impossible to find impartial explanations of AV!

I think AV would lead to more coalitions. But PR does seem a fairer system than either AV or FPTP. I don't know why they didn't go for that. I think it was because it was seen as a LibDem policiy and the Tories wanted to water it down?

And I think that the main problem with democracy is that the first priority of the party in power has to be to stay in power, so they feel they have to win our support by lying to us/bribing big business, etc. Having a coalition will muddy the waters. It will make it more difficult to identify which party is responsible for certain policies, because individuals from different parties will have to work together and thrash things out.

Look at the present lot as a pilot scheme, a dummy run. The next government will be better as it won't have any Tories or Lib Dems in it ...

The Avs and Av nots.

I think AV is a good idea. Weirdly, because I hate this Coalition, I'm rather in favour of coalitions in general. I don't think any of the three main parties have the same priorities as I do any more, and having to negotiate with coalition partners might rein them in a bit. Plus I think more Green policies might get through.

Whatever niggles you have Giddy, it is clear that AV is a better, fairer, more democratic system than FPTP.

So the party elected got 53% of the votes. Id say that most people are happier there. Better than if a party got elected on 37%.
(of course there are still better systems, e.g. AV+, but we have to take things one step at a time.)

So you see, it works:
Most people are happier with AV.
Vote for AV, vote for happiness
:)

The major problem with the current system FPTP is that people can be elected with a minority of the vote. Some people get elected when less than 3 out of 10 people voted for them. This is not democratic, because most people actually didnt vote for them.

So youve got friends round for BBQ, theres 10 of you. DH goes to the shop to get choccy (they only do multipacks).

2 say mars
2 say twix
2 say rolo
1 says a bar of choc
3 dont feel like chocolate and they ask for starburst.

FPTP
Result: DH gets starburst! because they got most votes - thats 7 angry people at your BBQ!

AV:

The one with least votes gets dropped each time
(so 1 bar of choc -> +1 mars. 2 rolo -> +1 twix, +1 mars. 3 twix -> +3 mars)
Total: 3 for starburst, 7 for mars.
Result: DH gets mars! 7 people happy, 3 are meh.

Most people are happier under AV.
Vote for AV, vote for happiness.
:)

It's not just the Conservatives and BNP that are asking us to vote 'no' incidentally. Milliband is rather out on his own in the Labour party asking us to vote 'yes'. Plenty of his MPs are in the 'no' camp. John Reid (about as Labour as they come) campaigning with the PM last week was certainly an interesting partnership!

The FPTP system favours the established main parties of Labour and Conservative because, most of the time, the result will be a straight majority for one of those two. 2010 was an unusual but not unprecedented result. So you'd expect established Labour and Conservative MPs to want to retain the status quo. The Lib Dems always want PR because they tend to come second in a lot of seats and therefore never have enough MPs to form a government. Their gamble is that, in marginals, if Labour voters place them 2nd and Conservative voters place them 2nd they'll pick up extra seats by default..

As for minority parties going through on the 2nd and 3rd counts, it's technically possible. But they would have to poll enough votes in the first round of counting not to be eliminated and then they'd have to be a good 2nd on a lot of ballot papers. What is not in question is that minority parties would get allocated a proportionate amount of seats under PR.

Lunafire - but ending up with a Fry's bar because both DH and the shopkeeper thought it would be better for you.

AV is easy to explain...basically it's like sending your DH to the shops for some choccy for you and saying I'll have a Mars bar please...but if they don't have any I'll have a Twix instead

I think (not that anyone's asking!) that the system that Chil described works well. It's the same as the NZ system and it's fair.

AV or not to AV - I'm still on the fence. I'll think about it more while scraping old pain/plaster/crap off of the walls

Party by party as linked from the original link you posted, Lissie.

Anything that's got almost EVERYONE's vote apart from the tories and the BNP has to be a good thing...

Thanks Lissie, that's a great link and makes a lot of sense. Have decided I'm definitely pro!

i don't understand it at all. Is there anywhere you can get an actual, basic, words of one syllable explanation? I think we had that leaflet through the door so will go and look...atm I dont think I'll be taking part because I just have no clue whatsoever, the current system is a total mystery to me.

Given that the BNP are in favour of a No vote I shouldn't think so Choc