Too Many Cuts...come join the #Frothers and have your say

It depends what you define as a disaster. 26 out of 27 nations want to go ahead now so we're billy no mates at the moment. If you think that's a disaster then it is.

But the UK has a lot more to lose than the other countries from the proposals. Like it or not, the City pays over 10% of all our taxes and employs over a million people. We need to sort out that sort of imbalance but on our terms, not by agreeing to changes which could decimate our biggest service industry.

Personally I think what the French/German's have done is akin to blackmail. Ie. Give us a load of your money because we've borrowed too much or we'll make sure no-one's your friend anymore.

Niceguy
Thanks for that info. Interesting. In your opinion, is it a disaster that UK is staying out of this? The papers are full of "isolated UK".

Dare I read the Daily Mail?

oooh, good one, Frothers.

Might even make my parents buy a Guardian. Sure it would be the first time EVER that they have done so.

I am a bit hazy on the ESA stuff, but am sure that whoever writes the post on it will make it clear to me.

Europeans are pretty damned pissed with Cameron, huh? Off to read the German papers, might get a blog post out of it.

Well done Frothers!

Kate. Basically Sarkozy's pissed off because Cameron's refused to agree to a new treaty which essentially would:

1. Mean we have to get our national budgets approved by the EC. Ie. if we want to spend £x on pensions/NHS/whatever then some EU bureaucrat has to agree even though it's not his money and nothing to do with him.

2. They want to introduce a Tobin tax on banks. A tax which we'd pay 80% of to pay for a failing currency we're not a part of.

3. The answer to Europe's problems is to have more of it. Think United States of Europe. in actual fact it might actually work. I mean in the US the federal government oversees state govt's and can override them. However, that's not something the vast majority of Brit's would want to be a part of.

OMG, OMG, OMG, OMG, OMG, OMG!

Zoe Williams has just tweeted that she has put us in the paper tomorrow!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I've just watched Newsround. I'm still none the wiser regarding this Europe business although I did see Sarkozy slagging David Cameron off. It was in French, but even I could tell he was tres pissed orf.

I'm going to have to read the paper thoroughly tomorrow. Maybe the Guardian have done a wall chart?

I know it's sad. Not everyone can be in the top 20% and I actually think it's ok not to want to be.

And yet academics are seen by many as the measure of success. And I'm talking the earliest stages of primary school here

In my previous working life we had a lot of people who had loads of qualifications (think two postgrad degrees etc) applying for entry level cashier jobs and they didn't get them because they didn't have good enough soft skills like empathy, common sense, self-motivation.

My heart used to sink every time I got a CV that was a list of academic achievements and no real work experience. The best staff I ever employed (and we're talking up to Branch Manager level for a bank - not CEO types) was a school leavers, an ex-sahm who hadn't worked for 15 years and a lady who had been imported as a bride for her cousin.

There are definitely industries and jobs where academic ability is secondary to practical skills.

Until we have people in government who have done proper jobs I doubt we will see a shift in attitude. If you went to Eton, the Oxford, then politics you're not going to get it.

There are so many different ways to be "bright", socially, academically, emotionally, you are lucky if you are bright in all three aspects, you can also be tallented in various things such as sports, arts etc.

You are right Knotty - that is a whole lot of educating, but God it would be better if there were a shift in attitude.

I am sick of being asked at parent meetings if I think a child is 'bright' or going to be academic because of course that is the only measure of success isn't it?

Hello

Am back. Been out all day and am ready for bed again but will try to catch up first.

I think a lot of children at 14, are easily lead and lack confidence, it is not cool to do your homework etc and they don't feel as bright as they are.

I have to say, my youngest was put down so much at juniour school it took a great deal to get her to see herself as bright. Myself and a private tutor I had for the children for a few years, were the only one's who had faith in her, if we had not, the schools would have convinced her she was not bright. I moved her from that school, she was finally out of having to leave class for extra help with various things, she never needed any extra help, therefore she was singled out with a few others and teased, in the new school and in her year six sats she got all level 5! So many children are put down and written off, when they shouldn't be.

Academic is always rated higher - league tables say so!

It requires a change of thought by not only our society but by a vast amount of the countries of the world.

That's a lot of educating.

Hully, the vocational courses were introduced for those kids. Some courses are brilliant, some are not. Wolf's right it needs an overhall. BUT it must be done so the young people that take them aren't constantly told they are doing 'Mickey blooody Mouse' courses by some right-winged media.

Intelligence is multifaceted.

Einstein = genius but I'd rather have a kinaesthetically intelligent electrician rewire my house.

How do we get to a place where academic isn't considered better than "vocational?" I think there are many kids for whom school is utterly pointless beyond about 14 but we don't know what to do about it, or how to even have the debate.

Sorry, rant over

Gove has a History degree.

Therefore he followed an academic pathway.

He considers academic intelligence superior to all others.

What did he learn about history?
Surely we study history to learn about the past developments, lives and how they have shaped our own.
We learn about History so that mistakes aren't repeated. Like Secondary Moderns.

So, is Gove's academic intelligence better or worse than my mother's intelligence? She is a product of the SM education and had always considered herself thick because of it, because she failed to get into a better, academic school. Yet, she has probably has more emotional intelligence that Gove has, more interpersonal intelligence than he has. But she hasn't got a certificate or letters after her name. So she isn't then

i've never heard of studio schools.

Hully, it's some bizarre social experiment. I'm getting deja vu...

Studio schools are the 'new' secondary moderns.

Now, Gove has at least recognised that an academic route isn't for everyone although I suspect he was hoping the Wolf report would say vocational education was all shite. Wolf found that there is a strong case and place for it, with some revision of current courses, apprenticeship schemes, etc.

So he'll stick em all in a 'Studio' school away from the brainy ones

I know I said something half-reasonable about Gove there. No, can't believe it either.

knotty - yy. It's all going backwards. Bye bye national education system with national curriculum. Hello you-get-what-you-pay-for.

OK, Dave Hartnett has announced his intention to retirement for summer 2012.

So he's still currently employed by HMRC - and therefore presumably still sackable for gross misconduct, etc.

Hully, I'm reading bleeding everything I can get my hands on. Conversion astonishing. There's also some stuff around about how Gove is considering 'Studio' academies. Bloody segregation everywhere:

schools for Catholics
schools for Prods
schools for academic elite
schools for rich
schools for techies
schools for middle-classes
etc etc etc

Big Society, my arse. Split em all up. Weaken their powers.