Reform plans to scrap indefinite leave to remain for migrants

Yes you will get your pension even if you leave the country. Unless you came here in the Boris Wave.

I see. So you believe that one of your parents being deported would have improved your life. Do you not like your parent much? Many immigrants come from brilliant countries but - unlike you it seems - quite like living in the same country as their spouses and children and don’t particularly want to be dragged out of their homes and put on a flight back to a country that they no longer live in, however brilliant it is.

Presumably your parent didn’t want to move back to their country of origin otherwise they’d have done so, so even if you’d have welcomed them being dragged out of the family home by immigration police I can’t imagine they’d have enjoyed the experience.

I want to know what happens to my pension. I have worked more years in the UK than in my home country, so I fully expect to get my UK pension once I’m ‘deported’. I contributed to the system and there is no way in hell I’m going to be without a pension. That’s the equivalent of theft as far as I’m concerned. I’m sure there are many other ILRs who are thinking this as well. My husband is English and has worked since the age of 16. However, instead of us spending our pensions in the UK, we will be spending in my home country.

What do they expect people to do once they get to a certain age? Keep renewing these visas which will probably cost £££ until they die? I have zero desire to be British. I have a nationality. We paid for me to come here, I followed the rules, worked, paid taxes, never claimed benefits - not even child benefits. I think the only thing I ever got was the £500 Labour gave newborns and free school dinners for a couple of years but I supposed I paid for that through my taxes. I feel like the 20 years I have contributed to the UK no longer matters because ‘I’m a foreigner’. It’s an absolute horrible feeling.

The point is that the net taker versus net contributor narrative is an old political trick which starts on foreigners but also gets extended to more vulnerable groups. The idea of welfare reform and disability was also raised. These are usually entry points for cuts.

The point about a pensioner with ILR being subject to this policy is not about being a foreigner. It will be framed as to whether you contributed. I do not think Farage will stop at “British get benefits”. It will be “British who contributed” get some benefits.

Hahaaa of course, it someone else’s problem to provide the data to show that Farage’s policies stack up on costs and economics! Can’t expect him to have used the copious data that’s published regularly by all Government departments, the OBR and in numerous other economic studies to actually come up with policies that aren’t based purely on his hubris after an evening in the boozer. You’re being so unfair! Or something.

Most people on benefits, including migrants are on top up benefits due to low wages and claiming the housing element of UC due to high rents.

Most people on benefits are in work.

Definitely! My parent comes from a brilliant country.

If your immigrant parent had happened to have a temporary period of unemployment around the time of the 5 year visa renewal - that Mr Farage has stated he would impose on all of those without UK citizenship - and had, therefore, been deported do you think this would have improved your childhood?

Foreign pensioners are a drop in the bucket. I mean British pensioners - they are a by far the biggest draw on the public purse, and biggest users of the NHS.

You lost me now.

Farage made the claim, so he must have the sources for that. Where is he basing his assumptions on?

Not just that, but the cost benefit analysis is missing about how much it would cost the UK to have people living here who cant be supported to live a stable, engaged, educated life. No proper recourse means social isolation, worse physical and MH, higher crime, homelessness, lack of education stability for the children (due to moving around a lot) so worse outcomes for children who are very likely to remain in the UK and need to contribute to the work force. Where i sthe investment in the UK to come from, from those people if they're having to think very short term.

I suppose Reform voters would answer that by saying they shouldnt be here anyway

I also suppose the people they are talking about are asylum seekers rather than a teacher relocating from France or Australia.

I think the government needs to be honest about the numbers. The figures will either support Reform's argument or not. And then we can all form a view based on facts.

Farage is not talking about asylum seekers this time

Indeed. He stated explicitly that only UK citizens should receive a state pension. So someone who has lived here throughout their working life but was born elsewhere and paid just as much tax as an average UK citizen (and actually cost the state less if some of their education was funded abroad!) will receive no state pension because of their nationality per Farage’s policies. Pure xenophobia.

I thought that was a great question and I'm pleased it was asked twice as they definitely dodged it the first time it was asked!

Look it up where?

I posted the CBS post about their numbers being wrong earlier in this thread

That isn’t what Mr Farage is advocating for and is not what his stated policy will do.

Which type of migrant are you talking about here though?

Because if you claim asylum and are given Irefugee status then you can claim benefits from then on, your ILR coming later on. Not all refugee claims take a long time, some are fairly fast (well for the HO)

Well pensioners with ILR were directly questioned today as to why they get pensions! Farage said that

Do you think he’s going to go after pensioners next?

That's the figures that have been called into question. The government won't release them. Farage gave a figure which he thinks is actually a lot lower than the real figure. You might prefer to look it up. In any event those people are the ones he's presumably targeting.

As with all systems that have been abused, the baby may be thrown out with the bathwater. But that's the position Blair and Boris have put us all in.

The insinuation today was that ALL legal immigrants are here on benefits, which is nonsense. Farage is a lying lier who lies.

But the country is on the brink of bankruptcy
If that was true, Farage's nasty proposals ain't gonna rescue us. He reckons it would save £234bn over several decades. Plus of course he would have to secure a working majority in Parliament.

I thought it was clever. It frames whole group of people as takers from the state and then says to receive benefits you need to contribute. Apparently this logic is only confined to those with ILR right now. For now. I wonder who else will be a taker or a contributor post the election? There were some clear signs

But just because they can claim benefits doesn't mean they will

How many are solely relying on benefits and why?