliffe in Bury that could be described as an ‘extremely poor area’ and I’m not sure about the ‘extremely’ bit. Gordon is extremely deprived and makes Radcliffe look like Kingsbridge in comparison.

I had not realised that there was such poverty in Gorton & Denton . According to The Sunday Times it is the 15 most deprived constituency in England & Wales. I have never ben there, I did go to Bury once and thought it an extremely poor area. Anyone care to comment.

The post below from @1dayatatimere Greece was referring to the Greens.

If they overtake Labour I guess we’ll see how viable.

lol - the worst people ‘on the left’ have b moved into a party that was meant to be about the environment and is now very much not.
they are the useful idiots to be used by the media to kick Starmer. Their day will come - and I’ve got the popcorn waiting to see how the manage a coalition between a gay Jewish leader and a man whose wife cannot show their face publicly…

Not really. Over the past year or so I have seen endless posts telling us that the UK is on the brink of an IMF bailout because of the current government. Hence the eyerolling.

And although I do not want the Greens to have an absolute majority, I would prefer them to Reform any day of the week if those are the only available options.

Those posts are talking about the Greens getting in aren’t they

Brilliant! Have loved the last few posts!

Yup. About as engaging and tasty as the endless scaremongering about how we are just like Greece because of our far left government. I've stopped rolling my eyes at those posters for fear they will fall right out of my head.

The ones that break your teeth?

I was thinking more those silver and gold sugar balls that taste like nothing.

I guess you'll need hundreds and thousands ?

I didn't know they were coming, perhaps I should bake?

Well with the IMF due in next week to take possession of the Crown Jewels and keys, maybe they are trying to prevent panic ?

Absolutely as shown in Greece.

Strange they want more interest now and there's not a peep from the media.

My (and Gemini's 😎) memory is the bond market really started asking for a lot more interest from gilts and the BoE was starting to respond

Not really, Truss was undone by the Treasury, the Bank of England and her own mp's who wanted her out. The bond market or global credit market is where the government gets its credit from.

Like they did to Liz Truss ? The Blob and all that.

Possibly, until until the bond market pull up the drawbridge and says no more to the govt. Which could be sooner than you think

But if you are not currently paying any tax then voting Green gets you a load of free stuff paid for by other people?

Nice snip of info regurgitated from AI there. But I won't be voting for a party that will lead to me having pay massively higher taxes, increase my council tax, cease fossil fuel production making cost of living go up massively.

They will probably abolish inheritance tax as well as part of their great redistribution agenda, so what ever money comes from the sale of my house upon my death would be taken by the state leaving nothing for my children, along with anything else I manage to save (and no I’m not rich by the way).

They’ve also stated they have a long term, ambition for there to be no borders and want to get rid of our nuclear deterrent. 1. Where are all the houses going to come from? I guess the massive tax increases they would impose on households would make daily life unaffordable leaving them with no option to sell up and move into a shoe box instead. 2. How would we keep people safe and stop country’s like Russia from invading us if we had open borders and got rid of the nuclear deterrent.

And dont get me started on their reparations proposal. Why should my children and generations to come pay higher taxes to fund reparations for a slave trade they played absolutely no part in? Payments to people who weren’t even alive during the slave trade?

So no, you haven’t convinced me to vote ‘Green’. They are nothing more than a protest party and will fuel sectarianism and make life a lot harder for the vast majority of British people. Thankfully I think a lot of people feel the same way as I do.

Wealth taxes have been tried in many countries. They fail everywhere as the rich just move elsewhere and the burden falls on the middle earners.

Britain is taxed up to it's eyeballs, is on the brink of bankruptcy and the productive sector of the country is either moving abroad or retiring. Due to net zero bollox our few remaining heavy industries are either closing or relocating.

A green party in government would be the death knell of this country.

On the contrary - the Green Party policies would improve the lives of working people starting with higher pay and much stronger working rights. Minimum wage would be raised to £15 an hour for all ages, zero-hours contracts would end and workers would be given full employment rights including sick pay and holiday pay, from day one.

The Greens also back getting rid of anti-union laws and introducing a four-day working week without loss of pay which would improve work-life balance and reduce stress for many. Productivity actually increases and there is I independent research in this area proving this.

https://theabp.org.uk/what-the-evidence-tells-us-about-the-four-day-working-week/

They also propose increasing Universal Credit and other benefits, scrapping the two-child benefit cap and bedroom tax, and moving toward a Universal Basic Income in the longer term. These measures would provide a stronger safety net, reduce poverty, and give workers more financial security during periods of unemployment, illness or retraining.

For housing and energy costs, the Greens support large-scale investment in social housing and would give councils stronger rent controls to make housing more affordable. It also proposes a nationwide home insulation and solar installation programme to cut energy bills, which would particularly benefit low (and also middle-income households) while also reducing carbon emissions.

They want major public investment into renewable energy, public transport and green infrastructure to create secure, skilled, long term jobs across the country. Plus expanded training and education funding so workers can access new opportunities created by the transition to a low-carbon economy.

To fund these policies, the Greens propose wealth tax reforms and aligning capital gains tax with income tax rates. They also would like to see the development of a Land Value Tax which would be a fairer system than the current Council Tax where someone in Yorkshire is paying more for a 2 bedroomed terrace than a mansion in London.

Their overall goal is to reduce inequality while improving wages, job security, public services and living standards for working people across the UK.

I do wonder if the people who say they will vote for them have actually read any of their policies or if they are just voting Green for tactical reasons.

Or possibly have read the policies and decided that it's better not to let perfection be the enemy of progress ?

Bearing in mind the vast majority of voters just tick the box with their clubs logo in it (and make a proud point of the fact).