4 yr old desperate to play violin can't start till next year - any ideas

When I did suzuki we started practicing violin hold with a cereal box covered in wallpaper, with a ruler stuck in the end. We used to have a weird foot position with one foot sticking out sideways too, apparently it's bad for you and they don't do it any more. I still stand like that as an adult!

We have had a very successful Suzuki experience, so I definitely recommend looking in to that, if you're willing to sign your life away commit 😉. My dcs started at 3.5 and 4 and it has been really brilliant with so many surprises and opportunities.

I recommend starting your ds with a good bow hold, which will make things much easier when he does start. You could also establish a good playing position with feet position before he has a violin that is the right size...

Thank you cat, I think your dd just has a right speed. She is already quite advanced and I agreed that it is better to have good foundation rather than to be too far too young. Good luck with her violin!

Look on the Suzuki website for your nearest teacher/they will take from 3 and will probably have loan violins in stock.

Suzuki is learning by ear though and is very parent intensive (DD is now 12 & still on the Suzuki track-prob around grade 6 but they don't do gradings) so if you don't have the time to spare to sit taking notes through lessons and then completing practice with your notes then Suzuki won't be for you.

Whilst it does get easier-DD does a bit of practice on her own I still have to take notes in lessons and then she polishes with me.

She has learnt to note read as she plays a second instrument by learning the traditional way and is also in several orchestras and ensembles.

The recorder is good preparation for the violin

Progressive Recorder Method For Young Beginners: Book 1

She'll be 5 in a couple of months, started at 3.5ish.

Oh she's not specially advanced or anything, nowhere near grades. Her teacher jumps around to different books so it's hard to say but maybe around the end of Starters for level? Simple crotchet-quaver-minim rhythms, fingers in first position, that sort of thing. As I say, emphasis on having fun not on progress.

Looking at my previous posts again, I may have come across more negative than I meant to about suzuki - it did great for me and is very much "proper lessons", just a different way to go about them. Just I fancied trying something else for DD and got lucky with a lovely teacher, and wanted to put a word in for other approaches being possible at that age. Suzuki would be a great place to start if there is a group near OP.

How interesting cat, your dd is certainly not the usual case. And she is 4.5ish now? Where she is in terms of her books/exams at this stage?

DD was a confident reader at 3, so she's not entirely the usual case. Cello babies/Violin babies looks like another interesting alternative for young pre-readers that does include some introduction to music reading, if anyone has a group near them.

I don't disagree about them catching up if they start later - the question for me is do they have fun in the intervening two years. We do quite a few activities with DD, because she wants to and enjoys it, not because we think she'll be a better swimmer or ballerina or footballer because of starting at 4 rather than 6.

Might be worth you trying to find a Suzuki group, then let him start proper lessons when he's older. As a violin teacher, I wouldn't take pupils that young because they are rarely able to focus for a lesson, much less motivated enough to practice enough to make much progress. IME If you have 2 children the same age, one starts violin at 4, one at 6, assuming both equally able, by the age of 7 they'll be about the same standard. To read music, they need to be confident readers first.

Catkind, I was surprised too, besides we are not talking about a very able child here, just reasonably able... But here we go.... But I give up on music teachers, I came across so many of them in my life, I could do PhD on a subject, they just all have their ways and you have to find a perfect match to your child in accordance with your expectations.... It seems to work at the moment but can change later of course

Keep going with the dancing as well. My DS is 7 and goes to a dance class. He went to his first class, enjoyed it and a friend from school dashed over to see him at his 2nd class "as boys don't come back for a 2nd session!" .

If your DS wants to dance, keep looking. A new dance school has opened near us since the one we signed DS up to and places to become available. Dance shops have been really positive about DS dancing - a boy has a greater chance of doing something with dance because there are far fewer of them per role than girls.

And can't he go to the same dance classes as the girls?

Can't your older one teach him the basics?

only, DD started with a bit of Fiddle Time Starters but has used a couple of other books too. We're just going gently and doing lots of fun games as well as pieces. I learned with suzuki and preferred not to do that with DD as I felt I was always slightly on the back foot with sight reading as a child.

I'm really surprised they'd skip Starters with even a very able child that age - even if they go through it quickly, it gives them lots of practice of the basics and boosts confidence.

NeverEverAnythingEver

You can't fob off a budding violinist with a ukulele!

Confession: I am not keen on the ukulele. The violin, on the other hand, is a noble instrument...

Confession #2: I don't play the violin, but DS2 does, and it's lovely (even when he was just starting).

catkind, thank you for writing about your experience-I am interested in collecting this sort of stories. Agreed about teacher and though our teacher is good he admits he prefers older students. The other thing that may explain the difference in attitudes - did your dd started at classical or Suzuki method? Ds started with Fiddle Time Joggers (teacher considered he can skip Starters) and though I can see he copes ok, but this is my view, child may feel differently and ds probably thinks it is difficult (even though he manages to play and sight read ok). I can see he puts effort into it but he copes - this is what I mean

Would second the suggestion of a ukulele - they're pretty cheap and much easier than a violin to start to get a tune on. Plus the way you get used to making the notes by pressing down on strings is really useful for moving on to any other stringed instrument.

Only, DD started at 3 and is still going with enthusiasm a year and a half on. (I started at 3 and am still going with enthusiasm only too many years on!) I think it really depends on having a good teacher - and at that age probably parents who will support practice and make sure that's fun too.

What about ukulele?

It takes a while to get a decent sound out of a violin but even I can get a tune out of DSs ukulele. it would be very a shame if he tried to play the violin but was disheartened but to be able to play a tune quickly (I was very bored with ballet at that age as we never seemed to dance, just point toes, so I refused to go back). DS plays violin but wanted a ukulele for fun.

Didiplanthis I like Waffle's advice, this is exactly what I would do in your situation. However, may I ask you please? If you manage to find a teacher, please let us know in a month or two how will it go? My dd1 plays violin and her brother asked to play it since he was 2. He started at 5 and few lessons in - he had enough. Of course I didn't let him stop and he plays for almost an year now but he recently said to me - you know mummy, I thought playing violin was very easy (oh yes! you have this impression looking at his older sister ), but it is actually very difficult and I don't want lessons anymore.
Surprise, surprise :)

Is there a Suzuki Group near you? Suzuki teachers regularly take children from the age of 3. It's a big commitment, but my 4 children all enjoyed it hugely and are all still playing their violins now (teenagers).

YY have a chat to your DD's teacher, you never know.

But if that's really a no, DD started with a book called Fiddle Time Starters, did your DD use that? It goes nice and slowly and would be quite easy to follow as a parent, particularly with the older one on hand for advice.

If affording lessons is a possibility, a second hand instrument would cost less than a term of lessons. Is it a lot too big though? My 4 yr old has an 1/8 and it's looking rather small on her, albeit she is tall for 4. If he starts off doing just open strings, he could hold the shoulder of the violin with his left hand instead of having it in fingering position (DD's teacher had her do this anyway), which would make size less critical.