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Original poster

Cap child tax credit after four children, says MP

638 replies

SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 15:39

here

One of nadine's friends!

I'm not surprised to see this from a conservative MP, as ever I think this sort of thing is a terrible idea - children don't choose to be born and by restricting benefits in this way you are punishing the children for something you disapprove of the parents doing. And as I understand it the number of people with no work ever and loads of children is actually very low? So this sort of policy doesn't actually save much money at all. Can't remember where I saw that though.

I am sure there will be some who disagree. I thought that people who post here might be interested anyway.

OP posts:
colditz · 18/11/2011 20:46

I agree with niceguy - and I'm a single mother on benefits. I'm not having any more children - I'm not supporting the ones I already have without intervention from the DWP, so I'm certainly not going to have any more¬!

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:46

Still interested to hear whether people would stop all benefits for children who are 5th or subsequent, or just the ones mentioned in the article?

OP posts:
MindtheGappp · 18/11/2011 20:46

They can wheel their buggy to my house while they are cleaning. I don't mind.

BobblyGussets · 18/11/2011 20:45

I am conflicted really. I would not and could not punish children or not very bright adults/adults with poor upbringing/adults with low self esteem.

However, we are a very small country and have limited resources. We do need to address the "well I get x amount for housing benefit, X for income support and X child tax credit, well it's not worth me working because I wouldn't be able to earn that".
Well those in that situation need to be able to earn £200 or £300 a week towards their expenses to contribute and the welfare system needs not to penalise them for that.
I am pissed and not articulating myself well, BTW.

We as a country, have a limited pot, we don't need to subsidise big familes, we don't need to expand the population of this small island, but I would rather eat my own tits than deprive or stigmatise the actual children of large or poor families.

We do need the parents of those children, or at least one of them, working towards contributing towards the benefits they may receive.

We are not flush, but ok and grateful to have decent jobs through which we are proud to pay a good amount of tax. For me, it is a good thing to pay tax and contribute to society, but we all need to do that, even if it is only partial.

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:45

"I doubt any sane parent would keep their 5th child hungry, just because they don't get tax credit from them"

No they will have 4 children who are all hungry. As the food for 4 is divided 5 ways.

OP posts:
moondog · 18/11/2011 20:45

I'm not happy at all about paying for people who do nothing to support their children.
Not that I blame them one iota for taking all that is handed to them.In this country we reward inactivity, chaotic living, unstable homes, disfunctional activity, lack of efort and general fecklessness.

More fool us.
We then pay people to look busy trying to sort it all out (armies of social workers, 'outreach' workers and the like)

Little wonder we are the laughing stock of the world.

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:44

"Parents are responsible for their children"

Do you disagree with the child protection agencies in the UK?

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Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:43

If they work they won't have any more money mindthegapp as their benefits will be reduced accordingly.

There is also the knotty problem of who looks after the children while the work is done. That question is I'm sure one that will cause a major confloption for some of you.

OP posts:
lockets · 18/11/2011 20:43

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Pekka · 18/11/2011 20:43

Cuts are being made everywhere, in the public sector, private sector and benefits. We all feel the pinch somehow.
Parents are responsible for their children. If you decide to have even 1 child, your living standard will most often go down (maternity leave etc.) for a while. Two kids, even more so. These are the choices you make in this life. I dream of 4 kids, but doubt we can afford more than 2. I know a lot of working parents who delay having the 2nd child because they wouldn't be able to afford childcare.
Accidents happen, and I doubt any sane parent would keep their 5th child hungry, just because they don't get tax credit from them. You don't have kids in order to get benefits. You make adjustments in your lifestyle to cover for the happy accident :)
This is why I think 4 kids is an OK limit for the tax credit.

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:42

So you want a system where someone judges whose children are worthy of support and whose are not?

I am guessing that the unworthy children would get an exemption and become worthy if they were eg disabled?

OP posts:
MindtheGappp · 18/11/2011 20:41

I'll give the a cleaning job so that their fifth child can have some healthy food, sardine.

I'm assuming they are eager to work.

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:40

I imagine that they struggle with food and clothed, teens.

I'm not sure what you want me to say? I am no advocate for the CSA, I know little about them.

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teenswhodhavethem · 18/11/2011 20:40

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Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:39

A couple have 5 kids.
They lose their jobs.
Should the children be supported, fed, clothed, that sort of thing
Yes obviously.

I would have thought this was a universal feeling. I am realising it is not.

OP posts:
teenswhodhavethem · 18/11/2011 20:38

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Message withdrawn

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:38

Yes moondog it is.

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Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:37

Have read again teens.

I don't know anything about teh CSA.

If they are doing something stupid then it doesn't surprise me.

OP posts:
moondog · 18/11/2011 20:37

'I think that in the UK in 2011, the state should not intentionally decline to provide for children whose parents cannot do so.'

So it's ok for peopel to have as many children as they want and for me to keep on paying for them?
Is that what you are saying|?

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:35

"If tax credits and CB paid are vital to maintain a basic standard of living for the children to whom they are being claimed, then taking them off those children to give to others doesnt seem right."

I don;t understand the question, teens.

And to your second question, yes. I think that in the UK in 2011, the state should not intentionally decline to provide for children whose parents cannot do so.

Incidentally - do people think all benefits should be removed from 5th and subsequent children or just the one this MP talks about?

OP posts:
moondog · 18/11/2011 20:33

What is the purpose of inverted commas here, Pinky?

I am a little bit 'religious'

teenswhodhavethem · 18/11/2011 20:31

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cazboldy · 18/11/2011 20:28

OriginalPoster - but then you are over the bracket and don't get any ctc anyway surely?

MotherPanda · 18/11/2011 20:25

Some of you are making the mistake of thinking that all those in receipt of tax credits don't work, me and dh both work, but get tax credits.

Original poster
SardineQueen · 18/11/2011 20:25

When the welfare state was founded pooka surely people were still having larger families?

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