October Music Thread

There's just the small matter of getting a place!!! Even if she doesn't, this whole thing has really focused her and has got her to think of doing work that isn't exam-related.

I think certain kids ‘fit’ into a specialist music school, and often don’t fit anywhere else....so 4Strings- she’ll probbaly love it!

We're exploring specialist school for dd1 for y7: she lives and breathes music (she divides her life into two parts: before violin and after she started violin) and I think it'd be a good fit for her.

The local secondary school - realistically due to location we have a choice of one - will not provide any musical activities of any note pardon the pun. Unless she plays a brass instrument, or the guitar. No-one I speak to in RL understands the effect this might have on dd. It's like being gifted at tennis but going to a school where your only chance to shine at sports will be to play cricket.

And then there's the low-level bullying she's experienced since y3. It's been constant. Her teacher at parents evening commented that "dd seems very proud of herself" and I'm not sure she meant that in a positive way. My response was "She jolly well can be. She works very, very hard and her peers don't get that. She hasn't achieved by accident". Not sure the teacher quite got it tbh. She isn't even allowed to play in all concerts "to give everyone a chance". And yet it's the same kids time and time again on all the sports teams.

Like I say, in RL everyone tells me that because she's still got the local (excellent, I might add) service there's no need for specialism. Maybe they're right and I'm needlessly worrying. Who knows.

The other option would be to explore JD. Or perhaps the specialist school for Y12 on.

Sorry, it's a complete ramble but it fees like a mess!

"Do whatever it is you need to open doors for your DC, is what I say!" Perfectly put Floot.

Green, DS is a music scholar because it was the only way he'd be able to go to the school he's at (you can only apply for a bursary if you are a scholar). He has to do GCSE music, but I believe he can be a music scholar in 6th form without having to do A level music. He doesn't want to persue a career in music (well, not the traditional classical route, at least) but he's happy to take an active part in the musical life of the school, which is what's expected. Lots of music scholars are also sports or academic scholars, so definitely not intending to have a performing career.

Do whatever it is you need to open doors for your DC, is what I say!

After 3 of days of inactivity, ds spent a couple of hours at the piano yesterday evening working his way through my ancient Beatles songbook. He then showed me a jazzy multi-tracked vocal piece that he'd composed and recorded with his roommates using Garageband. Dad's taxi is back in service tonight - he's off to sit in on a rehearsal of the county brass band. It's all very encouraging!

Hello Brass, ds joined a specialist school in year 9 this year as a full boarder. I'm not certain we'd have been comfortable about this at any earlier stage, although we may have felt differently if he was day/weekly.

I'd echo previous comments about JD's - ds's experience at Conservatoire last year was top notch. Now at London JD. He was one of four trumpeters last year, the other 3 older and fantastic role models. DS came along in leaps & bounds. This year he's playing with others his own age. Although he's principle in 2 of his ensembles, I personally don't think that theres any harm in being at the bottom of the pecking order!

Brass - if dd was serious about being a string soloist I think I would try to talk to a jd professor (not with a view to going their but fit find fispassuonate advice) or similar and ask for advice on the routes and options. Personally - but I don’t really have any expertise at all in this - I think strings is a slightly different journey to others and whilst there will always be exceptions, specialist or very accommodating school (or homeschooling) is a relatively stabdard path. . The need to build experience, competitions, etc is very time consuming and needs careful mgt and reall knowledge as well as support to ensure the child is healthy in all senses. Dd is adamant she can do all this and stay in her school but I already see the gap in practice from those in specialist schools etc. It’s hard isn’t it!

I'm with Folk - there are so many different paths that could lead to a music career, and even to becoming a soloist, I wouldn't discount some because of heresay.

I can think of 2 children of friends who are both in their early 20's and persuing already successful careers, one as a cello soloist and the other as a leader. The cellist went to state comp, wasn't in NCO/NYO/JD or even the county orchestras. Instead, his parents found a good teacher and put all their efforts into his cello lessons. He then went to the Menuhin school for 6th form, before going to the Guildhall and getting a first in BA in performance.
The violinist went to JD at 12, and then Purcell School for 6th form. She went into the back of the second violins in NYO at 15 and worked her way up to leader, before going to Guildhall as an undergraduate. She's still there but working in West End shows, extra work etc.

I think 8 is still quite young to predict what might happen in the future. Some children peak early, others take longer to develop, and music isn't a race.

Your daughter is doing really well. There are plenty of fantastic teachers who will nurture her, without the need to go to JD or specialist school at this point.

Lots of different ways is my mantra Zac . I have to regularly remind ds of this when he’s been away and comes back telling me everyone has this or is doing x, y and z - it’s also not always completely true either !!
Also paths might change as they get older , want different things . Nothing is ever set in stone - which I’m currently finding quite exhausting ( but it’s exciting too !!) I think it’s just about making sure that they are enjoying their music making when they are young . If they have the right teacher and attitude and are enjoying it I think if it’s meant to be the rest will come
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If it helps, one of the specialist music schools has 34 juniors 8-11year olds. Some would say specialist training for string players is needed as young as possible- I’m not entirely sure- I’m sure there are lots of different ways.

Just to concur with brass...

green: DD here did not have aspirations to study music at HE at 10 years old (she has chosen it for GCSE but it wasn't forced on her), but enjoys the ensembles/orchestral part of school life; always has done.

If every music scholar had ambitions to become the next world class soloist and all their music hours were outside, there would be no one to contribute to the every day music making at schools. Quite often, some of these virtuoso DC come with diva like attitudes and therefore some schools do need to question what they need/why/who to offer to etc to build their pipeline throughout the 5/7 years of award. Some are getting this wrong right now, and realising that having a high flyer doesn't necessarily come with adding value for them other than showcasing at music scholar type concerts...

Hi Brass, a few thoughts from someone with a young string player!!

Firstly, 8 is still very young to be heading to specialist school IMO - obviously each child is different but I think from a social perspective, most of the children are older going in (Y7 seems to be popular, but lots don't go until GCSE or Sixth form even). My daughter's previous teacher went to Purcell, and was adamant that if she is going to go, it's not until 13-14. There is an amazing little 10yr old at our JD that only lasted a term at YMS when she went in at 8. I don't think it's ever too late, it's about what's right for your DD. Although others on here are probably better placed to advise on that.

Secondly, a number of people have said she should go to RCM or RAM if she's going to go to any. I'd take this with a pinch of salt. The JD's are all very different but all have something wonderful to offer. They also all have their true prodigies. My daughter's JD has a renowned string department and it's quite common for students at RCM / RAM to move there. What's most important is finding the right fit for the child and family, and a stellar teacher. You can be at the most prestigious college in the world with the best teacher, but if that fit isn't right, DD won't get the most out of it.

Pro Corda is simply the most wonderful musical experience my DD has had so far - do look into it!! Definitely a game changer for us, and opened the door to JD.

There is a fabulous podcast on Podbean and other podcast apps called 'Beyond the Triangle'. It's all about raising young artists. I think you will find it helpful (I certainly do!).

Your DD is doing incredibly well - and her teacher must be good to get her to that point so young. Talk to them, trust their judgement. Look around the 'doable' JD's and regional CAT's (there are a few). Most of all, enjoy. 😍

String I stand corrected
I know ds might consider it for next year , he’s already doing something else that week this year !! He diary gets booked up quickly in this house !!

Brass - dd did young Nsso at 8yo and it was fantastic; it is a wide age range but the three Orchestras and the dorm system mean it works fine. I know quite a few who prefer it to NCO (dd likes the NCO age banding) Would def do it again if we had time.

Posted too soon
Brasstacks I’m sure your daughter would cope with nsso but most of them are teenagers so socially it could be difficult . What ds has enjoyed most about NCO is that he’s got to hang out with loads of musically minded people his age .

Pro corda is fab from what I’ve heard and although the ages are mixed up a bit there would be lots of others her age ( ish) who are good players

Stanilin

Hi! I just wanted to add my 2 cents to the question about conservatoires in Germany. My husband is British and studied in Germany. He had to pass a language test before being admitted, which wasn't too horrid (he had been living in Germany for a few years at that point though). I studied at a music conservatoire and there were lots of overseas students, some with very little German. I remember observing a flute lesson in Chinese once... So I'd say it's totally possible to study there with a language course or two! (And yeah, no fees!!) :)

It does look good, though I saw elsewhere on this thread a recommendation for YNSSO, which would be more local for us. I guess that's not chamber music, though? Though by next summer she will be well into grade 6-7 level, as she is playing grade 6 pieces very well now, so perhaps NSSO Sinfonia as it looks like that does have chamber music? If they're all older than her there, though, she may prefer Pro Corda with children more her own age?

I suppose it is good that there is so much on offer, but it's a somewhat bewildering array of options!

There are a few pro Corda experts around - my kids aren't at that stage yet at all but I adore chamber music so I would!

Thanks catkind. She did her first NCO audition recently but she did a residential camp last summer, at barely 7, and loved it. She was supposed to do one this summer but they changed it to non-residential quite last minute. She is certainly tough enough, not that anyone would guess until they got to know her!

Do you think it is worth applying for pro corda as well?

Hi brasstacks, your DD sounds super keen and very musical! Being that good at just turned 8, time really is on your side here. In a way being so young makes it easier to combine lots of practice with normal school as she won't (hopefully!) be bogged down with homework yet.

Has she tried auditioning for things like NCO or procorda? Would be a taste of boarding life for her and from what people here report really high level music making.

Hi Green, 15-20 minutes on a direct train would be amazing! We are trying to persuade DD's school to let her join in with the senior school music fairly soon, as the senior school music is pretty good but there isn't anybody else at her level in the junior school, to the best of my knowledge.

Fwiw, I don't think a lack of desire to pursue music professionally should put your DD off applying for a scholarship.

Thanks hertsandessex, that's very useful advice. I only mean too late because she is determined to be a soloist and I don't see us being able to fit in 3+ hours practice in a day any time soon! She does work hard, though, and will make progress rapidly regardless, just would probably progress faster still and with a more comprehensive musical education in a specialist environment.

We find it very hard to give her time to compose and so on and I recall one of the best things about boarding is not having to travel and everything being in one place. I suspect you are right, though, and that it is not necessary as yet. A convenient JD would certainly be much more sensible from our perspective.

Interesting about the different boarding experience. In some ways, it may well suit her better than the usual arrangement but I expect it is quite idiosyncratic depending on what the children are like at any given time, so difficult to know until you're there?

Well come Brass!

We failed to get a place in a couple of JD this March, the competition is so fierce(piano as a first instrument, violin second). I was hoping to have everything in 1 place including Orchestra etc. The journey is only 15-20 mins on a direct train, short walk from home and short walk to the school from and to the station. We met someone who drove from Bruges. Now my hope is on secondary school next year, hopefully music will be better than our current state primary and we could have everything in 1 place. We are filling the form and so tempting with music scholar but feel like cheating because she doesnt want to pursue music seriously(Eg. doing gcse etc). She loves to perform, to listen, to play in an orchestra but doesnt want to follow it seriously.