I would be a bad mum... if I still lived in Germany! Or: differences in traditions and guidelines

Adora I agree, I think if you come from a culture where you're used to paying for health care, or have to especially to see someone decent, then doing the NHS approach of seeing a GP for most things and for free probably seems a bit odd or not going to be good.

If not using a pram or with older kids, they get a towel or blanket draped over their heads when going from building to car Adults wear scarves even in mild weather, the mouth and nose have to be covered for ultimate protection.

The formula is what surprises me the most. Typically they do so much in the way of home cooked fresh food, natural remedies, but they're adamant that regular cow's milk isn't sufficient for growing infants. Over here most can afford formula, but back home if they can't then kids get panela in bottles (like molasses dissolved in water). That being said, most people I know from S. Am (one country mainly) do like to take lots of vitamin supplements, and it's common to use purgatives regularly, so I think there's a general preoccupation with getting enough vitamins.

Another thing:

• gas and air. I clutched on to it for a good 7h and it worked brilliantly No idea why that wasn't good but they're not in there with me so I'm not too concerned!
• another no hair cutter here. Apparently it's why DS doesnt have much hair. I think it may be more down to genetics as DH and I were tge same as infants but both now have a lot of thick hair, I think DS will be fine.

DH on the other hand is all French, so DMIL gave me grief for:
-- breastfeeding at all
-- letting DD have dessert even though she didn't finish her plate (it was one slice of carrot out of a full plate but apparently its the start down the slippery slope)
-- not using cooking separately for DD and giving her mostly the same food as us
-- DD not using the baby words like dodo for sleep (dormir) and lolo for milk (lait), apparently its inappropriate for children to use the same words as grown-ups. Of course then DFIL used `merde' in front of her and she happily picked that grown-up word up.

DF is Indian, so plenty of Indian relatives telling me what to do.
During pregnancy:
-- Do not ever drive a car (never knew why)
-- Do not ever eat papayas (not like they are that easily available here anyway)
-- Best to not go out at all the entire 9 months, if not at least the last 40 days.
Could only follow the papaya one inadvertently since there weren't any to be had
After childbirth:
-- Honey at birth (didn't do that one)
-- Baby led weaning (did my best but gave up at 1 yr old, feeling slightly proud of the achievement, only to have horrified aunts chorus their disapproval and prophecy malnutrition for the poor child)
-- Shaving the head (did it, DD has decent hair, we'll never know what might have happened otherwise)
-- Cloth nappies, or leave the kid naked on a blanket, and constantly wash blankets (didn't even consider that one, but I know people do it all the time there)
-- Co-sleeping apparently till she is ten or something (Did till she was two, apparently not long enough)
-- Kohl for the eyes (it does cool the eyes in hot weather, not so much here though)
-- Ear piercing (still haven't done it, get reminders every time I visit)
-- Never leave the child to cry (easy in a household of ten members, impossible alone)
As DD grows I get a different set of rules, academic expectations are ridiculous. So she's 4 and should know the entire alphabet in two languages, basic addition, subtraction, have the vocabulary of an encyclopedia, have at least an hour a day handwriting practice, know several songs by heart, etc etc.
I have clearly failed DD in all academic criteria but she did shock me by writing PLATYPUS the other day so all is not lost.

January

I'm in Chile, people here use a thin blanket over the pushchair/buggy/baby's head. I always thought it was To protect again the sun but it could be for cold air too and smog

YY To running To the Dr. for every minor ailment or bump, and yes it has To be prívate. Although To be fair there does seem To be a difference here.

Friends are horrified that their DCs remove shoes in our house, DH is a clean freak.

That's some powerful marketing from the food giants re the formula, I see a vast array of formulas for toddlers, young children and older people in the shops, but not much for infants.

My DB went off to boarding school a couple of weeks after I got back from a summer in Germany. I got him a Schultuete to take with him.

Joining in late! I've been reading the thread for a day or two now, really interesting as I've thought about these types of differences before. DH's family are from the West Indies but settled in the UK years ago. My family is mainly British, but with some family (and friends) from South America.

To my British relatives, I'm odd for:

• putting DS to bed around 8pm, it's far too late.
• BLW, because DC won't really eat anything of course.
• occasionally cosleeping in newborn days, its dangerous/creates bad habits.

To S. Americans:

• not using a raincover all of the time on the pram, it's for cold air protection too!
• not forcing DC to wear socks and shoes indoors (doesn't like them and gets sweaty feet).
• not bfing when DC was newborn (um, I had no milk)...
• ...and not extending ffing; moved fully to cup by 11mo, cow's milk by 12mo, so he can't possibly be getting the nutrients he needs only found in formula and he would clearly much prefer a bottle.
• not considering private health care, so that I can see a paediatrician whenever.
• not being overly protective of DC head in the first year, and not panicking at the inevitable bumps and scrapes ( a lot of sharp intaking of breath around us).

To West Indians:

• DC need much more fat!

To all:

• cloth nappies.

Makes the S. Ams look the most fussy but it's just because I am around them the most. There are plenty more but that will do for now

Thus - I would be a bad mum here in Australia if I sent my son to school when he was legally allowed at the age of 4 (nearly 5!)

That's what mine did. He started preschool at three and had it Tuesdays and Thursdays, just for two hours each day. Then at 4 he had it 10 hours a week, then at 5 it was 12 hrs/week.

I don't regret holding him til 6. He's doing very well in kindergarten and I liked giving him that last year at home with me.

Blonde no I don't think it's strongly influenced by the Raisi g Boys book which was reased quite a few years ago here ... It's a broader trend. I think schools are also loathe to "hold kids back" a year later in their schooling, so the advice from all quarters - school, kinder, child health - is to delay if you can. However this means a child may have done up to three years of "play- based" kinder first (as my son will do) and that ranges from six to fifteen hours a week.

McGilly it's the same in America. Kids can start kindergarten if they are 5 by September 1st. But almost everyone is holding back their DC with summer birthdays, especially boys.

DS's birthday is in July and he didn't go to kindergarten til 6.

mcgilly this thing about boys starting school later is this influenced by the author of the book "Raising boys"? He is Australian isn't he? I read his book and remeber he was saying that boys should start school a year or so later than girls. I don't think I have ever heard it or read about this anywhere else.

I love this thread, I looked for something like this to read as reassurance that things are done differently all around the world but it is an untapped area of publishing, despite the "French Children don;t throw food" and other such books etc etc
In Australia I think there is a full range of practises but it varies according to ethnic background, family history and income. My experiences in the public (state) health system have been very different to my wealthier friends who gave birth privately.
But a few common experiences: you are not allowed to leave hospital unless your car has a properly fitted child seat. Breastfeeding is strongly encouraged, but I think there more sensitivity about it in recent years. There has been a real fad for Baby Whisperer/Gina Ford type routines, but again that is waning - we personally have been very attachment parenting style, but frankly my love for that is wearing off too!
We are now in or approaching the education years and there is very very strong encouragement to "hold back" younger children. That is, they may be legally allowed to start school (at the age of 5 or nearly 5) but the trend is to wait until at least 5 and a half, 6 or older. This can't be legqally enforced but it might as well be, there is so much pressur especially for boys.
This will apply to us so our youngest won't start school til 6. We can afford to wait the extra year but many probably would rather not.

Yes Blonde it's not the too but the user that is wrong, but the Tool gets a bad press.

That parental leave is stunning. Here in Chile there are good provisiones for sickness during pregnancy and leave but employers never seem To have enough staff on the books To have To provide it. So many self employed people and sub devitions you see

We use play pens in the US, at least in my part of it. I took ours down recently b/c there's just not enough room and I miss it.

I really must move to Norway.

blonde ... in the Netherlands my husband gets a stunning TWO days paid paternity leave.

Yep. That's all. 2 days. And the right to take 5 days unpaid leave in the next 5 years, or something liek that

I do like the greater freedom than you get in the UK though (though I struggle not to worry) and I love the way 3 year olds can cycle. Was so proud of our mite when he cycled himself to peuterspeelzal =). At 5, he's cycled 21km to grandad Kees'!

I guess that unfortunately playpens like all tools of convenience can be misused.
Another thing in Norway, and I think this might have been briefly mentioned before in this thread, is the generous parental leave. When I had my son last year, we got 57 weeks parental leave with 80% pay. And 12 of these weeks has to be taken by by my husband or we loose it. The remaining weeks are split between a number of weeks that I have to take and a period where we can split the weeks as we see fit. The most common though is that the mum takes all the weeks that are not dad's weeks. There is also an option to have 100% pay for a shorter period, I think 47 weeks.
Also every child above 1 year of age are entitled to a place in nursery until they start school. And a full time place in nursery costs just over £200,- per month, which is regarded as quite affordable. If you have several children in nursery you get a discount.
And, there is an extra child-support allowance of £500,- per month if your child is not in nursery, this will increase to £600,- the coming autumn. However, I think you can only get this when your child is between one and two/three (?) years old. Most people do prefer to use a nursery, but as you generally do not get a place before August the year the child turns one you can get this allowance while you are waiting for the child to start nursery. This allowance comes on top of the £97 that you get per month as child-support.

Next step DXB ;-)

Actually I'm having to get my cycling legs back after 8 months off (DS2 has been very sick) and it's hard work!

I didn't use the baby box so much when the boys were older (more as toy storage at that point) but when it was at the higher level it was just so useful. I used to wonder where mothers in the non box-using countries PUT their babies when making a cup of tea etc....

Twunk well done of mastering the art of cycling while carrying babies and shopping. Have you graduated to cycling while holding an umbrella yet?

I have understood that play pens used to popular in the UK too, but up till now nobody could tell me why they have fallen out of fashion. Thanks for the info AdoraBell Do think that if you think that way you might as well get ridd of all places to put a baby including prams, jumperoos and the lot. Makes me sad actually as I think that a child really benefits from learning to entertain themselves alone in a safe environment.

Some people use play pens in the UK - we certainly did. I put all the noisy toys in there so it was the most exciting play zone in the house!

Play pens used To be used in the UK but I think as some parents would leave the DCs in it, or a Walker, or fabric swing type seat hanging off a door frame, for most of the day they bécame kind of demonised.

My mother had one, we all used it and I remember a nephew only 6 yrs younger than me being dumped in the play pen as my sister arrived and wasn't acknoweldged To again úntil she went home, however long they stayed. MIL knew a child who didn't learn To walk as they were in a high chair all day every day úntil school age, would have been better off in a play pen.

I also had a one for my twins for when I was cooking, answering the door/phone, using the loo etc.

DXB I am in the Netherlands and arrived 2 months before DS1 was born. I LOVED the idea of a "box" (the playpen) as it gave me somewhere to put the baby away from the dog and nice and high (to save my back) but still very safe. I can't understand why everyone doesn't use them.

And everybody is very concerned we don't use cycle helmets. I had one on DS1 when I first got a mamafiets (a mum bike) because I wasn't confident of my ability but it wasn't long before I had 2 kids, shopping and school bags on my bike (and no helmets).

In Norway, we are also quite fond of play-pens, it keeps the young child safe while mum or dad goes to the toilet, does some cooking or other. If I'm handling hot pots and pans I don't want to have my one year old running around me in the kitchen, for safety reasons. I think he actually really enjoys it in there, he sits reading his books or talking to his teddies. Sometimes he will go in himself, close the door behind him and sit down with a book. Are playpens not ok in the uk? I have heard that they are not to keen on them in the us.

In France it is considered normal to put some 'cereals' in a baby bottle rather than spoon feed them the same mixture (well it is more runny of course!).
In the UK I have been told that I was 'giving mixed signals' to my child and 'force feeding him' by doing that. And that said child will grow up to be obese. I pointed out to the HV that in France that's what people do and people in general are slimmer but she didn't have any of it ....

And playpens yes.

But interestingly enough, anyone using reins in France would be frown upon 'as you would be treating your child like a dog' ....

HoneyandRum- the children all get the seats at the Sunday Mass because it's the Messa dei fanciulli (children's mass) It's done in a special way to make it more accessible for them, and of course to prepare all the catechism classes for their Holy Communion.

Our church is teeny tiny and all the adults end up standing up and the shouty catechism teachers get very cross if a grown up sits down when there is a child standing.