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Original poster

Bailouts could bankrupt Germany itself

64 replies

longfingernails · 26/11/2010 10:38

www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/financetopics/financialcrisis/8160999/EU-rescue-costs-start-to-threaten-Germany-itself.html

Time to stop handing out money to governments and banks which have screwed up.

The euro isn't worth the suffering of millions. Let currencies leave; legislate to allow them to convert their debt to the new (old) currencies. Let the banks who made bad bets take haircuts on the devaluation.

Countries with otherwise sensible fiscal policies like Germany and Britain (now that we have a government committed to cutting excessive public spending) are putting themselves at risk.

OP posts:
Original poster
longfingernails · 26/11/2010 15:30

BeenBeta Great speech! The body language of the eurocrats is telling.

They know the reckoning is coming.

We will all be caught in the crossfire though :(

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sarah293 · 26/11/2010 15:26

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BeenBeta · 26/11/2010 15:23

I do urge you to watch speaking yesterday in the European Parliament.

It is 3.5 mins of pure speech making gold truth telling about the great danger and misery European politicians and Eurocrats are at risk of imposing on European people.

Alibabaandthe40nappies · 26/11/2010 15:17

Riven really? To me it is about as socialist as you can get.

This is all definitely signalling the end of the European experiment though, which can only be a good thing. The sooner the european parliament is abolished and we are back to something like the common market the better. Just think of all those MEPs, hangers-on and toadies that will no longer have to be paid for out of pinched national budgets. Fabulous.

sarah293 · 26/11/2010 15:12

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Original poster
longfingernails · 26/11/2010 15:09

I agree up to a point.

Despite the interconnectedness, though, there is a difference between banks failing and governments failing - and the euro makes government failure more likely.

It seems obvious that there will never be sufficiently robust global governance structures. There is just no way to reconcile the political and economic needs of so many countries. Even the G8 or the G20 are too big a group to do anything useful. And if you can't do anything about regulatory arbitrage, AND you don't allow banks to fail, then you can't have global free markets.

The solution isn't to compromise on the free markets. It is to allow banks to eat the consequences of their bad bets - though in an orderly way.

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LadyBlaBlah · 26/11/2010 14:50

In some ways, the Euroscepticism is a red herring. Despite the fact we are not 'in', we are still very very vulnerable. The fact that the banks are so interlocked/global is the true problem.

We won't actually be able to stand by and jsut say " thank god we didn't join the euro" if/when it collapses, we will be up to our necks in it too and lucky to survive crashing ourselves !

Original poster
longfingernails · 26/11/2010 12:27

Yes - I think you are right.

I do think the idiocy of the political classes in dismissing Euroscepticism so blithely over the years will come back to bite them though.

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LadyBlaBlah · 26/11/2010 12:00

I think everyone has been complicit in the notion of banking and making money out of nothing. It isn't necessarily a right / left wing thing. I see it that the very fabric of western societies are under threat - and very close to collapse. And we have all been complicit in creating it.

I think it is invalid to be pointing out a leftie view of a One World Government (which is a pie in the sky ideology with no basis in reality - just fiction)

What is going on is all very emperor's new clothes.

TheCrackFox · 26/11/2010 11:49

It is all one big, huge, terrifying mess.

Original poster
longfingernails · 26/11/2010 11:47

LadyBlaBlah Maybe - you really do get the sense that we are living through truly historic times.

On the other hand, this whole crisis should have been manna from heaven for the left - and yet the world seems to be electing more right-wing governments than ever.

I wonder if it is not in fact the end of one of the most cherished dreams of socialists down the ages - the One World Government (or at least, One Europe Government). They will finally have to accept that it is better to decentralise and elect than to centralise and rule by diktat.

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LadyBlaBlah · 26/11/2010 11:45

I also think the true picture of the level of the banking crisis is being underestimated and definitely hidden from the public at large - only to prevent a run on the banks, which could bring them down in a matter of days, even hours.

I think it is that precarious

LadyBlaBlah · 26/11/2010 11:41

I agree that the funding is ridiculous now

The problem being that if one goes, they will all go, exposing the fraud that the Ponzi Banking scheme is.

Is this the end of capitalism as we know it in the offing, I wonder?

Original poster
longfingernails · 26/11/2010 10:54

And miracle of miracles - I agree with Paul Krugman!

www.nytimes.com/2010/11/26/opinion/26krugman.html?_r=1&hp

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