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Original poster

France and Greece Election results!

554 replies

LadyWithEDS · 07/05/2012 02:04

So, what do you think it means for Europe?

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CogitoErgoSometimes · 07/05/2012 12:02

I think, if there's a red herring, it is this continued tendency to blame the banks. What happened was extraordinarly bad management, admittedly, it was expensive short-term, more heads should have rolled and more conditionality should have been placed on them than actually happened. However, it is a too simplistic response to say 'it's the fault of the banks' or even 'tax the banks' as if that were the solution.

The underlying economic problem is that, despite cutting back on spending, our exchequer revenues are still exceeding current expenditure (on things like the NHS) by a large margin and were doing so for quite a long time before the crash. In a global commercial environment where you can't really point a finger at a country or currency that is economically healthy, we will struggle to bump up our exports - and that is traditionally where 'growth' comes from that will get the balance sheet going back the other way..

claig · 07/05/2012 12:00

Exactly, if they are all fine and dandy now, why do we keep having to do quantitaive easing and if we have the money for bailing banks out, why can't we inject some of that money int public works such as housebuilding which will create jobs for people rather than bonuses for bankers?

thirdhill · 07/05/2012 12:00

or even quantitative easing...

Original poster
LadyWithEDS · 07/05/2012 11:59

Some things never left me in life and one was in History being told about the collapse of currencies in the 1900's, people walking around with wheelbarrows of cash, not being able to get their money out of the banks.

People in Greece are abandoning their children, they can't afford to feed.

I don't understand this at all, if this was after a natural disaster the kids in schools, blue peter and the like would be fund raising and all sorts, and we are just allowing fellow europeans to abandon children? No one is doing anything to help? I have never been to Greece on holiday, I am sure many have and they stand by and do nothing?

This is really odd behaviour by the British public!

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thirdhill · 07/05/2012 11:58

sorry, cogito...

thirdhill · 07/05/2012 11:58

cognito what is the relationship between "banking revenue" and quantative easing?

Original poster
LadyWithEDS · 07/05/2012 11:54

I am not the brightest spark, I am not the most educated, I am not the best at listening to the "experts" and being a parrot repeater.

I am bright enough to see the British public is being played, divided and that there is going to be an almighty financial collapse at some point.

I see your figures and they are huge. There were also huge figures being forced on India in aid they don't even want, money wasted here there and everywhere, yet the blame has been put on the vunerable in society instead.

I don't want to get into a red herring about the NHS, though to be fair I brought it up, I don't like what is going on with the picking on the vunerable right now who ware being scapegoated.

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CogitoErgoSometimes · 07/05/2012 11:54

The pay-back is generated out of banking revenue. The CEOs of the banks in question had paying back the Exchequer as pretty high priority in their KRIs. They may be 'too frit to lend' but, since being too eager to lend was a factor in the credit crunch crisis in the first place, I'm not sure we can blame them for being more cautious.

thirdhill · 07/05/2012 11:50

cognito "aside from the shares we still hold in places like RBS, the banks have paid us back for the one-off bail-out."

yes this is true. So could you explain how they managed to repay the state what they needed a bail out for? How they got these means to repay? And for a bonus the consequences of getting these means to the banks?

I think most City advisors are wise enough to not go into the detail of how they are failing to finance growth through being too frit to lend.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 07/05/2012 11:49

Above bank rate, yes. We made money on the short-term loans. To put it into perspective, we own about £85bn in shares in banks. The NHS budget is £105-£108 bn every single year.

Original poster
LadyWithEDS · 07/05/2012 11:47

Cogito, and at what rate was the money repaid? at the same rate that it cost the public to lend the money?

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Original poster
LadyWithEDS · 07/05/2012 11:46

Divide and conquer (?sp) has been used on the British public, picking on society's vulnerable, what happened to judging a society by how they treated their weakest? ffs! The PM is in with the press, people are following propoganda.

I don't understand people in this country, they are being crushed by increasing food and fuel prices, cuts galore as the public purse baled out banks, and we are paying the price!

Your PM is up to his eyes in smarming with the press.

The press is full of divide and conquer rubbish, picking on the vunerable!

There is a famous saying here

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JuliaScurr · 07/05/2012 11:43
CogitoErgoSometimes · 07/05/2012 11:40

@Lady.... aside from the shares we still hold in places like RBS, the banks have paid us back for the one-off bail-out. The Exchequer is short of funds because we continuously spend more than we get in tax revenues.... before and after the crash.

CogitoErgoSometimes · 07/05/2012 11:38

You're fooling yourself if you think the few banks we lent money to are the ones that dictate the markets. Financing countries is an international, not a domestic business.

JuliaScurr · 07/05/2012 11:36

Lady Yay!

claig · 07/05/2012 11:34

You're right, Lady. We are all being cut, and we were the ones that saved the bankript banks because they told us they were too big to fail.

Original poster
LadyWithEDS · 07/05/2012 11:32

Claig, that is what people seem to forget, the average joe on the street bought those banks, and the average joe on the street like me is being told on MN, I should put up with life saving equipment that is inadequate, because the NHS is under stress! Well the NHS is understress because we baled out the banks!

The public have more power than they realise, the ants and the grasshoppers from Disney bugs life springs to mind!

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claig · 07/05/2012 11:24

But the public lent billions to the banks who are major players in the "markets". Were the banks obliged to the public? Were they grateful or did they say that if their bonuses were curtailed that they would get up and leave the country?

CogitoErgoSometimes · 07/05/2012 11:16

The 'markets' (and there's no need for the quotation marks, they really do exist) are the ones lending these countries the money. Owe money and you're kind of obliged to take your creditors into account....

claig · 07/05/2012 11:05

I don't think we should worry about a long term Euro collapse.
I think this is all pressure to force countries that remain in the Euro to create even closer union, which their people would not have aqccepted without the crisis. The politicians will be able now to achieve closer union and the people will have to lump it. Any country that doesn't play ball will find itself under pressure from the "markets" and the people of those countries will have to fall in line and do as they are told.

Original poster
LadyWithEDS · 07/05/2012 10:58

Grin Carla filing for divorce, he will be able to really rake in the £££ now he is no longer PM.

Should we be worried about bank/euro collapse more now?

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anniewoo · 07/05/2012 09:51

Live in Ireland and we have the fiscal treaty referendum coming up. How does F.Hollande's election impact on that? He's against the treaty so is there any point in the irish referendum?

Bucharest · 07/05/2012 09:49

Dunno, but here in Italy the bets are on Carla filing for divorce before friday.

minimathsmouse · 07/05/2012 09:44

According to R4 this morning the Greek stock exchange is several points down but nothing has imploded yet, Merkel is saying she supports Hollande and a move away from austerity Hmm and it would seem that Germany is actually one of the most vulnerable states if it all starts to unravel.

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