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Politics

Well done Labour NEC - Corbyn can stand

414 replies

claig · 12/07/2016 20:02

They have voted 18-14 to allow Corbyn to stand in the leadership election.

One less stitch-up in a season os stitch-ups.

Go Corbyn!

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claig · 24/07/2016 19:15

But Corbyn is not a fascist, he is a socialist. The Establishment and the 172 tell us that "he is a bully", but lots of people don't believe them.

As COrbyn says "I don't do personal abuse" and as he repeatedly asks the 172, "please, stop you sniping"

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Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 19:14

And there is the rub - you have now in a sentence linked Corbyns policies and Le Pens. So it is the authoritarian aspect that appeals

Which model do you prefer?

toooomuch · 24/07/2016 19:14

claig wants a real man of the people like Farage (who s/he admires so much) to be Labour leader.

twitter.com/lilyallen/status/749575921447960576/photo/1?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw

Ha ha ha.

Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 19:13

Nope - I say that re Le Pen as you said there were only two policies you didn't agree with - one I think was regarding Climate change same as Nigels

Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 19:12

Personally I prefer the Norway model of socialism but I guess that as this is not generally authoritarian this won't do for you Claig

I really don't think the word socialist should be used as a label and definition unless you actually understand what you mean by this. Fascism is slightly easier to use as tbh there really aren't very many models to look at - there may be a reason for that

claig · 24/07/2016 19:11

'I actually thought you preferred Marie Le Pen's Fascism '

You keep telling me that simply because I quoted Le Pen's statement that "Brexit was the biggest event in Europe since the fall of the Berlin Wall". I don't know what Marine Le Pen's policies are, but some of them are bound to be anti-globalisation socailist policies and nationalisation just like some of Corbyn's.

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claig · 24/07/2016 19:09

' I do know that the party I love is about to be destroyed and this makes me sad and concerned in equal measures.'

There is a battle for the soul of the Labour Party. It had to happen. Tory Blair took over the Labour party and scrapped clause 4 and went to war in Iraq and followed a Thatcher-lite policy. As Ken Livingstone says, real socialists were notable to be selected for seats due to the party preferring approved candidates.

After two election defeats over tory-lite policies and manifestos, Labour activists and socialists had enough and joined in record numbers to make sure that no more Tory-lite Establishment candidates could take over and lose yet another election. They voted for a socialist in record numbers and Corbyn was elected in a landslide and it stunned the Establishment and the world. It was a sign of teh dissatisfaction with the status quo.

Nine months later, the stooges have been plotting to overthrow Corbyn and reinstate Establishment approved policies once again.

The media, the press, every bigwig and lobbyist and Establishmentarian are all backing teh anyone but Corbyn candidate. They don't care if it is Owen Smith, Angela Eagle or Mickey Mouse, as long as Mickey is not a socialist.

The outcome will determine teh future of British politics. Will we have a real socialist alternative that enthuses millions of young people and the working class and middle class or will we go back to Establishment approved Tory-lite and will the real Tories win again and again?

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Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 19:05

But Kinnock was the leader!

What is a socialist in your view? What model do you prefer? I actually thought you preferred Marie Le Pen's Fascism so whilst I am very aware that both models have similarities I am wondering if you just prefer an authoritarian system.

claig · 24/07/2016 18:58

'PS Kinnock snr was able to get enough nominations from MP's when Corbyn organised a coup'

Yes, and so was Tony Benn at that time. But now, the Establishment have such a tight grip on Labour and there are so few socialists in it, that a real socialist anti-war rebel against Blair and Mandelson struggles to get enough MPs to vote for him. Times have changed. the stooges are in Parliament and won't nominate a socialist, but the members have joined in record numbers and elected a socialist as leader above the Establishmentarians.

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Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:55

'Pure' socialists don't believe in the ownership of property. A reason why Bob Crowe still lived in a council flat til he died.

Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:54

I've got it!!!!!

Finally worked out who the establishment are - it's anyone you don't like. Doh!

PS Kinnock snr was able to get enough nominations from MP's when Corbyn organised a coup - but that fact doesn't fit in the mindset Groupthink so ignore ignore ignore

claig · 24/07/2016 18:53

'Corbyn as I understand it owns a million pound plus house in Islington - is that OK? Is that socialist enough?'

You don't have to be homeless to be a socialist. Who cares what his London home is worth as it has increased over the years. It is his ideas that count, not his £1.50 vest from the local market or the value of his London home. Corbyn is trying to do his best for ordinary people, not for Blair and the millionaires.

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twojumpingbeans · 24/07/2016 18:53

I'm all over the place about this, I've been a Labour Party member for 10 years, I've never known a time when the party has been in such disarray, although it pains me to say it I wonder if this is as a result of JC's inability to 'get on' with the PLP or perhaps it's outside influences.. I am really in a quandary because in principle I agree with most of JC's views. I actually voted for Andy Burnham for leader at the time and would do again, also mourn the loss of Yvette Cooper from the shadow cabinet. Gah - I don't know, I do know that the party I love is about to be destroyed and this makes me sad and concerned in equal measures.

claig · 24/07/2016 18:51

'How about he changes everything ala Stalin style and we only have one candidate in total to vote for'

That sounds like the 172 who desperately tried to keep Corbyn off the ballet with their "rules is rules" mallarkey.

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Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:50

Just noticed Corbyn will get 99.5% of the vote for all of his candidates - wow that is sure impressive

claig · 24/07/2016 18:49

'Membership and unions mean nothing - the electorate is what counts.'

But the electorate are not Blairites and Kinnockites. Many of the Northern Labour heartlands voted for Brexit against the wishes of the Establishment and their Labour bigwigs.

The young and old Momentum members and Greens and socialists and Corbynistas are representative of a huge section of the public, along with the Brexit voting Northern heartlands that ex-Pfizer lobbyist, Oh-wen Smith, will put right off when he lectures them in his soft tones about how he knows what is best for them over EU and insults their intelligence by slowly articulating to them that "they were lied to" and taken in by the £350 million on the bus, and Oh-wen was clever enough not to be and will now explain to them what is in their best interests - to vote for him.

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Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:49

Oh Claig you are funny - 95% of the vote. How about he changes everything ala Stalin style and we only have one candidate in total to vote for

Hate to tell you as I know others have pointed this out Corbyn IS part of the establishment

claig · 24/07/2016 18:45

'No if they don't stand under the Labour banner they could split the vote'

Yes, they will split the vote. They will get 0.5% and the Corbynistas will get 99.5% as the people will reward Corbyn for having the stamina to stand up to the Establishment and the 172 for his beliefs and socialist conviction policies. Most people won't agree with Corbyn on everything, but they will agree with him on enough to trounce the 172 Party (Establishment approved).

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Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:44

Membership and unions mean nothing - the electorate is what counts.

BTW what is a 'socialist' in your terms? Corbyn as I understand it owns a million pound plus house in Islington - is that OK? Is that socialist enough?

Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:38

No if they don't stand under the Labour banner they could split the vote - they won't just slip away and say 'never mind fair cop' nor will the non corbyn activists

claig · 24/07/2016 18:38

Give the people a real choice, no more Tory-lite Milibandism and Blairism, no more austery-lite, no more Establishment approved economic policies.

Owen Smith thinks the people are stupid as he says "I just can't wait to start talking about my 200 billion investment plan" as if Labour members are going to say, "crikey, Owen's good".. At least Corbyn keeps it real and is a real bona-fide socialist backed by the unions and by the largest membership of any party in Europe.

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Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:36

Not party re Len - union

Showmethewaytogohome · 24/07/2016 18:35

So your generalisation about Oxbridge is incorrect? Ps LSE is where the real political and economic powerhouse really is - just sayin

Len? Don't make me chuckle again - half his own party doesn't support him. He is as much at risk through this as JC is.

Fear? Yes fear he will destroy any credible opposition to the Tories. Fear of him becoming PM? Not a chance. if you can't lead your own party, if you can not allow dissension even tho you have lived your own life like that you can not run a country.

Rhetoric politics from a man who has achieved nothing in his life apart from taking the coin from the electorate. These new candidates - will they come from momentum's current pool? Will they keep the intimidation and bullying or drop it a la UKIP style.

Thanks for giving me a laugh on a Sunday

claig · 24/07/2016 18:30

'Where are your new candidates coming from? The middle class degree educated momentum members? Sure they are down with the peeps.'

No one cares where they come from as long as they are socialists. Tony Benn was upper class, but he offered socialist solutions that many socialists liked.

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claig · 24/07/2016 18:29

'would not stop your 172 being MP's - it would mean that they could not stand under a Labour banner at the next election. If JC wins they will split anyway so it is moot'

People only vote for the 172 because they have the honour of being Labour candidates, not because they like Stephen Kinnock and his ideas about working with the progressive Davos business crowd. People probably prefer Len McCluskey to Stephen Kinnock.

If the 172 don't stand under a labour banner, they will lose their seats.

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