Could somebody explain why Corbyn shouldn't be voted for as Labour party leader?

Can't think of a really good reason as to why JC shouldn't be leader, nor PM in 2020. Experienced, popular appeal, excellent policies, well-thought out.

Interesting that his other party rivals haven't been able to lay a glove on him - Cooper's 'attack' today was hot air and slur, nothing substantial at all.

As PM, he appeals to the experience that people live in currently, eschew the sound-bite and focuses on policies for the betterment of the country and the world in general.

Gets my vote.

I agree with claig

The SNP present themselves as a left wing, progressive party - and that's good enough for many. It will be interesting to see what happens next year when the Scottish rate of income tax comes into being - they know they can only tinker with the rates otherwise the wealth will flow out of the country (or won't come this way at all).

'By any stretch. The public thought Ed was too left wing, too soft on benefits and too anti austerity.'

The Daily Mail ran the Red Ed stuff and Cameron parroted it, but the public knew that he had two kitchens and was an Oxbridge millonaire. The middle class knew that he would not have the courage or left wing principles to tax big business and tax the rich apart from the mansion tax whch hit lots of people who weren't rich but just lived in homes that had appreciated in value. The iddle class thought that he would tax them as usual in order to pay for benefits and that is why they said "no thanks".

Corbyn is a real socialist and therefore there is a danger that he will come after the middle class rather than the rich, but if he doesn't attack the middle class and goes only for business, banks and the rich, then the middle class will have no problem with him and will in fact support his nationalisation and other socialist improvements.

We are now seeing a surge in support for real left wing policies which shows that Miliband was nowhere near left wing enough or people would have supported him too.

'This isn't a hunch. It's borne out by the vast amount of polling conducted and the testimony of hardworking candidates and volunteers who were rejected on the doorstep. '

But polling is often wrong, they had Corbyn on 100-1 and Labour's Establishment promoted "golden boys" laughed at Corbyn. If you believed pollng on the doorstep, then the only solution would be to ape UKIP polices on
immgration which sems to be what John Mann and Simon Danczuk, who is talking aout a coup aganst Corbyn, advocated. But Corbyn doesn't need or want to do that, he will make UKIP irrelevat at a stroke offering the middle class and working class what they reall wan - a better life, better livng, better services and a better future. But with Corbyn it is not just PPE soundbites, it is real socialis policies that will take wealth from the rich and pass it to the people and the country.

'I wonder what people will say when Corbyn loses. Will he turn out to be Tory lite too?'

You will never find out because he won't lose.

But does Sturgeon practise what she preaches?

She has failed to raise taxes, so spending is only what she gets from Westminster.

Free university fees, free prescriptions and free elderly care only help the wealthy.

Lack of choice in schools in Scotland.

This report suggests healthcare is very similar in Scotland and England, despite different policies, so SNP make no difference.

Not aware of any other differences.

The SNP will use any excuse to demand another referendum - once in a lifetime my arse. Lying bastards that they are. If it's not the EU it will be something else - taking us further and further along the road of political and economic instability.

And breathe...

I think another problem with Scotland is that if Labour is not 100% pro-EU and/or if the whole campaign gets handled badly by Cameron, the SNP will use that to demand another independence referendum and we will lose those MPs anyway.

Normal unpretentious people who work or don't, want to vote for someone, anyone they believe in
Otherwise how do you explain Nigel
We don't like to be patronized by managers either, sorry I mean career politicians

Tony Blair is fleecing taxpayers for thousands every day. He's the only person I know that needs a metaphorical heart transplant

Sorry, also meant to say Corbyn/Watson leadership team. Long day.

Milliband wasn't trusted because he was up against his brother, was manoeuvred into the position by Unite, and because he was far too timid to put out any policies. He was a really terrible speaker - it was all 'hard-working families' and 'I say, Ireally do, I make no bones about it'. The world switched off. Corbyn sounds refreshing in contrast, but I must admit that I fell asleep watching his interview with Andrew Marr on iplayer, and that's when I was supporting him.

Oh, were you saying that Labour should have made more noise about these? They would have lost more heavily. Again, you're falling into AV/ScotlandYes world, where hashtags and Guardian editorials are mistaken for votes in swing constituencies.

If labour is failing to oppose the government because they want the votes of people who agree with the Tories, they need to understand that those people are quite capable of cutting out the middle man and just voting Tory. They did so at the last election.

I'm not sure whether the idea is that labour should agree with the bedroom tax because it is a vote winner, or just disagree with it very quietly and hope nobody notices. Maybe they could also go for a more purply bluish colour way on their branding, make the rose a bit more tree like and call themselves something like the 'traditional' party. That could be a vote winner?

I disagree - the SNP will always have a core set of voters who want independence at any cost and who would happily live in caves eating bracken if it meant an independent Scotland. There are others who believe that the SNP are the only left leaning party who are looking out for them and have the kind of socialist policies that Labour appear to have abandoned. If Labour can reclaim that territory, while challenging the SNPs multiple failings in other policy areas then I believe (hope to the various gods) that the many right minded Scots will move back to them.

Some 15 million Tories/Ukippers I mean.

His foreign policy is nuts if he supports Hamas and the holocaust deniers as claimed. Criticising NATO plays into the hands of Putin. Prevaricating over his support for the EU is too dangerous. The SNP will find another way of being popular/retaining credibility in Scotland to keep power (because they are but have a single aim) so the Labour seats there are lost forever, I fear. That makes convincing the English electorate, the majority of whom voted Conservative or UKIP - some 10 million of those - an uphill struggle, and it won't happen from the left.

But most of all he's not a leader, he's disloyal and he doesn't have the support of the PLP. I like his housing and tax policies, I really do. But funding investment through QE will get savaged.

He's a nice guy but he can't be filling all the shadow cabinet jobs or question time spots himself, and the division within the parliamentary will make them even less credible an opposition than they really, really need to be.

And though Yvette Cooper perhaps shouldn't have made the point herself (having a vested interest), a Corbyn/Cooper leadership team means more white middle aged men in power. Backed by George Galloway and Len McCluskey with support from Dave Nellist and TUSC? OMG

Pnenometer is helpfully reminding me of the 1980s. I too thought we were modern and past that. I spent about three days being convinced by Corbyn on the wave of fuzzy warm Guardian articles but I thought it over and saw the negatives. Now I'm just terrified.

Corbyn is right that the election is not about personalities, it is about policies. Nobody votes Corbyn for his sense of humour or witty one-liners or sharp suits and ties, because he isn't like that.

Corbyn's team are billing him as a Farage style "straight-talking honest politics" type which is so different to the Labour robots who read off pre-prepared scripts rather than talk from the heart.

Only Andy Bunham has realised what is going on and has said that voters have had enough of the old style politics of the Westminster bubble and the Westminster elite and he says he will be different. But no one believes him and his one policy of unified health and social care is nowhere near as attractive as Corbyn's policies on education, nationalisation, a people's QE etc. which is why even some of the unions who initially backed him have jumped ship, along with everyone else, to Corbyn.

I find myself agreeing with claig - now there's a first.

Interestingly enough, the polls didn't show a Yes vote to be likely (bar one or 2..), so lets leave the hashtags to one side. The polls (as opposed to Twitter) are showing Corbyn to be on track to win - I believe he will. He's offering a real alternative to the bland London-centric left which doesn't represent the average person in the UK and he seems to present the largest threat to the SNP up here. He's getting my vote.

Bedroom taxes, Michael Gove, benefit cuts, economic policy - all seemingly met with a shrug by the Labour Party.

Respectively electorally insignificant outside Labour safe seats, electorally insignificant outside the already Labour-voting teaching world, electorally beneficial overall to the Tories, electorally Tory safe territory.

Oh, were you saying that Labour should have made more noise about these? They would have lost more heavily. Again, you're falling into AV/ScotlandYes world, where hashtags and Guardian editorials are mistaken for votes in swing constituencies.

Claig!

And I agree with Craig's last post (!)

Ofcourse, by its nature, the opposition can't block the government - that is how democracy works.

They aren't rendered mute though. It is still possible to criticise the government and communicate that you can offer a clear and viable alternative. This is what labour failed to do. Until they can find somebody who can fill this role, people will vote for somebody like Corbyn, even if they don't think he is electable.

'The opposition has no power.'

The opposition has the power to win over the public if they are a real opposition and of course they weren't which is why they lost. They did not offer a better, different, radical vision, so people stuck with the best of a bad bunch and turned to the SNP and UKIP instead.

Kvetch, Labour lost the election under Brown. People had enough of them. Miliband pretended to go left, but the people weren't fooled, it was just more Tory lite.

Now all they have got left is to repackage old policies and talk about Sure Start and Yvette Cooper has to read from a script instead of speaking from the heart. It is truly pathetic and she talks about Corbyn letting Labour voters down, but is her lack of vision and courage along with the other robots that has let Labour voters down.. Even Osborne has offered a larger minimum wage than Miliband. It is not good enough. They will never win again with their current ruling elite because the SNP are here to stay and so are UKIP.

Corbyn will take back lots of Scottish seats and Corbyn will make UKIP irrelevant. Corbyn will enthuse the public. Corbyn and Farage will force the Tories left to keep up, but they will never be allowed to match Corbyn and that is why he will win the public's vote.

You can put whatever you want in a manifesto. In practice it's difficult to remember any strong opposition to the Tories during the last government - and that was when they didn't even have a majority.