Autumn 23 Music chat

Good luck to your DS, PinkGrapefruitSorbet!
Is he auditioning on bassoon?
NYO final assessment days are loads of fun and much more relaxed than a ‘normal’ audition, and he’ll get loads out of the experience, regardless of whether he’s offered a place or not.
DS has his next week too.

Hope the move to her new school goes well for your DD, minisnowballs!
It’s a bit of a full-on day but everyone’s incredibly friendly and helpful, and the buffet lunch is 👌 (wine included!)
I’ve got the enviable task of getting DS packed up, delivered and unpacked in his new boarding house this time…

Yes @minisnowballs - when is she off??

Thanks for the new thread @horseymum - I've also learned a lot from previous ones!

Since we're doing intros, I have one DS (14) who plays bassoon and violin. He's had two brilliant years playing in the National Children's Orchestra and is now auditioning for NYO next week. He's very sensibly not getting his hopes up too much, but looking forward to the audition day nonetheless.

I'm excited to be restarting my own clarinet playing next week, as I'm joining a local orchestra for lapsed adult players. I used to play clarinet at regional level in teenage years, but then had a wrist injury and had to give it up. I learned French Horn for a while, then abandoned that when DS was born as it was incompatible with new parenthood. A new orchestra has started up 5 mins from our house, so I'm giving it a go. I've adapted my clarinet to use with DS's old bassoon shoulder strap so it will be easier on my wrist, and am hoping for the best!

Hope everyone's term gets off to a good start, and best of luck to your DD @minisnowballs as she starts her new school!

I'm not sure if you mean me - other people were more profound - but thanks anyway!

One subject I wouldn't mind at all if journalists were trolling, the more attention in the press to the benefits of music education the better :) But antenatal interest is cool too. Might be a new record young age for the thread 😂Here's hoping the thread's still around for you to come and report on your wee thing's interests in a few years' time. Could yet have started an instrument before my little one has finished secondary school. I wonder where they'll all be...

@thirdfiddle Great answer thank you! The context for the other poster was just curiosity and thinking about my child in future (not born yet still preggo!)

I can’t even begin to say how it’s transformed my son’s life. Autistic, asked to leave his school, branded a failure. Music gave him a purpose

for his friend it got him away from the bad crowd in school involved in drugs & crime.

What's the context @Octosaurus ? Journalist, researcher or parent considering whether to encourage a child to play an instrument?

For my dd it's given her confidence to put herself forwards and "perform" in public in other areas of her life (volunteering to demonstrate things etc) which she wouldn't otherwise do.

Music being so subjective also means that if things don't go her way she's better able to deal with it. No matter how hard you practice a piece, it might not go well in a performance or an exam or the person listening just might not like it! But there's always another performance or exam or another audience and this resonates well in other areas of life too.

Hi, my eldest isn't musical. DH and I don't play any instruments although DS2 tried to teach us piano when he was 6.
DS2 started off on piano when he was nearly 6 and progressed very quickly. When he was 7 & a half he started playing flute so he could do orchestras at some point. By the time he was 10 flute had become his 1st instrument. He auditioned for RCMJD that year and burst into tears when they offered him a place straight after his audition. He's been there since the beginning of year 7 and is about to go into year 12. He got into NYO in year 10 as an associate, but was lucky enough to be offered a place as a summer guest that year as 1 of the flutes had to drop out. He was delighted to fulfill one of his dreams which was to perform at RAH. He then auditioned for year 11 and got in. The audition for next year is coming up soon and he is working very hard for it. We had no knowledge of the music world but his early teachers were amazing and steered us in the right direction. Although, his piano teacher couldn't believe we had to pay for JDs nowadays!

What unexpected improvements in your child have you seen since you stated music?
Great question. Mine started music a long time ago, so they've changed beyond recognition since regardless. So maybe unexpected /benefits/.
For teenaged DS who is an utter screen addict, it's just brilliant to have something he actually wants to do that involves leaving his bedroom. He even voluntarily did a week's residential where screens had to stay home, and went back for more the next year. He's a reluctant practiser but ensembles seem to be doing something for him.
For DD who is very shy, it's something she wants enough to put herself out there and let people get to know her.
I agree with horsey the relationships with their teachers have been very special. It was particularly great for DS to have more male role models at a stage where all his school teachers were female.

What unexpected improvements in your child have you seen since you stated music?

That's a shame.

@northerngoldilocks RSL unfortunately.

@MelodiousThunk if it was an in person drum exam with abrsm you would get an auto refund for a no show. They just extended the period this applies to - I think to the end of 2023.

I think I was very lucky, in that the headmaster at my primary school was an avid amateur musician, so everyone was encouraged to learn the recorder at 5, he ran a community orchestra, and he took us to the Ernest Reed concerts on a Saturday at the RFH.
When I moved up to middle school, we had another incredible class music teacher, who would stay after school so that anyone who wanted to could play a piece with her accompanying - we’d line up by the piano, take out turn and then listen to everyone else.
She taught me theory at lunchtime too.

My parents weren’t musical but were supportive and encouraging, and bought me a flute and found a private teacher who came to the house.
Back then, the first woodwind grade was grade 3 and I don’t think there was a grade 7, bizarrely, so I took an exam every couple of terms.

Later on, I went to a state 6th form college that was known to have a particularly strong music department. Again, I was incredibly lucky - among the small cohort I was in, many went on to become top musicians.
Our county music service was outstanding and it was all at no cost - those were the days!

@Alsoplayspiccolo I think grade 8 flute at age 12 after three years is remarkable by anyone's standards!

DS was supposed to do grade 3 drums over the summer but ‘someone’ didn’t look out for the email confirming the date so that’s £65 down the drain. So this autumn is looking busy: grade 3 drums, grade 1 jazz sax, grade 6 bass and grade 5 electric guitar (me, as an adult learner). The grade 5 guitar will be my first music exam since grade 5 piano about a thousand years ago - and that didn’t feature any improvisation as far as I recall! I can’t believe I’ve chosen a piece that is at 192bpm 🙄

Regarding full size cellos, we went to a couple of string specialist shops with his teacher at the time, tried out loads - new and old - and he ended up choosing one that’s about 100 years old.
It was £4K but should hold its value/appreciate.
Next time, I’d visit luthiers, as they are often cheaper than shops and know the instruments inside out, can suggest adjustments and tweaks etc to get the best from a potential instrument.

Also, it’s recommended that you spend something like 50% (I can’t remember the exact %) of the value of the instrument on the bow, so that’s another consideration/ expense!

QueenMabby, I had never appreciated how hard string instruments are to play before DS started learning!
Playing in tune is a life’s work in itself, then there’s all the things that can go wrong with bow hold, bow distribution, position on the string…and that’s just the right hand!!
DS has hyper mobility, which is particularly bad in his hands, so it’s taken a lot of work to get anywhere near a decent bow hold - his thumbs collapse.

His progress was pretty average in the first few years and he failed to get into NCO or any of their offshoot projects twice, which felt like a predictor of future potential at the time.
I know how ridiculous that sounds, but when I started flute lessons, I’d taken grade 8 within 3 years, age 12, had won a scholarship to a London JD, was performing solo recitals etc.
DS’s journey has absolutely confirmed to me that progress in learning an instrument isn’t linear, and getting grade 8 at 9 (or not!) isn’t a prediction of future performance.
The thing that has seemed to have the biggest impact on DS’s playing was playing in an orchestra. He started in his tiny primary school ensemble, then the county training orchestra, then jumped into the county youth orchestra (as the youngest member, which was a big stretch for him but he’d moved from the back desk to second desk after a year, and then 1st desk the next year).
He got a music scholarship to a school that had fantastic music, played in every ensemble going, took part in NYO Inspire during lockdown, auditioned for NYO - didn’t get in the first year, auditioned again for this year, didn’t get in but was invited as a guest for a couple of days at Easter…and was then asked to take part in the summer residency when someone dropped out.

When lockdown hit, we lost all our income which forced us to look at other options for 6th form. We went to a specialist music school open day, not really expecting him to be interested but he said straight away that he wanted to audition.
Hes super happy there and his cello teacher told us he’s improved the most in a year out of all her students.

Loving all this strings chat - I think the last thread started on bassoons.

@Alsoplayspiccolo - it's really interesting what you say about your ds and the cello. Dd was also nearly 9 when she started. She's 14 now and to be fair I still think her playing sounds a bit ropey! It's such a hard instrument to play. It's good to hear that they tend to start getting good later on. There's a boy at DD's school in the 6th form who also just appears to have come from nowhere to being brilliant on the cello so I have hope!

Dd will be graduating up to a full sized cello very soon. She currently plays on a school 3/4 size. We rent it. We've said that we'll buy her a full sized one as she'll want to be able to take it to uni when she gets to that point.

I will be needing lots of advice on how to go about buying one. Is it better to get second hand so you can buy a better instrument than if buying new? What's a reasonable amount to spend for a child that's likely to be at g8 and beyond (eventually) but who won't be doing the conservatoire/professional route? Any tips most welcome.

Stuntnun, if it was using DD's violin to demonstrate a piece it might be that, but if I asked is DD going to struggle with this aspect with that bow/violin she'd be giving it a fair trial and not set her student up to fail. In our case it was DD's technique that needed fixing not the violin, a much cheaper exercise :) Taped up bridge definitely sounds like a case of it being the violin not the student chickentikkasalad! Hope that's fixed it. Little bows are also very cheap to replace if that is causing difficulty.

Our teacher said for the small sizes basically have a well set up Stentor/Primavera type thing, respectable brand factory made instruments & any old bow will do. I added nice strings on grounds that if she didn't play much they'd last till she outgrew it and if she did play much she deserved nice strings. I didn't think they sounded awful but guess everything's relative.

@thirdfiddle, thank you. actually it was actually the teacher who pointed out the violin was not up to it. She's complained for a while. When she played it was very weak as well. We bought it 2nd hand. I didn't see that the bridge was actually broken and glued and taped up. It might be all the problem. The bow is a bit funny it's too loose or over tightened. Strings were cheaper ones since Xmas. He does play a lot so maybe they are old.
I'm hoping changing all the bits might be enough .

I don't know about that. An expert can often compensate for the deficiencies of the instrument. My clarinet used to sound amazing when my teacher played it but I reckon that's because he was in the Hallé and he could make a third-hand plastic clarinet sound like something special.