Dawn Butler racism just fine according to Labour

I hope you get what you want from this thread @Babadookinthewardrobe

I never said there was. I was suggesting productive channels for targeting that fire and passion.

Absolutely impossible to engage here on a productive and constructive level.

Well each to their own causes but there is absolutely nothing wrong with getting fired up and upset about blatant racism.

@Babadookinthewardrobe I have already said I do not condone her retweet many times on this thread.

I'm not fired up and upset about it because I am seeing other MPs condeming Dawn Butler's retweet and am waiting to see the outcome.

The issues on which I do get fired up and upset about I campaign on and have done all my life. For me they are environmental and animal welfare issues.

Fair - I couldn’t agree with you more.

The lady has form, as they say.

Frantic isn't an insult. Distraught, fired up, worried, upset.

You sound those things. I was trying to suggest ways you might get your voice heard elsewhere, somewhere other than MN where your words might produce tangiable results.

I never said your words didn't count.

In general, I find left-wing people far nastier than moderate conservatives. Frankie Boyle is a good example. He has said the most horrific things over the years. He made tasteless jokes about Jade Goody, for example. There are lines you don’t cross in life, and that was one of them. When a young woman, with small children, dies of cancer, you don’t joke about it. You just don’t. He also made vile jokes about Saddam Hussein’s execution. Hussain was a wicked man, but you don’t laugh at someone being hung. I don’t believe Boyle cares about the poor one tiny bit. He seems motivated entirely by hatred. And like so many left-wing people, he is destructive. A lot of lefties never grow out of the adolescent rebel stage. You know, the desire to smash things just to get a reaction. But like so many left-wing people, Boyle uses his politics as a kind of mask or shield. “I’m left-wing, which means I’m a goodie, which means my nastiness doesn’t count”. I get the same vibe off Russell Brand. “OK, I might be a serial abuser, but I wrote a book calling for left-wing revolution, so I can’t be a bad man.” To be left-wing means to be good, end of story. Time and again I’m struck by the similarities between left-wing people and religious fundamentalists.

My point was that no politician should have to suffer this regardless of their leanings.

😁I am one with a tendency to digress but I hate being drawn into slanging matches.

We have a lot that's worth protecting in the UK and problems that need solutions. Dawn Butler seems to want to create problems rather than find solutions but perhaps she's a fabulous MP to her constituents.

I disagree that she gets a free pass to be racist because she's brown, if we strive for equality of opportunity. Otherwise we support the belief that all are equal but some are more equal than others.

Labour have a woeful record on this, and I think much of it is down to the Unions, and also Labour members unfortunately. Lots if woke bros pretending to be ' progressive' who would not elect a woman as leader. The race issue, I'm not sure, but possibly for the same reason. Dawn Butler is an absolute idiot though. She spouts the stupidest things on a variety of subjects. Black and Brown people are as entitled to have differing views on politics as anyone else. It is the main thing that irritates me about the Left ( even though I voted Labour) That they have such entrenched views on this, and come up with such crap all the time. I believe this is a Hard Left trait. Labour are a centre Left government with a core of Labour members and MP's on the Hard Left who's loathing for the Labour government far outweighs anything the Tories could throw at them.

Well he usually does the wrong thing. But in this case he will probably have to do the right thing but by default due to public pressure. He won't want to do it as his morals are skewed. But he will have to.

I'm just a bit of a cynic when it comes to KS and his motives. And I'm just predicting what I think might happen (she will lose the whip) and why I think he will make that decision.

I agree. What I don't agree with is all the speculation about ulterior motives. He does the right thing or he doesn't. End of.

I agree but I can't see why that is a criticism of Starmer. He has to put propriety before anything else in this. It's not about loyalty to colleagues. It's about doing what is right for the country. That is the responsibility of his position. So even if he does the right thing, he is damned in your book, is that right? (edited for typo)

The last few posts have just said what they want him to do

Remove the whip

I do condemn any racism and explicitly said so. Furthermore, my post wasn't addressed to your comments. It was addressing the comments about Starmer being lily livered if he doesn't address it (he has to IMO) or throwing her under a bus if he does. What do people want him to do?

Agree with this

Personally I think she should lose the Whip. And I think she will. I don't think Keir S is lily livered. I think he's utterly ruthless and will throw anyone under a bus if it suits him. He's not exactly loyal to his colleagues.

And he won't do it for moral reasons or that he thinks Dawn is racist. He will do it because public pressure will mean he has to distance himself.

Of course it's about Dawn Butler and her actions, that's pretty clear.

Why do people always go on about 'Labour bashing' anyway. They are not immune to criticism.

The decision on what to do involves Starmer, it makes sense to talk about that too.

She should lose the whip.

So what do you want to happen? It sounds very much like Starmer is damned if he does (throw her under a bus) and damned if he doesn't (lily livered). Racism is awful and should be dealt with of course. This thread reads like a good excuse for general Labour bashing rather than dealing with the specific issue and person responsible.

Oh right. Tuition fees are going up.

Another group discriminated against for the benefit of public sector trade union member.