TUC National Demonstration Against Cuts

Unfortunately I am not privy to the thoughts of those who do not claim so I can't answer that one. I could surmise that the application process is too tough or too daunting for some (David Cameron has said it is incredibly daunting) and perhaps due to some being turned down at first application and not appealing (and we're talking amputees here).

Am just looking for stats re fraud rate... I have it here somewhere. I do think though that whilst Disability Living Allowance requires reform, it is being gone about in completely the wrong way.

@wook who's saying abolish benefits? Keep benefits for those who actually need them. But keep those that are supposed to offer a temporary safety net when, for example, you are made redundant at a low level to discourage staying on benefits. And the same for anyone who is out of work (non-DLA) to encourage them to get off the safety-net as well.

What percentage of police are traffic police? How would a speed camera chase a reckless joyrider? How would speed cameras arrest a burglar?

@newwave - but Green's tax avoidance is legal. The Childminders tax evasion - by non-declaration isn't. Huge difference.

The only difference in the is the amount of money involved and the fact that the rich can afford the accountants and lawyers to devise way of avoiding tax. Also bear in mind the likes of greedy bastard Green have the clout with the establishment to have tax laws that favour the rich.

Good luck to the childminders.

but what would become of the Labour party?

@wook Yes, yes, choices. The parties have choices. And they'd all do pretty much the same thing. And people would still be pssed with them. And life would go on. Politicians would make more choices, a different set of people would get pssed with them, and life would go on. Cynical? Me?

@glitter why aren't they claiming? Do they not need the money - I would have thought they would. And if they do, why not claim? Stigma? And how do you know it's only 0.5% fraudulent? That means someone has done an assessment of who's claiming when they shouldn't be - point me to that. But, always good to know that there are other areas of benefit fraud that needs addressing. Totally agree with enforcement of our current legislation. That's everything from benefit fraud to tax evasion to speeding. Have I mentioned my

"Save police jobs. Get more speed cameras"

slogan? Like I said, enforcement of the law as it stands.

if we got rid of all the pretentious wankers we would be okay as a country

too many people with no talent

So there are some benefit claimants who fiddle, just as there are some MPs who fiddle. Doesn't mean we should abolish benefits.

A profile of a Harvard economics lecturer I think he was today was suggesting £24k to £30k tax free and then one flat tax over that level. The would take most people (as the average wage is £20k or £25k) out of the tax net entirely and we could abolish tax credits to everyone too and all those sorts of complications and go for simplicity.

However Lord Lawson doesn't even think merging NI and tax is a runner and he looked into it very very carefully 20 years ago.

They never seem to manage much simplication although his move to two tax rates only with highest rate down to 40% was a huge success.

studying there's a huge difference in their personal wealth and the amount of tax being evaded/avoided. But not a huge difference morally.

@newwave - but Green's tax avoidance is legal. The Childminders tax evasion - by non-declaration isn't. Huge difference.

studying cuts may well need to happen: (there are debates about the extent of the cuts that should be made amongst economists) I am certain there are some sensible cuts that could be made and personally would like to see an end to Trident etc, not to mention the lunacy of academies, free schools etc (two of our local academys' wages bill are a public scandal IMO)

However, there are political choices about cuts to be made in the current situation - what to cut, how soon to cut, how much to cut.. cutting jobs, cutting support to those with disabilities, just two of the political choices being made.

studyinghard,

Regarding chilminders and tax paying, they should declare it however with the example of Gideons and Daves theft offshore trusts and Greens greed tax avoidance, and the stealing cunts bankers greed I suspect they are following our leaders examples.

studyinghard,

Regarding chilminders and tax paying, they should declare it however with the example of Gideons and Daves theft offshore trusts and Greens greed tax avoidance, and the stealing cunts bankers greed I suspect they are following our leaders examples.

wow - busy thread.

happiestblonde - you still there? still happy?

I asked whether you agreed with a personal allowance and you said yes - £10k. I was going to then try to have a rational conversation about how it is clearly much more logical, if the concept of a personal allowance seems fair to you, to then introduce tax a bit at a time rather than in one sudden step. i.e having bands of tax rather than a flat rate.

But seeing later posts I don't think it is worth it.

studyinghard... yes it is possible that you know some of those comprising the 0.5% of claimants that are fraudulent - a much lower rate than other benefits... but do you know of the 40% that are entitled to DLA and don't claim?

and? your point is?

by the way i know of none of the examples you quoted above.

i do know lots and lots of people who demonstrated yesterday, who are full of empathy and kindness though.

How many people know of someone who claims DLA or other benefits who shouldn't be? I know of 2. I know of others who totally deserve to be on DLA and get all the help they need like, it sounds, Alice. I also know of Childminders who don't declare income, who are above their numbers. They cheat the system and don't have an issue with it.

Glitter, absolutely. I'm not sure there are ANY private acute facilities with teams of doctors ready on standby when RTAs etc are brought in at a moments notice.

Private hospitals don't have emergency facilities, so if anything goes wrong people are blue lighted to the nearest NHS facility.

@wook - not sure I'm a tory - nor labour. Personally I think they are much of a muchness; they both want to be in power. They'll both slag each other off. They would both face the same economic situation. The would both make cuts. They would both have to claw money back from other sources. Labour introduced tuition fees in the first place to the disgust of students. So both are doing the same. I'm in agreement that cuts need to be made. Everyone has a NIMBY attitude to where the cuts are made and that's understandable. I'll be affected by it as my work depends on the public sector, as does that of other members of my family. I know it's coming so I'm battening the hatches to make sure I'm prepared. I'm making sure my skills are up-to-date so that if I have to, I am ready to find other work. If people think that they are going to be "cut" they should be doing the same. But, at the end of the day, both the tories and labour would have to do the same, maybe at a different rate, and yes, there's the "alternative" but Milliband hasn't confirmed what he would actually do (correct me if I'm wrong) - it's just political bickering in a hope to wear down the public enough to force an early election or win the next one - that's all they really care about. And the tories would be doing the same if it was the other way round. If either was in power, they'd have the same situation, the same budget and I really don't think that things would turn out that different. Given that labour f*ked up the economy over the last 13 years so it makes sense to give the tories a shot - because labour may fk up the recovery as well. And of course labour will say the tories are going to f*k it up anyway. Lots of highly educated, rich people trying to gain ground and points in the Commons.

Jogon.... what the hell... how do you deduce that from the post?
The sheer amount of evidence needed now is huge, far from 'no checks and balances' yet they still want to cut claimants by 20%...

It's the people claiming who shouldn't be that take money form those who genuinely need it like yourself.

It's a shame you resorted to abuse, I enjoy debate when it doesn't come down to mudslinging.

Just looked up happiestblonde's libertarians.
They are anarchists and will end up destroying society. They are not right wing, they are libertarian anarchists and are as deluded as the communists. The right wing G.K. Chesterton was right

"G. K. Chesterton wrote that "Herbert Spencer really went as far as he could in the direction of Individualism, just as Karl Marx went as far as he could in the direction of Socialism. He left only the gallant and eccentric Auberon Herbert to go one step further; and practically propose that we should abolish the police; and merely insure ourselves against thieves and assassins, as against fire and accident." (Illustrated London News February 15, 1936, p. 266.)"

Alice, so you think anyone should be able to claim DLA at any time without any sort of checks or balances?

ten out of ten for alice there....