Independence for Scotland?

Hudd if that is true, how come labour and Tory politicians are so unwilling to let it happen? You'd think it would bring huge political advantage for the Tories as they have little support in Scotland.

I hope you get independance, Scotland has been a drain on us for far too long

complimentary Mon 17-Jan-11 11:40:33
Ask Canadians what they think of Americans, Portguese what they think of Spain, Danes what they think of Germany - you'd get much the same response as if you asked any of the other UK nations what they think of England. It is a typical response to a large, and dare I say imperialistic neighbour.
However, my point about civic nationalism was in response to the idea that all nationalism is somehow wrong. The idea of a nationalism which is expansionist, or viewing one's own culture as being better than others (ethnic nationalism) is wrong and dangerous. Scottish nationalism, as espoused by mainstream nationalist politicians, is about wanting Scotland to take its place in the world as a small country, making decisions for itself - the normal situation for most nations.

Scottish independence would be a good thing, not least because it would prevent Labour ever govering England again

All I can say is that I don't care who signed us up for the union but I know I don't want to be a part of it. I'm half English so racism is not a motive at all.

There are lots of factors that need sorted out first though. Not least being England's expansion of ownership over the norh sea making our oil theirs.

If Scotland want to be independent then i'm all for it.

But the SNP should be honest and tell people that an independent Scotland will be less influential in the world since it will be a very small economy and that the population will be worse off since more UK taxes are paid into Scotland than we receive.

So sure, be my guest. In any free society, if you want to do things the hard way, you should be allowed to.

Actually Lemon, the SNP government cut business rated for small businesses to 0%!, it has really helped DH get our creative business going. DH also voted SNP for the first time last year...

I'd love for Scotland to become independent, so we didn't have to listen to people like complimentary accusing us of living on handouts, or all the other whinging about university fees, prescription charges, or anything else where the English feel aggrieved that we have better policies than them.

Equally I'd be happy to not have to listen to the whinges of some Scots that everything bad that ever happens is the fault of the English.

Priklytinsel. 'Clearly civic and not ethnic nationalism?' What do you mean? Many Scots can't stand the English, and many English cannot stand the Scots, it's nationalism isn't it? The Scots have never got over being part of Britian for the last 300 years. They rely on us but don't like us! That is why at the last world cup they were selling T.shirts with ABE on them (anyone but England) Andy Murray (arse) the tennis player said he would support "anyone but England" Yes there's lots of nationalism!

hammerlikedaises. 'leave England alone to sink or swim' it's more likely we will leave the Scottish 'to sink or swim'!. Scotland although not liking the English, rely on our handouts. I feel it would be sad if they became independant, but not a great loss to England. I think many Scots know where their bread is buttered. If they wish to leave Britian fine, just get on with building Hadrians wall!( Oh and make sure they have Scottish passports if they want to enter England!

Well, the Financial sector wouldn't be as comfortable with the Leftism of the typical Scot and might go somewhere more business friendly. Small businesses too. Rates in Scotland tend to be higher than elsewhere in the UK already.

The Arts in Scotland are disproportionately funded in the UK budget and there's a lot of patronage from business that keep it afloat. Lose the UK-wide funding and the business and you'll lose ambitious creative types too. Sure, they'll come back for concerts/exhibitions/festivals but they will be off somewhere buzzier most of the time.

Agree that it is the banks and multinationals who are the real power. They get what they want and no 'Swampy' will stop them. In fact, 'Swampy' doesn't even realise that he is doing what they want.

HLD - I think you are right about that. Scotland would definitely do some 'growing up' and that kind of responsibility would be positive.

I just think the process would be horrendous. A serious depletion of ambitious and positive businesses/people to other countries.

LemonDifficult, I think that Scotland would initially fall into the socialist trap of the greens and other anti-industrialisation socialists, who are the proponents of the 'bash the rich' thinking. I think this would be bad for Scotland in the short term as the people of Scotland would not prosper. But I think this would be shortlived, because the people would understand the trap and would throw off their chains and would demand dynamic growth policies which provide work and prosperity. The end result would be good and the pied pipers would have to prey on someone else.

I think that many (but not all) of their policies are anti-progress and anti the ordinary people, and serve the interests of the rich establishment nimbies who don't want the commoners to prosper and live in the green fields in their back yards. But read an establishment figure such as Sir Jonathon Porritt, a green for many years, and you will see what it is really all about.

Claig , this is interesting for me as I'm usually the one who's suspicious of green propaganda. However, I cannot see that Scotland would be overrun by Green Issue policies just because we were independent.

Far more serious could be the 'bash the rich/bash the toffs/bash the English' negativity which just never seems far off stage in Scottish politics. It just makes Scotland look so lame to outsiders.