aibu to wonder why someone who worked as PR for ITV can now run the country?

Gideon did you watch 'This Week' last night. There was Blair's old adviser, Jonathan Powell, and Alistair Darling and Portillo. It was very instructive about the welfare cuts and welfare reforms. Labour tried to reform welfare, but failed, due to internal battles, said Powell. Powell said the Coalition was being very bold and Machiavellian in their attempt to reform welfare. Darling said that he had regrets that Labour hadn't done more to reform welfare. They all said that the Coalition was being bold, but if it didn't wiork, then they would have to adapt and slow down the pace of reforms. They are all in agreement that welfare needs to be reformed. Alan Johnson's finger jabbing at the despatch box is just pantomime, as is the backslapping on the Tory side.

I haven't read the thread but DC was Head (or VP or somesuch) of Corporate Comms for Carlton Communications NOT ITV. His brief included such public relations triumphs as ONDigital and the £2m fine from the ITC for fabricating evidence in a documentary.

An important distinction I feel and apols if anyone has already mentioned.

Values underpin everything they do claig, well actually to be more precise values are simply a contributing factor of integrity. Without them they are finished. Surely you can see that

Claig time will tell; despite my own penchant for being right I damn well hope youa re (and you have no way of knowing, nobody really does, not yet).

lady that was absolutely distasteful, yes. And showed poor judgement.

@sorry anybody in a resi unit who needs a wheelchair abovce the very basic models that wheelchair services provide, you no longer qualify for the DLA mobility used to buy them.....

ah yes very good Gideon.'

Huh? A look of at elast regret can surely be acted if nowt else.

"questioning the values" is all people like Alan Johnson can do, becuase they have no policies and no grasp of policy. They can make vacuous jokes about the nasty party opposite, but that's the extent of their comprehension of world events. They say it is ideological, that's why they are farcical.

He was quite good at the despatch box.

You misunderstood him if you thought that was what he meant with that comment. He was questioning the values of the people in the Tory party, who enjoyed putting the poor in their place.

Of all this talk about shrinking the state, there is a valid argument that they will end up growing it because of their policies.

All previous jobs are acceptable for a PM. Being a roadsweeper is acceptable. That's democracy, it's the people's choice. There are teams of experienced advisers to help whoever is the leader.

I may not be a poet, but Brown did blow it

Do you really believe that the shadow cabinet puts its economic policy in the hands of Alan Johnson? It is his team that counts. He just makes jokes at the despatch box. He jabs his finger and says that cuts is what the opposition came into politics for.

So can we have a list of (a) acceptable previous jobs for a PM to have had and (b) unacceptable previous jobs for a PM to have had? Or maybe a Venn diagram?...

Cave in when the going gets tough? What I was referring to was the distasteful backslapping and jeering when Osbourne put 1m out of work. Yes, I find that very distasteful and it makes me question the character and judgment of such individuals who revel in others' misfortune and are smug with their power.

Also, 'sort this country out' - this rhetoric is preposterous. I dispute a lot of the broken Britain crap, its just a political tool. There is a deficit, like there is everywhere in the Western world. Don't see many other countries doing this. Oh wait......Ireland.

As is saying the team and the people around him are what counts....

Blimey Claig poet you are not.

cometh the hour, cometh the man.
departeth the shower, cometh the man
That's why we have Cameran.

I don't think the OP's point was about experience in terms of politics. It was about someone who is drawn to the superficial and presentation [not to mention someone who has known only immense privilege] and whether they are the right qualities for Prime Minister.

I couldn't agree more that he seems to thrive in being in a difficult position judging by his sneering hyperactivity in the Commons the other day when the cuts were being announced. And that is exactly why I would question his values.

I'm not sure that the experience or inexperience that they have had really matters too much, because they are surrounded by advisers, who are more experienced than them.

But yes I think character matters. We can only judge by what we see. I think Cameron has got integrity. But then again, there was a time, when I thought Blair had it, so I am not a great judge.

Politicians can't really win, can they? If they spend most of their lives in politics they are accused of living in a Westminster bubble - if they have other jobs first they are accused of not having enough experience in politics.

Yes the country is lucky to have Cameron. Unfortunately Mrs. Duffy has returned to Labour. She attended the Labour conference and gave her backing to David Miliband.

"It's not about Cameron being posh or not, it's really about is PR work for ITV sufficient experience to run a country?"

Agreed, and to add to that - is the experience he has had been successful?

The answer to the last question is a definitive no. He has been rather unsuccessful, made bad decisions and also made enemies.

It is actually character we are discussing - his values, his integrity, his authenticity. Think Obama described him as a lightweight. I couldn't agree more.

Well you and Mrs Duffy can have Cameron.

They chose Brown to lead the party because Labour had no alternative. There was such a dearth of talent on their front bench, that Brown, with all his PR inadequacies, was by far the best of a bad bunch. They hoped they could con the public and convince them that they had nothing to do with the financial crisis. They thought the best thing was to go for it, and pretend to the public that Gordon had "saved the world". They used the age old socialist trick - if you're going to tell a lie, tell a big one. But Mrs. Duffy didn't fall for it, she said "but Gordon", and that's why he called her bigot - he realised the game was up.

You really frighten me a little claig.

Brown and Blair same old same old, that's why Brown followed Blair. David Miliband would have done the same, but with a different smile. What matters is not to elect the wrong party. We need a party that is for the people and that listens to the people. That is why it was important not to vote for Brown and Labour.

Brown deregulated because the banks told him they didn't want to be regulated. These are his words

"In the 1990s, the banks, they all came to us and said, 'Look, we don't want to be regulated, we want to be free of regulation.' ... And all the complaints I was getting from people was, 'Look you're regulating them too much.'

They would all have done the same.

Brown made a mess because he followed socialist philosophy. It was bound to end in disaster, it was just a matter of when.

Well that kind of goes against your argument of what a mess Brown made.