Any American Mumsnetters around?

Thank you.

I'll read it again, later. It's tipped me over the edge and I'm crying about it. It's tea-time in England and I'm going to put the car away. I might have to give up Mumsnet for Lent.

JFK in 1961

You have a point but European nations also value integrity. The US committed, along with the UK and France to defending Ukraine should Russia ever attack it. It was not to be expected to give anything at the time of the attack. However, it had to give up its best chance to defend itself for this guarantee. It had the 3rd biggest nuclear arsenal in the world - you really think Russia would have attacked if it still had that? The US, just like the UK and France, has a duty to defend Ukraine fully.

Who said this and when?

...
The world is very different now. For man holds in his mortal hands the power to abolish all forms of human poverty and all forms of human life. And yet the same revolutionary beliefs for which our forebears fought are still at issue around the globe--the belief that the rights of man come not from the generosity of the state but from the hand of God.

We dare not forget today that we are the heirs of that first revolution. Let the word go forth from this time and place, to friend and foe alike, that the torch has been passed to a new generation of Americansborn in this century, tempered by war, disciplined by a hard and bitter peace, proud of our ancient heritageand unwilling to witness or permit the slow undoing of those human rights to which this nation has always been committed, and to which we are committed today at home and around the world.

Let every nation know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose any foe to assure the survival and the success of liberty.

This much we pledge--and more.
...

@countingthedays945 It's so hard, though. If I read the news all day every day, I will end up with a cerebral hemorrhage. I told DS the day after the election to not waste the next four years doomscrolling. We have to give to charities as best we can, look to the next election in two years for Congress and other positive actions.

Not mutually exclusive! However people have moved off some social media sites (not just X but anything Meta). Zuckerberg saw which way the wind was blowing and has gone blowhard and "anti woke". The situation with the tech moguls is probably too long for me to explain coherently, entire books have been written about it.

The response of the non Trump voting American part of our family. (The rest are British). Is to post on Facebook that they are coming off social media. Surely they should be fighting this? Protesting? Voicing their anger?

There are some interesting studies about how Americans from conservative areas re aware of their dependence on the government and deeply resent it. They prefer the GOP lies that they'll all be able to be independent to the Democrats saying it's ok to be on benefits, even when they're supplementary to working. They feel like failures.

others explicitly say that maintaining the hierarchy is what's important to them. They would do without health care as long as it means keeping poorer people from getting it free.

The most frustrating thing is when reporters talk to these people, they say they didn't vote for this. It's partly true in that Trump says one thing and does another. But it's also massive disinformation on all fronts. Some of them did know but wanted it to happen to other people, like the Trump voter who lost her federal job this week and got interviewed in the WaPo.

some wanted to blame immigrants. Some got caught up in the idea of Democrats being elitists and owning the libs. We also have the manosphere element and how Trump appealed so baldly to misogynists. This is part of why some of the tech people are into it; they really believe white men are the most injured class. (This is why I get into fights about how Trump isn't "good for women" just because he's anti trans.)

The other problem is that this shift to the right is an international phenomenon. No one is safe. The US, for certain structural reasons, was easier to take over.

What is also distressing is knowing that many of the uneducated people who voted him in are the very ones most affected by his actions. Poor, rural communities in red states get the most public assistance; farm subsidies; substandard education, etc. We are watching them slowly wake up to the reality of what they celebrated.

The cuts are not yet affecting those of us who do not depend on the government for daily needs, although the environmental and political horrors are palpable for us all. What will happen when people see the threatened tariffs hit I don't know.

@Wildflowers99 it’s frightening and demoralizing to have to realize many americans actually want what is happening, and approve of it.

Like @SerendipityJane posted, they have no problem with a dictator as long as that dictator goes after the people they hate, abolishes abortion, forces religion on everyone, etc. it is scary for liberals and even for conservatives, as many in the conservative party oppose him.

But most only do so quietly because some of his supporters have threatened the lives of those who oppose him.

There's a few US posters who voted for Trump. When they post they get loads of abuse and bot accusations

So yeh agree there might not be many

Sorry for your friends. I have cousins near you who are in the same boat. It's so distressing. These fucking people are trying to ruin my country.

My immediate area is also a blue bubble (Montgomery County, MD -- so my neighbours are losing their jobs). But I have a friend whose hobby is keeping tabs on right wing nut jobbery and he shares some of it.

@knitnerd90 I am in California, in a particularly blue bubble, thank goodness. I have not heard that but I would challenge it every time. It's the worst kind of disinformation.

I'm a dual citizen and I am so angry and sad. The plans were all open (Project 2025 etc). But Trump lied like a rug and said he had nothing to do with it. We knew from his first term that he was pro-Russia. But I've met people here who believe the West actually started the war. The right wing propaganda machine is incredible, and Silicon Valley is bought into it.

I grew up there though I am English. I have friends who live in DC and family on the East coast. They think he's awful and are totally embarrassed by him. My friend is a federal employee and is relieved she is retiring this year.
In fact I don't know anyone who voted for him or thought he could even possibly get in the first time round, let alone again. But putting a black female as his opponent and he was going to get it.
Biden wasn't good either.

@BettyBardMacDonald The US is so huge, almost like many different countries, each with a separate state government but under the umbrella of the federal government.

Red trump supporting states are run by conservative state governments which are anti abortion, push religion, very pro gun, and will vote for the conservative presidential candidate every time. They are also often poor states (except Texas and Florida) with minimal educational opportunities for their population.

They often have high teenage pregnancy rates, high unemployment, bad medical care, etc. People are desperate and want change, or at least someone to blame for their poverty, and when a loud-mouthed populist comes along and tells them ‘liberals’ or minorities or illegals or women are to blame, they want to believe it and direct their hatred toward those groups.

Then you have marginalized groups who struggle to feed their families, have to work several jobs, are one paycheck away from homelessness, have no medical insurance, no - or minimal - benefits and therefore no time nor inclination to inform themselves re. politics. Many of them don’t even vote.

It used to be that people just accepted election outcomes with an eye to 4 years later when a new president could be elected. But trump and his supporters put an end to that with the January 6 Insurrection.

Now, no one trusts anything. Some people believe musk manipulated voting machines to steal the election for trump. Others believe trump should stay in office for life. It has become very unpleasant and extreme, and I don’t think anyone has any idea as to how it will play out.

But we now know that trump and his party are determined to do as much damage as possible, and no one seems to know how to stop them.

I'd mean this to be derogatory but the uneducated and ignorant seem to make up a huge swath of America and the vast majority of trump supporters. How did that happen???

Because the USA haven’t benefitted? They like to throw their weight around and have a seat at pretty much every international table if they want it.

A large part of their current downfall is to do with reputation. Without that they’re basically Russia with Disneyland and Mountain Dew.

I don't understand why you're surprised. People have been primed for this for many years.

Look at the way they repeat everything Trump says and believe everything he says even though he's a proven liar.

Repeating Russian propaganda is a prime example. Americans are actually parroting Putin: Zelensky is a dictator, he's corrupt, he owes them money, he started the war...These are all lies from Russian media.

I completely see that and understand that one
im just amazed at how quickly with essentially one statement the generational almost cultural, dislike and distrust of Russia has been swept away.

🤔