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Original poster

Where "The Left" is going wrong.

34 replies

DoctorTwo · 19/10/2013 20:24

In fact, where everybody is wrong is that we shouldn't seek to redistribute wealth. What we should be doing is redistributing risk. sort of. Global GDP is about $50Tn, and the total derivative market is approx $700Tn, much of it underwritten by taxpayers. Surely derivatives, financial bets, call them what you will, should be paid for by those who make them, not us?

Even the student loans they're going to privatise for profit will be underwritten by us, so any defaults will be paid by the taxpayer. This is not capitalism as we had it till the neoliberals came along. Until then financial institutions were allowed to go bust, but now they're kept alive with a combination of bailouts and quantitative easing.

The rules need to be changed back so we have the power back.

OP posts:
claig · 20/10/2013 16:02

In fact, if you stick to the Mail, you can't go wrong.

claig · 20/10/2013 15:56

'What does that towering paragon Dacre say about Bitcoin?'

I don't think that Dacre talks about Bitcoin at all. If you want to know the truth behind the Bitcoin scam, you need to go the conspiracy theorists not mainstream newspapers.

"Bitcoin isn't centrally owned, which is why central banks don't like it. It's also very difficult to counterfeit and is being accepted by more and more businesses globally."

And you actually believe all that, what the promoters of Bitcoin say? According to some youtube conspiracy theorists, Max Keiser has allegedly said that he is a Bitcoin millionaire. Could it be that he stands to gain from it? Don't believe the hype, listen to the clever conspiracy theorists, not the phoney ones, and don't put any of your hard-earned money anywhere near it.

Sort the wheat from the chaff. Read the Mail and not the Guardian and listen to Jones more than to Keiser.

If you want to guess what will happen in financial markets and in China, then you need to follow politics and power politics and the conspiracy theorists who understand what is not told to us, rather than listening to economic or financial pundits like Max Keiser.

I like Max Kesiser, he is good entertainment and he says some good stuff. But don't believe the hype, stay well clear of Bitcoin and take it all with a large pinch of salt.

Original poster
DoctorTwo · 20/10/2013 15:42

BCCI was shut down for many breaches of regulations, money laundering being one of them. JP Morgan are crooks and should be prosecuted, as should most of them.

What does that towering paragon Dacre say about Bitcoin? Bitcoin isn't centrally owned, which is why central banks don't like it. It's also very difficult to counterfeit and is being accepted by more and more businesses globally.

Max Keiser is right about many things, China being one of them. They are starting to taper their investment in US bonds and are buying Euro bonds instead, as well as buying all the gold they can whilst the price is being kept artificially low. They are on course to buying nearly 2000 tonnes this year, on top of mining 400 tonnes, and they will have approx 6000 tonnes, enough to float the Yuan (or Remnimbi) and back it with gold, in which case the dollar will depreciate massively.

Alex Jones is a nutcase of the highest order.

OP posts:
claig · 20/10/2013 15:25

Max Keiser is wrong and in fact misleading.

If he really believes that a Chinese backed "global regulator" fronted by the ex-prime minister of France, Dominique de Villepin, will be able to reallocate risk from where it is going now to where they would like it to go, then he is naive.

If he believes that 'the Left' has any say in it, he is also deluded.

At the end of his piece, Max Keiser starts promoting Bitcoin.

In my opinion Bitcoin is a scam and one day it will possibly be deliberately imploded and people who had money in it will probably end up losing all of their money. You have to ask yourself who really controls Bitcoin, who set it up and why.

Conspiracy theorist, Alex Jones, has never trusted it and is far more savvy about what it is and why than Max Keiser.

contortionist · 20/10/2013 14:46

BCCI wasn't shut down for money laundering, although there's no doubt that its extensive illegal activities did make the authorities reluctant to rescue it.

JP Morgan have agreed to pay a fine, but the criminal investigation is ongoing. It's entirely possible that bankers will end up in court, as they may for the JP Morgan London Whale affair.

You cite Barings as an example of things being done correctly (although it was a small bank with no particular systemic importance), so I assume 1995 was before the rot set in? But there were many bail-outs before then, such as the US Savings & Loan crisis.

I don't believe that there was ever a pre-lapsarian age of pure capitalism in which financial companies were allowed to fail regardless of the societal impact that would have. And nor do I believe that there is now some blanket safety-net for financial organisations. Firms have been allowed to fail, and regulators are addressing the issue of firms being so important or complex that they would have to be bailed out if they got into trouble.

Original poster
DoctorTwo · 20/10/2013 13:55

They allowed Barings to go under for losing less than £1Bn, whereas we shelled out over £20Bn to save four or five fraudulent corporations. They actually forced BCCI to shut down for money laundering, yet when HSBC do it they hit them with a fine which we will end up paying through higher fees.

Just this morning JP Morgan Chase have been fined for massive fraud which collapsed the banking system, but no bankers will face court. It's disgusting that they continue to get away with it.

OP posts:
contortionist · 20/10/2013 08:19

When do you think this change happened? There were banking bailouts throughout the 1980s and 1990s, and indeed arguably going back to 1825.

Original poster
DoctorTwo · 20/10/2013 07:02

Or Allied Irish, or RBS, or Goldman Sachs, or AIG, or the bailouts of Ireland, Portugal, Spain and Greece which protected the banks and threw the populace to the wind. And the bail in in Cyprus, where the corrupt banksters stole deposits.

Lehman are the exception. The others should've been allowed to fail, at least that's what would've happened under a capitalist system.

OP posts:
contortionist · 19/10/2013 23:49

This is not capitalism as we had it till the neoliberals came along. Until then financial institutions were allowed to go bust, but now they're kept alive with a combination of bailouts and quantitative easing.

Perhaps you missed the Lehman brothers collapse in 2008?