Reform plans to scrap indefinite leave to remain for migrants

There are posters continuing to defend this policy. It beggars belief. I guess they think Farage's net of hate won't ever touch them or the people they care about.

Depends. If people have fallen on hard economic times and they're no longer entitled to any state help, where are they even going to find the money for airfares and relocation costs?

He also made it clear in his comments that his policies were to protect “working British families” only and said he will make “huge welfare cuts” which would obviously exceed cutting 2.7% of universal credit currently paid to those he intends to deport. Added together with his defence of Trump’s attack on autistic people it’s clear that he will be targeting anybody vulnerable, poor or disabled and being a British citizen won’t save you. These are just the policies that he believes are mild enough - despite their already extreme nature - to be explicit about long in advance of the next general election.

What these sociopaths would do if ever elected doesn’t bear thinking about. They really couldn’t make their intentions much clearer and anybody who thinks they are safe because they are a British citizen is deluded. Farage openly and sycophantically emulates Trump so unless you and all of your family members are wealthy, white, male, heterosexual, and in perfect health, voting for Reform would be insanity.

Surely law abiding people will leave when they no longer have the legal basis to stay. Some posts are a bit fantastic. Most people follow legal requirements.

These are the repressive fantasies of extremely right wing people. Can you imagine the hatred and violence that would go with them once there were this class of people who, given that Reform would have left the ECHR, were totally dependent on authority? Imagine the people who would want to work there.

The only good thing about what Farage said yesterday is that it is really obvious now what kind of policies he wants and you can’t pretend otherwise. There has been this kind of ridiculous pretence that this is all about asylum.

The real policy is anyone with ILR, it’s abolition as a status for everyone. Be a citizen or a guest worker. As for “settled status” it doesn’t take a genius to realise that having this status which is ILR legally would be nibbled down incrementally such that you could remain, but your access to public services would be greatly cut.

But as I understand it, Farage is firstly concerned with India, Pakistan and Afghanistan, so it will be a while before he gets around to to that.

And he can’t change the rules of EU immigrants anyway because of the exit treaty implementing his beloved Brexit. Hahahaaaa. However, he was too incompetent and thick to realise this before making his announcement yesterday and it had to be pointed out to him by journalists.

According to the ONS - 1.4% of small shops are foreign owned. I don’t understand the relevance of ‘foreign ancestry’ . In the context of this thread - it is about whether you have British citizenship or not.

I’m no supporter of Reform. But whipping up statistics is scaremongering - on either side of the debate.

So where is the economic analysis showing the percentage of these that are forecast to become claimants, the total cost of this, the total cost of implementing his proposed policies, and the overall economic impact including the skills shortages that will be caused suppressing tax revenues and growth?

Why is the decision to remove indefinite leave to remain as a status entirely, even retrospectively from those who have been here for decades, not just make changes going forwards?

If the concern is access to benefits why not uncouple ILR status from entitlement to welfare and state services and simply make these entitlements contributory as they are in pretty much every other developed country, so they are based on UK tax revenues paid by the individual rather than nationality?

Why remove pensions from long-term UK residents who are foreign citizens and who’ve met the contribution criteria over decades of work here?

Answer: it has nothing to do with economics or contributing to society and is solely an excuse for him to pander to disgusting xenophobia.

Over and over again it has been proven EU workers pay more tax that actually boring born so their contribution is big and even if a percentage received state welfare they more than pay for that . I can’t believe there are idiots if this thread actually defending removing people from ho have lived here for decades . My oldest was born over 20 years here is here under the settlement scheme , he is severely disabled . I’m assuming you all think he should be send home depute home being the U.K. as he never lived elsewhere or has family elsewhere .

But, while switching from Indefinite Leave to Remain is costly, there is no proposed requirement to have a minimum income threshold to get citizenship.

Sorry tagged the wrong post, I was replying to the above poster.

Yes. Indefinite leave to remain would cease to exist as a status so any of the Windrush now-pensioners who have not become British citizens would be forced to reapply for a new visa every 5 years until they die. If their income ever drops below the threshold he sets - which Reform have stated they are planning to set at £60k per annum - they’ll be deported (so presumably these people will never be able to retire if they want to avoid deportation).

Oh, and he said they will no longer receive state pensions either, regardless of having worked and paid taxes in the UK for decades, because only UK citizens will receive a state pension. And if they become confused in old age and can’t speak coherently enough to pass the language test for the 5 yearly visa renewal the immigration officers will come to drag them out of their homes/ care homes to be deported.

Windrush people had leave to remain. Granted in the sixties to those already here when we slammed the door on new arrivals.

Does Fartage intend to undermine their position?

Exactly. The sole purpose of this is to throw some meat to the xenophobic flag-wavers.

It’s undeniable that the policies he has proposed to date would cause an economic disaster of epic proportions if ever implemented so the motives of those continuing to support/ defend him are very transparent, and we all know that they have nothing whatsoever to do with economics.

I don't think he cares about the workability of the policy though, or whether it would actually result in significant savings for the Treasury. That isn't what this "policy" is about.

Farage knows that the people who vote for him aren't generally the types to engage with the detail or care about facts. The purpose of this "policy" is simply to ramp up the rhetoric about immigration, to promote the idea that immigrants are all just coming to the UK to claim benefits and to underline Reform's reputation as the party that will get rid of as many migrants' rights as possible in favour of "the British people". Oh, and talking repeatedly about the Boris wave will help to keep Mr Johnson in his box, safely out of Farage's way.

Farage knows that he doesn't need to be competent. As long as he keeps whipping up hate, his supporters will vote for him anyway.

He is already coming for workers rights and human rights

Yes exactly. People are foolish if they think he won't come for things like women's rights and abortion. I'm in a same-sex marriage with a baby with my wife, and it was only last week he said only children from hetero partners grow up in a stable environment. He's an absolute racist, bigoted prick.

2.7% of universal credit claimants are non-EU migrants (long-term EU immigrants are protected from Farage’s deportation plan by the Brexit agreement, which he hadn’t realised before he made his announcement: what a clown), and the majority of those are working.

So the answer is: it will save an insignificant amount of money and make very little difference at all to the national finances. It will also cost a great deal to implement and therefore likely end up costing more than the rounding error in universal credit that it saves. And will cause a further acceleration of economic decline and service failure due to skills shortages, so likely to be an overall significant net cost of some proportions.

Surely Farage should have done some basic research and provided an economic impact assessment to demonstrate the validity of his policy and support his made up figures he spouted in his announcement, if he was competent? It would be reasonable to expect also that he was at least vaguely aware of how the immigration rules which are in place currently work, and the conditions of the EU exit treaty that is in place as a result of the Brexit for which he campaigned?

How embarrassing to have displayed (yet again) his incompetence and ignorance in such a public manner.

Ps just checked and I think the fee is apx £3k annually, slightly more for high school

I don't agree with retrospective changes but I'd be pleased if any govt (ideally not reform...) really bloody overhauled migration rules in the UK.

I'd really like to see a system more like Australia with skills lists. Where people need to be sponsored by employers - no job, no visa. an in demand nurse only needs to earn £X through his/her sponsoring employer but a [insert random office job title] who we don't really need more of nerds to earn 1.5x £x.

And no bringing your whole family. Spouse / de facto and kids / step kids only, and only on the provisio that you all have private health insurance and no recourse to benefits until you qualify for ILR.

In Australia you can send your kids to local state schools before you get ILR but you pay (obvs not the true cost per child but a few thousand). I think that's fair.

My hope is that moving the goalposts for those already legally in the country will be unpalatable for most voters, and Farage will lose because his policies are too extreme.

Exactly!

He instigated Brexit and the ensuing xenophobia which meant that the UK became a far less attractive place for highly-skilled immigrants. Numerous economic studies over many years showed that EU immigrants were, on average, net contributors - paying more tax than the average UK citizen, using public services and social housing less, claiming fewer benefits, setting up more businesses creating jobs for others and increasing economic growth, and committing less crime. They generally moved here after completing education and most left before becoming elderly and a burden on the state so a fantastic bonus for the UK and a boost to our tax revenues and growth.

Now, instead, we have to plug gaps in our economy with, on average, less qualified immigrants from countries with lower educational standards, who bring more dependents with them and intend to settle permanently and will therefore become a burden on the state in old age. The non-EU immigrants on average - just as was the case before Brexit - are not net contributors to the UK economy over the period they remain in the country, and use public services more intensively that the average UK resident.

Slow hand clap.

How anybody could look to the idiot who had a large hand in creating this problem to fix it is beyond me. Brexit has also suppressed economic growth and productivity and therefore lowered real-terms salaries so made the UK very unattractive as a destination for highly skilled immigrants from developed countries. Farage’s “economic policies” (and, indeed this immigration policy) would accelerate this economic decline making it even more difficult to attract the highly qualified net-contributor immigrants that we need, especially with an added dose of xenophobia. Why would they want to move here when they can earn more and get a higher quality of life in numerous other countries and not be subjected to racism that makes it very clear they won’t be welcomed? We can’t even stop the exodus of our own highly qualified young people who are seeking a better life abroad let alone attract significant numbers of those from other developed countries.

Indeed. And defended Trump and his anti-vaxxer friend when asked if he supported Trump’s claim that autism is caused by paracetamol.

One wonders whether he’ll be advocating next for vulnerable people to skip their Covid vaccines and inject bleach instead. Equally medically valid as the paracetamol/ autism claim.

The man is a disgrace.

Bizarre isn’t it?

It will be people with mental health problems and children with SEN next.

He has already attacked them a few months back.