Active discussions

Help protect children from gaming harms.

Take our survey

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Politics
Original poster

We British have the politicians we deserve. But our elderly peop;le should be receiving the support of their country

91 replies

ivanhoe · 03/02/2011 12:16

The Pensions Credit means test for pensioners is costing £54 per person per pensioner.

The restoration of the earnings link to State pensions, would cost £5 per person per pensioner.

The Government are sitting on a National Insurance "surplus" of £40 billion.

The Government have a war chest of £50 billion.

The Government are sending £40 million a day to Europe.

There is no way on this planet any Government running this country cannot pay all our pensioners a decent State pension with increases linked directly to British prosperity via an earnings link, but Government's since the 80's have ruled it out, and why ?

Because the right wing in politics do not believe in the role of the State, they are market obsessed.

So lets make no mistake here, no Government of any political pursuation in this country is incompetent. All party's have political ideoligies.

It is the British who are largely politically uneducated, and politically docile, which is why we British have the politicians we deserve.

But the elderly dont deserve to be treated so badly. They should be receiving the support of their country.

.

..

OP posts:
newwave · 05/02/2011 22:22

Hudd, I was being facetious hence the smilies, I can understand basic economics.

huddspur · 05/02/2011 21:56

newwave- Even if taxes on the wealthiest were increased they wouldn't raise anywhere near enough revenue to fund a £300 a week state pension for all pensioners

newwave · 05/02/2011 21:52

Hudd, tax Bob Diamond and the rich to the hilt :o :o

huddspur · 05/02/2011 21:51

£300 a week Shock. How would we pay for it?

Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 21:45

I dont have to substantiate anything to anybody.

We simply dont look after our pensioners in this country.

And it aint garbage matey.

OP posts:
magicbutterfly · 05/02/2011 18:19

"whatever does 'per person per pensioner' mean?"

Ivanhoe has been posting that garbage for at leat five years to my knowledge. Ask him to substantiate his figures and he resorts to insults.

magicbutterfly · 05/02/2011 18:14

Ivanhoe had a number of petitions on the Downing Street website a couple of years ago. One was calling for a £250 per week state pension. Then there was some phoney organization invented by him called Linkage countrywide. A google search will reveal all.

Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 17:26

""its recognising that people do have choices""

Yes and the elderly have had their fair share of choices all their lives, they are now settled in their homes, and should be allowed to remain in them.

"Choice" has been made into some sort of fashion word today, people use the word as though it was something really wonderfull that they had all just learned.

But sadly the only people who can make real "choices" are those who can afford to.

It is my "choice" to say that "lol".

OP posts:
Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 16:57

""£300 a week? Bloody hell thats a lot of money""

Do you think it's much compared to an MP's pay and perks ?

OP posts:
falsemessageoflethargy · 05/02/2011 16:28

£300 a week? Bloody hell thats a lot of money.

Its not about making people move - its recognising that people do have choices - they just often dont like the choices we have - like us all. If my dh is made redundant then we would have top move somewhere cheaper and uproot my children from their schools etc with all of that entails - as the new housing benefit rules will do to hundreds of families - how come its alright for them but not for pensioners?

Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 16:26

""I also fail to see how pensioners are more worthy than any other group in need - everyone in poverty needs help, not just pensioners. But there needs to eb an acceptable amount - what do you think the state pension should be per week?""

I do, any country that looks after its elderly with dignity, is going to look after everyone else.

I have no idea what the amount should be a week.

How ever judging by all the facts ive put up here regarding British expenditure in general, I dont think £300 a week per single pensioner is that bad, and of course with a relevant increase for couples.

What say you ?

OP posts:
Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 16:21

falsemessageoflethargy, I think its sick to make elderly people sell up and move from a house they have spent their lives living in, but then this is todays British society, selfish, and hard, with no soul.

OP posts:
chibi · 05/02/2011 14:34

mostly housing (obv there are some hotspots)/rents

when i first moved here, all i could afford to live in was a bedsit - i had a graduate job

i had always had 1 bed flats to myself in my hometown, and this was while working a minimum wage job

falsemessageoflethargy · 05/02/2011 14:24

Ivanhoe - seeing as you are here what do you feel about pensioners having all their equity tied up in their houses? Do you think they should take a bit more responsibility and move to a smalelr/cheaper house and area to free up both ther money and the house or do you think its a nonissue?

I also fail to see how pensioners are more worthy than any other group in need - everyone in poverty needs help, not just pensioners. But there needs to eb an acceptable amount - what do you think the state pension should be per week?

Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 14:21

Chibi, How is the cost of living much lower in Canada ?, in what respect ?

OP posts:
chibi · 05/02/2011 14:16

i can, but will it be really comparable? the cost of living is much lower, and the buying power of the dollar vs the pound is different

also there are many benefits that the elderly are eligible for here which they do not get in canada - heating grants are one

it would be an apples and oranges thing

there don't seem to be as many media reports of pensioner poverty though, although whether this reflects reality who knows

i know i never heard of anyone freezing to death (aside from homeless people or drunken mishaps) before i came to the uk, and it is far, far colder where i am from

this is a housing rather than a heating issue though - i find most houses here really drafty/poorly insulated

Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 14:04

""chibi Sat 05-Feb-11 13:58:03
i have no idea what it is""

Could you email and find out please ?

OP posts:
chibi · 05/02/2011 13:58

i have no idea what it is

everyone pays like an ni type thing during your working life, and everyone is entitled to receive the state pension as a result

i don't think that there are as many 'top ups' as we have here, in terms of pension credits, free prescriptions etc, the system here is more generous in comparison

but i could be wrong, i only know the pensioners in my own family, and have never really discussed it with them

also things may have changed over the last 10 years since i left (but i would be inclined to say if anything has changed, it will have gotten stingier!)

Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 13:44

""chibi Sat 05-Feb-11 12:26:39
I am from Canada but have lived in the uk for the last 10 years""

Does the State pay a decent pension in Canada ?

Many millions of pensioners here in England, dont like being means tested for handouts, and why should they like it ?, they have largely all paid into the system through a working life.

OP posts:
WillieWaggledagger · 05/02/2011 13:10

whatever does 'per person per pensioner' mean?

dreamingofsun · 05/02/2011 13:04

chibi - you get a basic state pension. on top of this some people have more, because they have paid NI through working or they have saved into a work or private pension scheme. Pensioners who are very poor, and have less than 16k in savings (I think) can qualify for pension credits. this means that they don't have to pay full council tax and they get some extra money. they might also qualify for help if they have a disability, eg payment towards a car.

so everyone is entitled to the basic state pension - it would be unfair to remove this from the wealthier pensioners because they have probably paid NI all their working lives on the promise of getting it.

ivanhoe - my mother hasn't paid into anything most of her working life as she never felt the inclination to work - along with many other women of her generation.

chibi · 05/02/2011 12:26

I am from Canada but have lived in the uk for the last 10 years

Original poster
ivanhoe · 05/02/2011 12:24

chibi, I would like to know the country you live in ?

Regarding your question, people pay taxes for Child Benefit, even the rich shoud get it because its about protecting children of a certain age.

State pensions are not means tested, but benefits are.

The big problem is that the State pension at £97 a week is not adaquate to live on in this day and age, people need the state handouts, but even they arent much money.

I have never believed in means testing pensioners for State handouts, this generation have paid into the system all their working lives, they should all be receiving an adaquate state pension.

OP posts:
chibi · 05/02/2011 11:52

I am from a country where there isn't any means testing, as benefits are only available to the unemployed or disabled, so no WTC or CTC for example

I don't know much about the system here, as I have never used it

what I don't understand is why we should means test some benefits (CTC, child benefit, WTC, hb) but not pensions?

can anyone explain this, I genuinely would like to know and I am asking in good faith

dreamingofsun · 05/02/2011 11:46

perhaps they should look at how they means test someone and make the process more efficient. ivanhoe - to me this shows how inefficient and wasteful the gov can be.