The Big Society

'who don't live their own lives with the understanding that it at some point it is likely to be them and theirs who are needing to take out, then it is not working as it should. '

Wise words.

I suppose what I am saying is that the Welfare state is the Big Society.

Chil, I do agree in a way (though probably not in your way!)

To me, a large problem with the last govt. was that it was essentially seeing social welfare as 'government charity'. I still remember my heart sinking, way back in 1997, when Harriet Harman said something wrt the unemployed along the lines of "we have to help these people".

As I have always seen it, the Welfare State is about understanding that we all pay in, and we all take out. When you get a government, running it - whether from the right or the left - who don't live their own lives with the understanding that it at some point it is likely to be them and theirs who are needing to take out, then it is not working as it should.

The problem I have now is that neither side feels that - Labour want to be a bit more generous, Conservatives a bit less, but there is no fundamental difference in their view of 'people who take out' as being almost a different species to them.

Ah you're OK- it's not irredeemably broken, not usually anyway. Depends a bit on where you are- home was very community absed if very poor, whereas here is very commuter-y and nobody pays attention to anyone.

Actually I was supposed to train as a SW next eyar but palns a year back again as ds4 is showng signs of ASD and I need that sorted forst (ds1 ASD, ds2 dyspraxia / ADD; ds3 severe ASD_ yes I know, Dh is on the waiting list for a vasectomy, best thing we could do for the state, etc).

At least this time I have almost done an MA in ASD so know where and with whom to fight.

Again CHil, that's only OK if you can be self reliant.

I asked SSD in home county what happened about ds3; we woudln;t qualify for help, as said below, as they now only offer crisis intervention. What if I died suddenly?

We would hope someone reported it to us in time.

AKA well he could sit here and quitr literally starve then, if nobody notices his absence. He would do that too, as long as there was a PC to stare at whilst he starved.

A Big Society is a great concept IF and only IF abcked up by adequate state care and support.

RS afraid I don;t do it any mroe but in fairness I do ahve 2, maybe 3 kids with ASD to care for LOL- I ran out of steam in about march.

Good luck though. I worked for HomeStart and MAcmillan, both extremely good at what they do.

Chil I actually agree

AS a Carer it is only on MN that I come across the extremes- extremes that ahve pretty much driven me away from the polictic board becuase in fact, they are in no way representative of anyone barring a few people.

Most people have a bit off sympathy and OK, so they don't want to babysit (who could blame them, we're a hard to handle bunch) but they assume their taxes are going to be used to help us and are OK about that.

But the message of the last government was very clear.... ie. "Don't worry your little head about it, Uncle Tony/Gordon will take care of everything." We were so infantilised by that approach that we stopped thinking for ourselves and almost ended up with a police state. Whilst a big state worked when times were good and the coffers were overflowing, it doesn't cut the ice any more. It is far from vague to say that from now on we've got to be much more self-reliant

no you looking at this all wrong, the shiny Big Society is a lovely warming fuzzy idea which is hard to generally disagree with, with it being all vague and all

• volunteering = good

• co-operating = good

so the good feeling it produces will increase our happiness and if the happiness index is really high we will be fed clothed housed cared for in our old age and when in need by this benign glow

sorted

I think most people are very resourceful. It's only in the rarified atmosphere of anonymous message boards that the minority hang 'em, tax 'em and flog 'em brigade find an outlet. In the flesh I expect that, like the rest of us, they simply get on with life, rolling up their sleeves, making the best of the cards dealt, looking out for their mates and are not marching on parliament, spitting on benefit claimants or plotting to kidnap a banker for her bonus......

'How to create goodwill in society?... start with yourself and those around you. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Work hard & be resourceful. Lend a hand where you can. Don't backbite or badmouth. If everyone does that we have a nice society by default.'

Doesn't work: always did it, ran rainbows, volunteered, PTA etc

When I needed help when the boys were diagnosed I ahd spent too much time giving and had attracted nobody to me who able to do anything bar take. had always cast myself as Mrs Strong and reliable so people assumed I could just get on with it.

I totally agree with the concept of everyone contributing if there are enough services to back up secure provision for those ho require it. We've ahd to cast aside plans to return home due to the swinging cuts amde to all but crisis services in our home County and our son's very real need for lifetime care provision. Seems we can only get help if we beat him or develop a terminal disease (LA words not ours) which is ridiculous.

As someone who has worked as a volunteer manager and more generally int eh third sector I do feel there is a mid road here but instead it's gone to extremes again. More community / third sector help OK; no help whatsoever if a volunteer doesn't emerge, no good

' all people in society are occasionally extremely needy and deserving of support, not just the generally inadequate'

generally inadequate? pray, please explain further.....

It's a hackneyed phrase to say 'we're all in this together' but I think we will all gradually come to realise that each of us, in our own way, is having to cut our cloth in the next few years. Resentment changes according to how well-off the rest of us are. A year or two ago it was 'floods of asylum seekers' who we were told were getting a cushy deal.... whatever happened to that gripe? Now we're turning on people who seem to be able to live quite well even though they don't contribute. Then there's the perennial 'sour grapes' towards the very rich... because we'd all like to be rich and few of us actually are.

Those who are very wealthy will come under increasing pressure to pitch in and contribute ... arts sponsorship, charitable donations, funding schools/hospitals... as well as finding the tax regulations provide fewer loopholes. But, even if they do, the press will find a new 'bete noire' to keep us all slightly pink under the collar. Foreigners, bankers, travellers, the workshy... pick one.

How to create goodwill in society?... start with yourself and those around you. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Work hard & be resourceful. Lend a hand where you can. Don't backbite or badmouth. If everyone does that we have a nice society by default.