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Politics

“Tax the wealthy” (RR budget) what does this even mean?

639 replies

gggddjkki · 16/10/2025 08:32

I don’t remember anxiously waiting for budgets like we have the last few years earlier on in my adulthood. But when you read statements like this (as I have seen in the headlines today) what do you interpret it to mean? What does taxing the wealthy look like to you? Taxing higher earners more? From what point? Higher taxes on industry?

OP posts:
PlanetMa · 20/10/2025 14:21

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PlanetMa · 20/10/2025 14:17

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I also didn’t say I “know” Kemi Badenoch. I said I’ve had the misfortune of having met her and had conversations with her a several times in a business capacity. This was actually before she was the leader of the Conservatives because she’s now fairly irrelevant as leader of the opposition. It was when she was the Minister for DBT when she - supposedly - had some power to do something useful.

PlanetMa · 20/10/2025 14:12

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You are the only one who thinks other people’s professions are relevant to the discussion. You brought this up. You have then persistently made weird conjectures I have a job that I don’t have because you refuse to accept that your fantasies are wrong and you have continued incessantly trying to derail the thread.

You’re the only person who thinks that your weird obsession with teachers is pertinent or that your weird obsession with me is pertinent. You’ve added nothing of worth to the discussions about economics and fiscal policy.

Either ask MNHQ to verify to you that I’m not a teacher and I’ll give them permission to confirm this to you, or focus your energy on addressing your mental health issues.

PlanetMa · 20/10/2025 14:05

EasternStandard · 19/10/2025 18:48

Yep. And then £70bn tax and borrowing hike at first opportunity.

Yes, also shocking. In one of my very first posts on the thread I set out quotes of all of Reeves’ pre-election pledges. She is an absolute joke. She even specifically admitted that the state of the public finances was known before the election (blowing her claim afterwards that there was an unknown “black hole” out of the water) and that messing around with tax rates won’t create growth. I’ve copied and pasted them again here:

Labour's manifesto is, "fully funded and fully costed - no ifs, no ands, no buts… no additional tax rises."

"I have been very clear that every policy we announce, and every line in our manifesto, will be fully costed and fully funded."

“Nothing in our plans requires any additional tax to be increased.”

“We’ve got the Office for Budget Responsibility now… You don’t need to win an election to find out [about the public finances].”

“I don’t believe that fiddling around with tax rates is the best way to grow the economy.”

However, this doesn’t mean it’s a good idea to elect people whose stated policies involve another £130bn per year of borrowing on top of the damage she’s done (and that’s before we even account for bond market reaction, rising interest on the public debt and behavioural impacts which will make that figure orders of magnitude higher in reality).

PlanetMa · 20/10/2025 14:00

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PlanetMa · 20/10/2025 13:56

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For the love of God: troll hunting is prohibited in the Talk Guidelines.

I have not reported any of your posts because I think your insanity should be left to stand for all to see, but given the extent to which your persistence with this nonsense is derailing the thread now you need to either:

  1. Contact MNHQ and as I said several pages ago I’m happy for them to release the information to you that they can verify I AM NOT A TEACHER because they know my identity and you do not; or

  2. If you don’t wish to actually obtain the information verifying that your weird and obsessive posts are absolute nonsense, then keep your weirdness to yourself, stop breaking the Talk Guidelines and stop derailing the thread.

HailCeaser · 20/10/2025 10:26

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Leavesfalling · 20/10/2025 09:36

PeonyPatch · 20/10/2025 09:30

Also, why does it matter?!

Maybe there's a difference between an A level economics teacher and an economist at the Bank of England (ahem). Although it obviously doesnt matter as we aren't deciding UK fiscal policy here on MN.

PeonyPatch · 20/10/2025 09:30

Leavesfalling · 20/10/2025 09:28

Out of interest why do you think she's a teacher? Apologies if I missed that as her posts are very long.

Also, why does it matter?!

Leavesfalling · 20/10/2025 09:28

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Out of interest why do you think she's a teacher? Apologies if I missed that as her posts are very long.

BIossomtoes · 20/10/2025 09:21

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Why do you keep on about it then? You started it, for the love of God let it drop.

HailCeaser · 20/10/2025 07:28

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NorthXNorthWest · 20/10/2025 00:06

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For the love of god! You may think that poster is doing a poor job of hiding that they are a teacher. You are doing a poor job of showing that you don't need a restraining order.

EmpressoftheMundane · 19/10/2025 21:36

Does anyone think any of this will work?

https://archive.ph/HNKkG

HailCeaser · 19/10/2025 21:00

Leavesfalling · 19/10/2025 20:54

Ah OK. Thank you for clarifying. My understanding was that this policy once implemented won't be reversed as it will be too disruptive for the markets. So we are stuck with those APR/BPR limits. I'm in the legal sector not economics (so don't have your understanding) and so continuity is the thing I'm looking for re planning. Bit of a shame though.

No we’re not stuck with them, why would it affect the Gilt market to any meaningful degree?

Leavesfalling · 19/10/2025 20:54

Nolletimiere · 19/10/2025 19:42

Thanks - the confusion lies in the distinction between UK sovereign bonds (gilts), and corpororate bonds.

The former is relevant given the forthcoming budget, of course.

Ah OK. Thank you for clarifying. My understanding was that this policy once implemented won't be reversed as it will be too disruptive for the markets. So we are stuck with those APR/BPR limits. I'm in the legal sector not economics (so don't have your understanding) and so continuity is the thing I'm looking for re planning. Bit of a shame though.

Leavesfalling · 19/10/2025 20:49

PlanetMa · 19/10/2025 19:21

That’s fine - unlike my posts about the economy that post that seems to have riled up particular posters (who notably haven’t engaged with the economic discussion at all, despite it being the subject of the thread) was clearly an opinion. It was clear in the original context that it was (given that it was a response to another poster asking my opinion about the motivations) and I had also specifically stated that Reform supporters are millions of people, I am not one of them and am not a mind reader, so all I could write was the reasons that I am aware of based on research on the topic and the stated opinions of Reform supporters who have stated them either publicly in the media or to me in person.

I also specifically stated that I’d be interested to hear from others who are supporting them/ considering supporting them about their reasons for doing so and how they think that this will impact the UK’s economy, fiscal position, and therefore the living standards of its residents (given that this is a thread about fiscal policy and its effect on the economy) because I wanted to understand their reasoning. Sadly, the only responses received were a series of personal attacks and then some very bizarre comments from somebody deranged and in need of medical help due to a strange obsession with teachers. Furthermore, I noted that I’m autistic so use language bluntly and said sorry if I had caused offence as this was not intended; I was simply answering that particular question I was asked which was about my opinion on motivations. I’m not a psychologist, however, so not my area of expertise to give anything more than an opinion. I am interested in the economics and evidence and data, and it seems that me having given an opinion in ONE POST which was specifically asked for and therefore clearly was not presented as fact but personal opinion has been used by certain people to try to derail the thread and prevent any factual discussion about the economics, which those same posters haven’t engaged with in any meaningful way at all. Quelle surprise….

I have read so many comments on various forums/ newspaper column sections online stating that “nobody understands Reform supporters” and “nobody will listen to their point of view”. Yet the outrage if someone else states a point of view even when asked to do so has taken up multiple pages of the thread. And if you ask for their reasoned analysis of how they think Farage’s policies will improve the fiscal situation/ economy etc (which presumably anybody on this thread is interested in, given that is the subject of it!) so that you can try to understand their point of view you get met with a barrage of personal insults and no substantive response at all. It’s difficult for others to fathom why Reform’s supporters believe that the party’s stated fiscal policies will be an improvement when not a single credible economist agrees and not one Reform supporter on this thread has been able to articulate and argument to support that their policies would be beneficial to the economy.

Instead, these posters continue to claim to be “misunderstood”, like sulky teenagers, so I have to admit that I am now inclined to think that their “nobody will listen to us” retort is disingenuous because the ones who have posted here haven’t been able to articulate any analysis of why Reform’ stated policies would have any positive economic impact and have refused to discuss this at all - even on a thread that is specifically about the fiscal impact of Government policy!

Instead we get “are you a teacher?” X 10 or whatever other nonsense. And false claims from the very people who’ve made lots of nasty personal comments that others are “insulting” them personally by discussing general economic or voting trends and what the motivations for those might be, in general terms without referring at all to any specific poster.

The cognitive dissonance appears to be the size of Mount Everest. How do these posters know the motivations of millions of other Reform posters and know that my list was wrong (note again - I didn’t say that even in my opinion this was an exhaustive list of motivations, just some of those I have noted). Once you decide to support Reform do you get access to some kind of Hive Mind where you can read the minds of all other Reform supporters and know why they are supporting Reform and, therefore, that all of the reasons that I listed as reasons why some people are supporting them are incorrect?

Edited

But I did outline how Reform might benefit the economy (and I'm not even a Reform voter yet). You just didn't agree with the answer. And that's fine.

I don't discriminate against people with autism. If you can dish it out, you can take it.

HailCeaser · 19/10/2025 20:46

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HailCeaser · 19/10/2025 20:25

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Nolletimiere · 19/10/2025 20:23

BIossomtoes · 19/10/2025 20:12

Yes, what are these ‘stated programme of policies’ that lead to a 90bn deficit?

It’s the cost of Reform’s stated plans at the last election. Actually I’m surprised it’s as little as £90 billion given their bright idea of front line healthcare staff being exempt from income tax if they earned less than £50k. Bonkers.

Edited

If Labour’s manifesto is the new benchmark, then Reform clearly do not have a monopoly on fanciful economic policy.

‘We have fully costed, fully funded plans,” Labour told the country during the election campaign. “Nothing in our plans requires any additional tax to be increased.” Ramming home that message, Rachel Reeves promised every Labour policy was “fully funded and fully costed – no ifs, no ands, no buts … no additional tax rises”.

Labour lied to secure power - Sunak called it.

PlanetMa · 19/10/2025 20:22

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This is now funny and disturbing in equal measures. What’s is it now, 11 times that you’ve posted this nonsense?

It seems apparent that whomever your teachers were, they failed you pretty badly for you to have this strange obsession about them that you project and such terrible reading comprehension. I’ll try once more to help you in the simplest language that I can muster to help you with your struggles:

I am not a teacher, nor have I ever been a teacher.

I genuinely think you need to seek some psychological support.

PlanetMa · 19/10/2025 20:16

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The policies that they published on their own website as their “manifesto” - I believe they called it some kind of “contract with the British people” or something ridiculous like that, so pompous - which they have not retracted plus the public media announcements of further policies since the general election.

Multiple independent economic studies have been done of the economic impact that their policies would have on the UK public finances. None of the conclusions were good. All of them from any credible source have concluded that these policies are pie in the sky nonsense reliant on the unicorns leading us to a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow and in any other circumstances are unimplementable fantasy with no credibility whatsoever. 🦄

HailCeaser · 19/10/2025 20:15

BIossomtoes · 19/10/2025 20:12

Yes, what are these ‘stated programme of policies’ that lead to a 90bn deficit?

It’s the cost of Reform’s stated plans at the last election. Actually I’m surprised it’s as little as £90 billion given their bright idea of front line healthcare staff being exempt from income tax if they earned less than £50k. Bonkers.

Edited

Which policies are those specifically? what are their stated policies for the next election? You know the election where they are actually odds on favourites to form the next Government.

EasternStandard · 19/10/2025 20:13

PlanetMa · 19/10/2025 19:21

That’s fine - unlike my posts about the economy that post that seems to have riled up particular posters (who notably haven’t engaged with the economic discussion at all, despite it being the subject of the thread) was clearly an opinion. It was clear in the original context that it was (given that it was a response to another poster asking my opinion about the motivations) and I had also specifically stated that Reform supporters are millions of people, I am not one of them and am not a mind reader, so all I could write was the reasons that I am aware of based on research on the topic and the stated opinions of Reform supporters who have stated them either publicly in the media or to me in person.

I also specifically stated that I’d be interested to hear from others who are supporting them/ considering supporting them about their reasons for doing so and how they think that this will impact the UK’s economy, fiscal position, and therefore the living standards of its residents (given that this is a thread about fiscal policy and its effect on the economy) because I wanted to understand their reasoning. Sadly, the only responses received were a series of personal attacks and then some very bizarre comments from somebody deranged and in need of medical help due to a strange obsession with teachers. Furthermore, I noted that I’m autistic so use language bluntly and said sorry if I had caused offence as this was not intended; I was simply answering that particular question I was asked which was about my opinion on motivations. I’m not a psychologist, however, so not my area of expertise to give anything more than an opinion. I am interested in the economics and evidence and data, and it seems that me having given an opinion in ONE POST which was specifically asked for and therefore clearly was not presented as fact but personal opinion has been used by certain people to try to derail the thread and prevent any factual discussion about the economics, which those same posters haven’t engaged with in any meaningful way at all. Quelle surprise….

I have read so many comments on various forums/ newspaper column sections online stating that “nobody understands Reform supporters” and “nobody will listen to their point of view”. Yet the outrage if someone else states a point of view even when asked to do so has taken up multiple pages of the thread. And if you ask for their reasoned analysis of how they think Farage’s policies will improve the fiscal situation/ economy etc (which presumably anybody on this thread is interested in, given that is the subject of it!) so that you can try to understand their point of view you get met with a barrage of personal insults and no substantive response at all. It’s difficult for others to fathom why Reform’s supporters believe that the party’s stated fiscal policies will be an improvement when not a single credible economist agrees and not one Reform supporter on this thread has been able to articulate and argument to support that their policies would be beneficial to the economy.

Instead, these posters continue to claim to be “misunderstood”, like sulky teenagers, so I have to admit that I am now inclined to think that their “nobody will listen to us” retort is disingenuous because the ones who have posted here haven’t been able to articulate any analysis of why Reform’ stated policies would have any positive economic impact and have refused to discuss this at all - even on a thread that is specifically about the fiscal impact of Government policy!

Instead we get “are you a teacher?” X 10 or whatever other nonsense. And false claims from the very people who’ve made lots of nasty personal comments that others are “insulting” them personally by discussing general economic or voting trends and what the motivations for those might be, in general terms without referring at all to any specific poster.

The cognitive dissonance appears to be the size of Mount Everest. How do these posters know the motivations of millions of other Reform posters and know that my list was wrong (note again - I didn’t say that even in my opinion this was an exhaustive list of motivations, just some of those I have noted). Once you decide to support Reform do you get access to some kind of Hive Mind where you can read the minds of all other Reform supporters and know why they are supporting Reform and, therefore, that all of the reasons that I listed as reasons why some people are supporting them are incorrect?

Edited

I do find posts underpinned by economics interesting and they’re not often posted on here, however politics also addresses some other major pressures and atm we’re seeing many western countries deal with immigration primarily.

I also don’t think it’s worthwhile talking about stupidity etc because it doesn’t help, but also I don’t believe educated to a certain level means much. Institutions can reinforce the status quo and it might not be the right thing.

BIossomtoes · 19/10/2025 20:12

Yes, what are these ‘stated programme of policies’ that lead to a 90bn deficit?

It’s the cost of Reform’s stated plans at the last election. Actually I’m surprised it’s as little as £90 billion given their bright idea of front line healthcare staff being exempt from income tax if they earned less than £50k. Bonkers.

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