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6 yr old ballet exam-no underwear allowed?!?

231 replies

CherryLeaf · 27/06/2021 16:50

My DD6 is going to take a little ballet exam in a few weeks, for a rosette. I’ve been advised that they are not allowed to wear underwear under the leotard as it ‘destroys the aesthetic look of the dancer’.
She has to wear a little skirt over the top of her leotard so I’m having trouble understanding. I’ve raised it with the teacher and she’s advised that i should think about the leotard as the same as a swimming costume… so normal to not wear underwear beneath it.
I find this odd and makes me uncomfortable. She’s only 6, why does a vpl matter? Is this normal ballet rules please?

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Untitledsquatboulder · 16/10/2022 22:05

ineedaholidaynow · 27/06/2021 18:09

What happens with boys doing ballet?

Depends on the exam uniform. When ds2 was younger it was singlet and ballet shorts so he could wear pants underneath. Now as a teen it's tights or legging so he wears ballet briefs to provide support where necessary without vpl.

fUNNYfACE36 · 02/09/2022 05:07

Mischance · 27/06/2021 19:49

If they do not wear underwear they lose the VPL but get a VCH (visible camel's hoof).

I have a photo of my DD in this state and she cringes when she sees it, even though she is an adult now - it even got a mention in my OH's speech at her wedding!!

Your dh's 'father of the bride' speech made reference to his daughter's childhood 'camel hoof'??
Seriously creepy!

Puffin69 · 26/08/2022 05:50

Artesia · 27/06/2021 19:34

Yeah- cos the boys saunter in wearing any old crap, hair all over the place Hmm

There are rules for the boys’ presentation too. And I suspect they don’t wear underwear either (at a young age). For everyone getting exorcised about it, find your most sensible, granny style knickers (most like the sort of “pants” a small child would wear rather than high cut adult ones) then put them on under your swim suit- see how comfortable it is. Clue- it’s not!

They don't. And once they hit puberty they wear a g string that hauls up and flattens their genitals then wear thick tights and tight shirts that leave absolutely nothing to the imagination.

Puffin69 · 26/08/2022 05:36

ineedaholidaynow · 27/06/2021 18:09

What happens with boys doing ballet?

Mine has never worn underwear under his leotard. But after a certain level of maturity boys wear dance belts which are usually a sort of front padded g string. The keep the dangly bits from being crushed in leaps and allow them to wear tights without offending people.

Comefromaway · 27/02/2022 11:44

@Blooter

Yes Royal Ballet associates wear nude underwear but that's probably because the leotards are white. My DD by her choice never wears underwear for her dance classes. I wash her leotards after her classes, same as you would a swimming costume. What are you concerned about?

You could be marked down in an exam if underwear shows. The same as if hair is out of place or ribbons not tucked in. It's part of the discipline of ballet.

You would not be marked down in an exam with any of the major examining boards. The syllabi makes that explicitly clear.

It might not seem an issue aged 7 but by the time you get to aged 12/13 it is.

When my daughter was once a week I washed her leotards every half term. When she was full time and had started puberty they were washed daily but she was doing several classes per day.

CruCru · 24/02/2022 07:22

This is an interesting thread. My daughter has her first ballet exam at the end of term so I’ve ordered dance underwear. I’ve also booked her in with a hairdresser for the day of the exam (she’s due a haircut then and the hairdresser said he’d do the ballet bun for an extra fiver).

Jessiegirl123 · 01/10/2021 19:18

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Seanchailleach · 07/07/2021 08:27

Lucky you if your body happens to match the standard issue leotard.
There is zero difference between the cut of ballet and gymnastics leotards for 6yos. Gym Leo's are stretchier.
If anyone knows where to buy pure cotton Leo's, let me know, I get asked and haven't found one yet.
Top tip, multipack of plain pastel pants, one will match the ballet Leo, keep with Leo.
Top tip two, leo one size down, cut sleeves off, hem, stitch straps on, voila an under-leo.

ShortBacknSides · 05/07/2021 11:55

Then I’d say this is about ill-fitting Leo’s - or maybe badly made ones. Or parents putting small children in old Leo’s or body suits which are not leotards made specifically for dance. All my leos have a flesh-coloured thick Lycra lining in the front. Ballet leotards are - or should be - cut differently from gymnastics Leo’s, swimsuits, or the all in one bodies that are occasionally fashionable.

But if you put a child in anything like a swimsuit or a leotard that is not the right fit - not long enough in the body, for example , then there is going to be evidence of the bad or inappropriate fit.

There is no difference between swimsuits and leotards in this situation. It’s down to parents checking that clothing actually fits!

Comefromaway · 05/07/2021 09:51

The knickerless state absolutely CAN be seen. I've seen far too many children and photographs of children in leotards and no knickers showing appalling camel toe than I'd ever have liked.

footballfan1963 · 05/07/2021 08:28

@Feelinghothothottoday

I find it odd the comparison of leotards to swimming costumes. Completely different. Swimmers are not dancing across a stage in their costumes. Swimmers stand on the edge of the pool then dive in and are completely covered by the water.
Ridiculous. So you’re saying the knicker-less state can be seen? No it can’t, the leotard does the job of covering up the bits supposed to be covered. Lack of underwear can’t be seen; however knickers under the leotard might well be seen.

Would you want to see a professional ballet dancer not well groomed? With knickers and bra straps showing and messy hair? I know small children are a long way from professional dancers but as others have said it’s about the discipline of ballet. Dancers wear their hair in buns so the beautiful neck line can be seen.

Comefromaway · 29/06/2021 07:51

@Zzelda

And it isn't just fabric next to their skin they have to be comfortable with. They need to work with other dancers (so female with male and vice versa) as their partner. They touch each other. A lot. It's part of the art.

This ethos is changing. Just because its what happened in the past it doesn't mean its acceptable for the future. Dancers are being encouraged to speak out against these practises

Male and female dancers touching each other is a practice against which dancers are speaking out? On what planet? How do you lift or support a partner without touching them? Or, indeed, how do you play parts such as Romeo and Juliet whilst maintaining a rigid distance?

Have you read all the recent stuff in the press about the goings on at Ballet West and other schools. Various actors and dancers are speaking out about dubious practises at dance/drama schools and there have been resignations/stepping down/arrests of various people at these schools. Only a couple of weeks ago a dancer/actress who played Christine in Phantom of the Opera has spoken out about the way she was physically handled in that role. The overall consensus is that this must change and there is a correct way to do things, not to just accept it blindly.
findadressforme · 29/06/2021 04:02

@Comefromaway

I would hope that the last year or so would have taught us that just because something has been perceived as normal in the past in the ballet/dance world it isn’t necessarily right and should be changed.
This. I find it creepy and archaic. No visible underwear is fine. Full face of make up on young girls also a bit creepy to me though.
Zzelda · 29/06/2021 00:06

And it isn't just fabric next to their skin they have to be comfortable with. They need to work with other dancers (so female with male and vice versa) as their partner. They touch each other. A lot. It's part of the art.

This ethos is changing. Just because its what happened in the past it doesn't mean its acceptable for the future. Dancers are being encouraged to speak out against these practises

Male and female dancers touching each other is a practice against which dancers are speaking out? On what planet? How do you lift or support a partner without touching them? Or, indeed, how do you play parts such as Romeo and Juliet whilst maintaining a rigid distance?

Feelinghothothottoday · 28/06/2021 21:54

I agree. It wasn’t acceptable.

LemonRoses · 28/06/2021 21:45

@Feelinghothothottoday

No the mid 70s. Why would I lie. It happened. There were 15 or so girls in the school pool and the female teacher took her costume off. Some of the girls did too. It was an indoor school pool.
I didn’t suggest you were lying. I merely pointed out it was never acceptable and not normal even ‘back then’.
Feelinghothothottoday · 28/06/2021 21:41

No the mid 70s. Why would I lie. It happened. There were 15 or so girls in the school pool and the female teacher took her costume off. Some of the girls did too. It was an indoor school pool.

LemonRoses · 28/06/2021 20:22

@Feelinghothothottoday

Exactly! My PE teacher would swim naked with us in swimming lessons. How inappropriate would that be now! It was then but nobody said anything. It went along with showers after PE at the age of 14 whilst the PE teacher held our towels. Again acceptable and no one questioned it then.
Well I’m pretty old and it would never have been acceptable to our schools, our parents or any reasonable person. Was this pre 1960s or some strange, remote island?
Comefromaway · 28/06/2021 18:19

@user1471539385

*shows or exams

Shoes will definitely be needed… and they just get more and more expensive 🤣

Tell me about it!
user1471539385 · 28/06/2021 18:17

*shows or exams

Shoes will definitely be needed… and they just get more and more expensive 🤣

user1471539385 · 28/06/2021 18:08

Nobody is losing marks for wearing knickers. Visible knickers (either because they are lumpy under the leotard, patterned and showing through, or hanging out the leg holes of the leotard) are messy. Ballet is a very disciplined art, and being neat is a good representation of the precision involved. The discipline is there from an early age, a lot of the precision comes later. But marks are not deducted for appearance.

If you or your DD is not happy with going without knickers under a leotard, then high legged nude-coloured knickers shouldn’t be an issue. The First Position ones are very thin fabric and don’t show at all. When DD was a JA at the Royal Ballet School, these were the ones we ordered from the uniform suppliers. Now she is at full-time ballet school, she continues to wear nude knickers under her leotard, again straight off the uniform list.

Many ballet teachers have the ‘no knickers for shoes or exams’ rule to avoid visible underwear, but would not object in the slightest to the ones I have described.

HaveringWavering · 28/06/2021 10:59

@Feelinghothothottoday

Exactly! My PE teacher would swim naked with us in swimming lessons. How inappropriate would that be now! It was then but nobody said anything. It went along with showers after PE at the age of 14 whilst the PE teacher held our towels. Again acceptable and no one questioned it then.
Whaaat?! When was this? Make or female teacher? Surely that was NEVER acceptable?
Pinuporc · 28/06/2021 10:55

As an adult I had to realise that a cotton gusset is a bad idea if you're running through waist deep water (or getting very sweaty for a long while (half marathon) and that padded seam free cycling shorts work a lot better without pants. I also discovered some pants are better than others for horse riding!

I've worn normal knickers under shorts (cycling shorts and looser cut shorts - even the ones with a built in gusset) for every race I've ever done (maybe 50-60) and not found it problematic in any way! Sports bras on the other hand are much more likely to cause issues!Grin but obviously they are essential (more so than knickers!)

SpringBluebellWoods · 28/06/2021 10:43

I think what the dance mums are saying is that it’s entirely possible to buy pants that don’t show (and yes, you can buy very small ones for little DDs, especially as dance stuff always comes up tiny), and to do that if that’s what the OP and her dd prefer. But that many dancers prefer to just have tights and leotard, and its OK to have that preference.

And that tere are some old school teachers who say ‘no pants’, but they shouldn’t, and anyway if you buy the dance pants that don’t show, then the teacher will never know.

IToldYouIWasCummins · 28/06/2021 09:54

@Feelinghothothottoday

Exactly! My PE teacher would swim naked with us in swimming lessons. How inappropriate would that be now! It was then but nobody said anything. It went along with showers after PE at the age of 14 whilst the PE teacher held our towels. Again acceptable and no one questioned it then.
Woah!!!!