Could somebody explain why Corbyn shouldn't be voted for as Labour party leader?

"Why can't Railways be given independence under state ownership?"

Isn't that a contradiction?

Who's going to run it as a 'non profit' organisation, the Co-op, or the Salvation Army?

Services need investment, investment in the railways had been found wanting for decades, and that is the problem with government running anything commercially - they'll always find something else to spend money on with a higher priority.

P.S. I'd worry more about higher salaries/bonuses in the public sector more than the private sector, as tax payers pay 100% of the first, and share holders pay 100% of the second - and the taxes of the latter make a NET contribution TO the public sector.

Depends how 'better place' is defined. May be we need to go back to the times when NHS was created. Would a Tory government be ever able to create such an institution?

Why can't Railways be given independence under state ownership? The profits could be ploughed back into further development, (instead of far ever rising fares and increased bonuses to bosses despite wrong kind of leaves on track; and more dividends).

I gave Scotland a mention, but they are different to the UK as a whole.

Protected under the UK umbrella and automatically receiving via the Barnett Formula per year far more money per head than England, the voters there could have a Chimp Tea Party running Holyrood - and it wouldn't make too much difference to their country's economic future and own pockets.

With a Corbyn led UK Labour Government, the stakes are far much higher when messing with that 'whole' that has 65 million voters, not 5 million.

Hence my question, in a General Election campaign, where the past IS a guide to the future, when did Corbyism or anything close, leave the UK economically and socially in a better place when it left power, versus when it came in?

previous much mentioned strong rise in the BNP and Ukip membership, hardly transformed into Westminster seats

That's true, because no matter what, British voters don't go with the smell of racism.

But look at Scotland. SNP popularity meant 49 seats.

That's what may happen in England too. Labour may carry popular votes under JC. Tory-lites offer more of the same and won't win support for Labour.

Claig .... re your quotes provided, the "Amazing times"

AND

"Corbyn is at the head of a movement that is transforming Labour politics. Labour now has 610,753 members, supporters and affiliates. Full membership of the Labour Party has gone from 176,891 members in 2007, to 299,755 today."

While I’d agree that there is notable rise in further to left politics, as seen in the the SNP’s non independence popularity in Scotland, I’d hardly call it “amazing”, especially as the previous much mentioned strong rise in the BNP and Ukip membership, hardly transformed into Westminster seats e.g. a total of two 'defected' seats, that were both represented by sitting Conservative MPs.

And as many have said, we HAVE seen those politics for many years before, right up to the 1990’s.

So could someone please answer the following;

Q:In which decade were far left politics combined with State controlled and private sector companies, growing and competing in the world, building a sustainable UK economic model -paying all the annual State bills of the public sector/services/welfare/benefits/pensions and providing growth, and secure full time job opportunities for all?

Q:In order to assess the UK's prospects of a well left of centre government in the 21st century, of the major-to-medium sized global economies with a similar population to the UK, which are economically/socially similar to the Corbyn model?

Yes, it is almost like a Stasi like scrolling through social media accounts and who knows what other data they hold on people. It may even be staffed by interns on less than minimum wage hoping to enhance their futures in a Tory-lite regime that is clinging on by its fingertips as it tries to stop Corbyn and the people.

Who are these Labour bigwigs, who appointed them, who selected them and what are their "aims and values"?

Despite what people might like to think. The #Labourpurge isn't just affecting those that were going to vote for Corbyn either.

The #labourpurge is a massive, both barrelled shot to the foot for Labour, the biggest fuck up they could have conceived. To me, it looks like McTernan's filthy fingerprints are all over it. He screwed over Labour in Australia, extinguished it in Scotland, and seems to be going for the hat trick in rUK now.

I hadn't heard that about the Trews. That is a shame. There was a lot of wisdom and some good humour on there.

Article from Nick Cohen in the Spectator. He is against Corbyn, but realises that huge changes are coming.

"It can’t last. Either the Parliamentary Labour Party will have to change or Corbyn will have to go. Something will have to give. Someone will have to be purged. And I am not at all sure it will be Corbyn.

Westminster correspondents are talking of counter revolutions and coups; of Labour MPs going underground and fighting like the French Resistance. Maybe. But you cannot just throw out a leader who has been democratically elected. Beyond that constitutional nicety there are more substantial reasons to wonder whether Labour MPs will be heroes of the resistance or victims of the new regime.

Labour is changing beyond recognition

Corbyn is at the head of a movement that is transforming Labour politics. Labour now has 610,753 members, supporters and affiliates. Full membership of the Labour Party has gone from 176,891 members in 2007, to 299,755 today.

As Michael Harris of the Little Atoms website says, the mainstream media sees what is happening but does not understand it:

‘There is a new left-wing political party in Britain. It may carry the name “Labour”, the blandly fonted red logo and a set of MPs, many of whom were elected while Tony Blair was Prime Minister, but this is not the Labour party you know. For decades, the British left has fantasised about creating a new political movement – well, it’s happened and will transform British politics for a generation’.

blogs.spectator.co.uk/coffeehouse/2015/08/corbyn-labour-party-one-must-go/

Amazing times. It looks like it is the end of the old Oxbridge MP stitch-up where MPs ignore their members, where progressive Tories allegedly called their own consttuency members "swivel-eyed" and where Blairite Labour MPs can blissfully ignore lifelong party members. Democracy is holding the spinners to account and they dont like it, they're not used to it, this wasn't what they signed up for.

Strike through fail

Well the Russell Brand thing went so well last time didn't it. I'm sure his latest endorcement isn't at all timed to give him extra publicity as he says he is giving up Trews

Every hour the news gets worse for the elite. Russell Brand has now released his thoughts in a Trews video. He dissects the issues point by point and includes observations on Blair, the Establishment etc Brand ends with the pertinent question, can party politics ever enact the will of the people?

"The comedian today endorsed Jeremy Corbyn, calling the left-wing MP the voice of ‘the ordinary people’ in his latest YouTube video.
...
But it seems to me that Jeremy Corbyn is being attacked by the media and by the establishment simple because he’s talking on behalf of ordinary people,’

metro.co.uk/2015/08/20/back-for-more-russell-brand-is-now-endorsing-jeremy-corbyn-for-the-labour-leadership-5353068/

It's getting to the stage where the only people deemed to share "the aims and values" of the Labour Party seem to be Blair, Rupert Murdoch, the Bullingdon Club, assorted charidees, some party cyborgs and the entire Progress think tank.

The Labour election is starting to get surreal now.

It seems that good decent people are receiving letters saying they can't vote in the leadership election because they don't share "the aims and values" of the PPEs, the Tory-lites and the Blairites.

Channel 4 News just had a decent human being on, one of the people, who was told that she didn't share the aims and values of the Labour Party, and a member of the Labour Party was in the studio - a cyborg-like evil looking nasty seeming piece of work who was an adviser to Blair and whose modus operandum seemed to be to have a pop (without a hint of shame) at Labour's most popular true socialist of the past couple of decades.

They call the Tories the nasty party and UKIP the people's party, but from what I can see, the Labour party seems to be run by a hierarchy of nasty people.

oh... and any prick of a politican who calls cutting a £153 billion annual government overspend his own party left "austerity", shouldn't be worth the time of day, never mind a confidence vote for P.M. running this countries finances.

"4 million UKIP voters voted for similar reasons to me. Why vote for a plonker, when you can vote for Farage."

And Farage was the 'real deal' as;

• UKIP's 1,2 5,10 (whatever) MPs to Westminster COULD bring the UK out of the EU he promised, without a 326 MP majority?

• UKIP in 25-years never had a single UK domestic policy they stood for, past the burka?

Only you have a real record, a record of supporting policy light lemons who TALK a lot, with no record at all in government, running something other than self promotion, with promises they KNOW they can't keep - looking for lemon suckers to believe they are 'different', when there is absolutely nothing different about either, especially one who's policies MADE the UK the 'sick man of Europe' back in the 1970's..

'For those looking at the state of the State and their futures, they won't care a cows fanny about YOUR list when voting.'

4 million UKIP voters voted for similar reasons to me. Why vote for a plonker, when you can vote for Farage.

If you now add homes, jobs, public investment, NHS, scrapping GM food and fracking, no more illegal wars, end of TTIP and nationalisation to the list, then Corbyn will win hands down.

Corbyn will simply have to say "we do not do personal abuse and we do not do austerity" whle they are busy calling him every name under the sun and slashing and cutting every public service they can get their hands on.

Will people vote Labour. Jez they will.

'Doubt that, unless they don't watch the news, listen to the radio, look at papers, not on social media etc'

"So it turns out that a lot of people on Tinder don’t know who Jeremy Corbyn is or don’t care. I encountered this opinion on the whole more frequently than anything else, which I suppose isn’t surprising when you consider that 33.9 per cent of the electorate didn’t even vote in the general election"

www.newstatesman.com/2015/08/i-took-tinder-convince-people-vote-jeremy-corbyn-heres-what-i-learned

Most people have given up wathing the news in case they are met with an image of Cameron being "mesmerised" by some charidee or other or in case he is hugging a hoodie or extolling the virtues of the rooftop wind turbine. People don't want to watch nonsense, and I don't blame them.

It takes a strong stomach to watch that kind of tomfoolery and most people say "I'm outta here, call me when Corbyn or Farage is on", which is a perfectly sensible reaction.

Claig .... I rest my case, the UK had massive problems of overspending, debt, unemployment etc with loads of smaller ones but equally important in the big scheme of things - as few ministries were 'fit for purpose' - which he HAS addressed.

Yet look at your puerile list of 6- years of a Conservative administration, with your obligatory, meaningless, class warrior 'labels'.

For those looking at the state of the State and their futures, they won't care a cows fanny about YOUR list when voting.

Political revolution will be for those countries NEEDING a change from the CURRENT direction, not having made the change and most, but not all, things look a bit better than they did in 2010.

"career ladder" not leader

'LOOK at the last Labour manifesto, it was Corbyn lite'

Please do not besmirch Corbyn's name by associating him in any way whatsoever to that Tory-lite Labour manifesto drawn up by a bunch of teenage think tank whizzkids from Oxbridge who worked as interns on less than minimum wage as they climbed their way up the Labour career leader.

Claig to you Cameron having a windmill contraption on his chimney stack means more than anything else when talking about energy problems, but the world, never mind the UK don't FUNCTION like that, people have to 'get real'.'

If only Cameron would get 'real' and I think he did when he allegedly said "we've gotta cut the green crap" and stopped hugging hoodies and huskies. And I don't hear much about his rooftop wind turbine any more. Has he still got it?

To me, the rooftop wind turbine and being "mesmerised" by Camilla from Kids Company are significant because I want a leader who is on the ball e.g Farage or Corbyn, not someone who hasn't got a clue and is a "mesmerised" metropolitan.

Remember that most voters don't know who Corbyn is yet

Doubt that, unless they don't watch the news, listen to the radio, look at papers, not on social media etc

"The Tory manifesto scraped through last time because the alternative was the same"

Claig ... that is total rubbish, LOOK at the last Labour manifesto, it was Corbyn lite, the only 'Conservative policy' was the need to address the annual budget deficit/overspend by balancing our books, which they alluded to, but in reality in 2020 the UK would still have been borrowing for 'investment'.

Surely the definition of a cult, is that people caught up in it, see what they want to see - and you are a serial offender of that on here.

claig .... in other words no idea HOW other that regurgitate nearly 50-years of socialist ideology/mantras with no cares or research that we are already taxing the banks too much and will affect lending/investment/jobs (see Nationwide link below) - Corporations are needed to pay our annual bills grow the economy out of the financial mess we are in - and the mobile wealthy are already paying more taxes, with signs e.g. London property, some are already moving out.
www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-33971164

Claig to you Cameron having a windmill contraption on his chimney stack means more than anything else when talking about energy problems, but the world, never mind the UK don't FUNCTION like that, people have to 'get real'.

"They assemble a threadbare list of policies they consider feasible, then seek to persuade us that this package is desirable."

The Tory manifesto scraped through last time because the alternative was the same - Tory-lite. But next time it is the "threadbare list of policies" against the high expectations of the people. Jez we can!