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Does anyone's musical dc not do exams?

32 replies

Dancergirl · 10/03/2016 16:00

Interested in opinions. Oldest dd, now 14, plays the flute and piano. Flute is her main instrument and she took up a bit of piano to help with GCSE Music. With her flute she had a bit of a slow start due to repeated change of teacher at school, but I then found a fantastic private teacher and she progressed rapidly doing Grades 1 and 2 within a year both with Merit.

She then had a gap and did Grade 3 a year or so later. Even though she was well prepared it went a big wrong on the day and she scraped a pass. Bit disappointing but I told her a pass is a pass and to move on and enjoy her playing. She has now decided she doesn't want to do any more grades for a while and I am fine with that, she is old enough to make sensible choices. She is very much enjoying playing both instruments without the stress of doing exams.

Youngest dd started piano last summer and made very fast progress and is really enjoying it. She is due to take Grade 1 in a couple of weeks and her teacher says she should do very well. But I can't help feeling that a bit of the joy has been taking out of playing, focussing on playing the exam pieces well plus scales, aural etc. Dd is keen to take the exam but is also a bit worried about it. I'm worried it will put her off something she was really enjoying.

I play the piano myself and worked up through the grades as a child. I didn't really give it much thought but I quite liked the challenge of exams.

So my questions are - what are the benefits of doing exams, and can you become a competent musician without doing them?

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teacherwith2kids · 12/05/2016 19:26

DS only does the exams he needs as 'entry tickets' to ensembles - so he and his teacher worked out a schedule for up to the end of Y13 (when he was about in Y8!)

The 'second tier' jazz ensemble wanted Grade 4 - he was already above that, so he did grade 5 clarinet as his first music exam.

He then wanted to swap to playing the saxophone in that band and in a county music centre for which senior band needed Grade 4+ - having taken up the sax after passing his grade 5 clarinet, he then took grade 4 saxophone and passed it.

For the senior county jazz orchestra he needs Grade 6, so he's just taken that on clarinet and is auditioning on clarinet. If he doesn't get in he'll do grade 6 saxophone ASAP to be able to audition on that instead.

Then I think there's a gap of a couple of years, They have a plan for him to take both grade 8s before he leaves school, so that he has a record of his 'final standard;' should he want to play in jazz groups at university or beyond.

Of course, you could argue that none of these are necessary, and an audition + recommendation from his teacher would be equally good 'entry tickets'. However, having the pieces of paper has proved a very useful 'shorthand' method of proving level.

MiddleAgeMiddleEngland · 09/05/2016 21:17

No grades are essential. Not even to get a place at Music College. Many students at the conservatoires are from overseas and have never been through the exam mill.

A good teacher will include theory, history, pieces in a variety of styles, technical work including a far more interesting range of scale-type work than the set ones for exams and many other things during lessons. Working towards an exam is ok, but can take up a lot of time when there's so much other rewarding stuff to do.

I've even heard of pupils who are only playing three pieces at a particular time because they are "exam pieces" and only playing scales on the list for the grade they are working on. Stultifying.

As for parents who want their children to take exams so they can brag that Fred is Grade 6 at age 11 or whatever ... don't even get me started on that. As I have patiently explained to parents many times, music was around far longer than ABRSM. Did Bach or Beethoven's mum brag about their son's grades?

conkerpods · 07/05/2016 23:44

Hi,professional musician here. I did all the grades (violin and piano) but it is not essential IMO. Grade 5 and 8 are but you don't need to do all the ones in between.

OldBeanbagz · 03/05/2016 16:03

DD plays piano & guitar, has just started theory & singing and will be doing GCSE music from Sept. Of these she's only currently doing grades on piano. She did take grade 4 classical guitar but shortly after switched to acoustic guitar and a new teacher. I'm happy for her just to enjoy music rather than taking exams and she currently plays in bands both at school and away from it.

DS will be taking Grade 2 piano next month but i don't know if he'll continue with them. He's very shy so not great at the aural though he has found the confidence to play at a school show.

I'll just follow their lead with regard to exams. I'd rather they practice the pieces they like to play than nag them into playing grade pieces.

BackforGood · 23/04/2016 16:10

My dd1. funnily enough, also plays both the flute and the piano.
Refused to take any exams after Grade 3.
Used to rarely practice and was progressing pretty slowly anyway.
After giving up exams she really blossomed and started to enjoy both instruments MUCH more. She now helps out a Yr7 musical group at school, plays in lots of concerts, has become the 'guest flutist' for the choir I'm in, and plays piano two or three times a day, sometimes for 1/2 hour or more.

She did take GCSE in music, but has steadfastly refused to consider taking anymore instrumental exams even though both teacher say she could easily do Grade 6 or more.

RapidlyOscillating · 23/04/2016 15:56

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Statelychangers · 23/04/2016 15:52

My dcs had music lessons at school - I insisted on no exams, music teacher was flexible covered music dcs were interested in, dcs practiced without being asked, got excited about what they were playing it was really good. Moved to Secondary, school agreed reluctantly to drop the exams but insisted that they follow the exam syllabus - within 3 months both dcs didn't want to practice anymore, music had become a real drag and I cancelled the lessons.
It took 6 months for them to come around and beg me for more lessons - I found a great vocal coach quite by accident who is very open minded about music and they really love their lessons. I've just found a piano teacher and I have told her that the dcs need to agree to the content (within reason) of the lessons and the type of music they play. I will gauge the success of the lessons on how much the dcs wish to practice without being prompted.
I have chosen this route because I believe that music is something they should hopefully get a lot of joy from as Maryz said a release from other pressures in life and if they want to do grades then they can chose to do them later on - actually if they wanted to do grades now that wouldn't be a problem.

TheDogsCat · 20/04/2016 00:25

I skipped a lot of grades playing woodwind. Jumped straight from G3 to G5 to G6. id suggest taking the grade6-8 exams. They're the ones most likely to lead to scholarships and are recognised by UCAS. Applying for a science degree the uni I went to didn't care about UCAS. Points, but apparently my grade 8 piano certificate was of some interest. No use whatsoever to my degree, beyond that someone playing to that level is probably capable of hard work and independent learning. Plus with ABRSM, grade 6+ means a music theory grade 5 pass, and I'm still using the knowledge I learnt for that a decade on. Except alto and tenor clef reading. I've never needed to read those outside an exam room, and don't expect to ever use the skills again.

sunnydayinmay · 14/03/2016 13:20

Well, DS has piano grade 3 in an hours time and is very clear that he is not taking another exam until grade 8!

Supposedtobeworking1 · 14/03/2016 12:13

My DS is 8 and plays cello, piano and sings. He has lessons in all three but has not taken any exams. This is an active decision on our part as my DS lives for his music but would find the structure of exam prep boring. He is currently grade 4ish level on both instruments and would easily pass grade 3 singing if he wanted to but he doesn't. He takes part in music festivals and regularly wins classes, often at distinction level, at the relevant grade levels and has wonderful teachers who still work through all the relevant technique with him even though he doesn't take the exams. He was recently awarded a music scholarship to a local independent school but for various reasons he won't be taking it up but again, his lack of exams had no impact on this. My son loves music and I want him to always view it as something to enjoy and get satisfaction and mental benefits out of not something that is structured by the pressure of exams. He is in two orchestras, so does do more structured practice, particularly coming up to concerts but one orchestra plays a very modern repertoire and the other more classical so he plays a very broad spectrum of pieces. He rehearses with friends and it's very much a social gathering opportunity for him. His ambition in life is to be a rock cellist and given his very extrovert personality I suspect that would suit him down to the ground!
My brother is a Guildhall trained guitarist and now a music lecturer at a very well respected University. He's never taken a formal music exam (other than the standard music A-level) in his life and it didn't cause him any problems.

ReallyTired · 10/03/2016 21:59

Dd is doing Suzuki violin and her teacher doesn't do exams before grade 5. Dd's guitar teacher only does odd number grades.

Wafflenose · 10/03/2016 21:54

Plenty of my pupils don't do them, or just the occasional grade. Sometimes taking the exam can actually slow them down and stop them progressing, but I suppose one of the advantages of taking them is that they help to focus all round practice, e.g. things like scales and sight reading, as well as polishing the pieces to a good standard.

My DDs have both done several, but I am now the one wanting to get off this ride... older DD did one yesterday, and her very enthusiastic teacher is already talking about the next one! I suppose they need to thrash it out between them, but I'd prefer it if she had a year off!

BennyTheBall · 10/03/2016 21:41

My ds (13) has done guitar grade 3 but has recently decided to stop doing grades (he finds the pieces very boring) and continue with his lessons.

It has transformed him! He loathed practise and had to be nagged to do it, but now, I hear him strumming along -voluntarily- every evening.

He is playing modern stuff like Hozier and Coldplay, plus some real old school Led Zep and Beatles.

I wish I had done the same - I can remember now how much I hated the exams.

nonicknameseemsavailable · 10/03/2016 21:31

I hated piano exams but my teacher insisted I did them even when my parents told her they were happy for me to just play/have lesson for enjoyment so I stopped playing completely, that was 26 years ago and I haven't played since.

I wish I had kept going just not doing exams as it did spoil it for me.

I think everyone is different, some children will like the challenge and the sense of achievement, for others it spoils the enjoyment.

CrotchetQuaverMinim · 10/03/2016 20:40

Other benefits are -

-getting used to playing/performing in front of someone. Depending on the instrument/situation, some children may not have the chance to do this in other ways. I avoided almost all possible situations where I had to, including all but a few exams. Then when the time came when I did want to (e.g., audition for ensemble) much later in life, I find that I am terrified and shaky and it all goes wrong. Exams are a gradual introduction to learning to play under pressure. While I still wouldn't have liked it as a child, I can see now that it would have been good for me.

-learning pieces to performance standard. When I wasn't doing exams, I would work at pieces and get them quite good, enough that my teacher would leave them and go on to new ones. But they were never really, really polished, the way you get them after loads of practice for a performance situation. I agree that practising the same pieces - and only those pieces - for months on end is awful and not the way to learn music, but at the same time, there is something that you get from going from 95% ready to 100% ready that you might otherwise miss, bits of extra polish/interpretation

-exposure to music you might not otherwise want to do. I loved Baroque music as a child. It was the only section I really liked out of the exam lists, and I'd have chosen to spend all my time on that. But by working through exam curricula (even without doing the exams), I had to learn pieces from other eras, other genres etc, and it was both good for my musical development (even when I still didn't like it much), and also helped me to learn and enjoy things that I really didn't think I would. I wouldn't ever have done it by choice, but when it's part of the exam, I just did.

-learning technique that can be very valuable for later playing. I didn't do exam work on one of my instruments, and I missed out on some very useful technique, and wish now that I had had to do it. I spent more time on other areas that I enjoyed more. Now that I try to play in ensembles, I can see where having spend a lot more time on arpeggios would have been extremely helpful. But by not doing exams, I could avoid doing as much of it as I should, and in all the combinations and permutations required of the exams, and to exam standard. I did some of it, but without that purpose, not really enough.

-motivation to keep going even through the hard bits. All the things I mentioned are absolutely possible to do without exams, but some children will find it harder to do e.g., all the technique without having a goal, even when they know they should. And it was the same for practising generally. Even though I enjoyed the instrument, enjoyed ensembles, there was still an element of not wanting to practice. So exams that have an immediate deadline, and a tangible sign of progress, and a purpose to work for, can be useful for some children.

I don't like the idea of just following the exam stuff, only doing 3 pieces and nothing else, and exams can be dangerous when it encourages teachers/pupils/parents to do that to the exclusion of everything else. But it's quite possible to do a whole swathe of material at each level, and then later on choose the favourites to work up for an exam, all whilst continuing to try other music and styles. Technique can be taught in lots of ways, studies, exercises and so on, and only learned in the proper exam format closer to the time. You can skip years and exams, or do the work but never do the exam at all. They aren't needed. But there are some good things about them too. Even though I would have dreaded them as a child, and wouldn't have wanted to be forced to do them. But with gentle encouragement and explanation and understanding, I might have been persuaded.

elastamum · 10/03/2016 20:33

My DS has been playing guitar since he was 4. Now at 17 he is really good and plays for pleasure nearly every day. He also plays with his friends in bands. He didn't want to do exams and I felt that was fair enough as it would have sucked all the pleasure out of his music and just made it another chore.

Liara · 10/03/2016 20:33

Both my dc play a couple of instruments and don't do exams and won't be doing them.

Dh lived abroad as a child and did one instrument from very young. He never did an exam until he came to the UK and then only ever did grade 8 in his instrument, as that is what his school decided he should do. He never did any of the prior ones.

He hated doing the exam, and feels it was absolutely no reflection of his level at all, and that if he had done the whole thing like that (i.e. focussing on the exams) he probably would have abandoned playing it. He still plays his instrument quite well (not professional, just a hobby) 25 years on.

NewLife4Me · 10/03/2016 20:25

Another way grades can be useful is the UCAS points earned for exams of grade 5 and above.
There again I think only useful if going to music college.
i think they may be useful for my dd later on as her school will only really allow 2 A levels so the extra points may help her application. Long time away yet though, she's only 12.

howabout · 10/03/2016 19:08

Mine don't do grades in their main instruments. One has done grade 5 for her violin as I teach her and I wanted to give her a bit of confidence that someone other than her mother had judged her playing. They only did grade 5 piano as it gives a bit of structure and formality to the scales and theory. DD1 quite likes the exam carrot and stick so has gone on to do grade 6.

My violin teacher always said people were only really interested in judging by performance and that is true I think. However the bits of paper can be useful shorthand and door openers for gauging ability. Also mine are not doing music GCSE at school so are using abrsm exams to give a bit of formality.

Mistigri · 10/03/2016 18:46

My dd sounds very similar to maryz DS. Doubt her keenness would have survived formal exam preparation and she is adamant that she doesn't want to pursue a career in music for the same reason.

She's done guitar for three years now, group classes with pro jazz musicians that focus on repertoire and group playing. She has had 2 years of piano lessons, these are a bit more formal in the sense that she's learning repertoire, but there is no exam focus at all, the aim of her teacher is simply to get her to a standard where she is a reasonably autonomous pianist before she leaves school.

Maryz · 10/03/2016 18:21

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Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Mistigri · 10/03/2016 18:15

Mine has never done a formal exam UK style and probably never will.

She is 14, and plays several instruments, writes music, records and plays live semi-regularly. Main instruments are guitar (couldn't give a grade but she can play anything she wants to) and piano (plays grade 7 pieces without too much trouble).

Fleurdelise · 10/03/2016 17:38

I think exams initially are a way for the parents (and children) to measure their progress and they shouldn't be used the other way around, so an exam should be taken when the child is at that level rather than working towards an exam.

I don't think exams add any value to their playing and if a DC is happier without taking any and the parent is happy with the teacher there is no need to do exams.

DD plays piano and her teacher put her into grade 1 exam last year with the understanding that if she hates it there will be no more exams after that. She came out of the exam happy and asking when can she do the next one. Grin She is now a bit "certificate" obsessed in all her activities and wants to do exams but nevertheless her piano teacher is teaching her for her musical achievements which are followed by exam certificates. She never works towards an exam but her teacher understands that once a year she'd like to take one and enters her for whatever grade she thinks she's ready for. She therefore skipped grade 2 and doing grade 3 now with the plan of seeing what level she might be next December to enter her for the respective grade. It could be 4 or 5 but no exam preparation will be mentioned until that moment.

MyLifeisaboxofwormgears · 10/03/2016 16:28

DD is on grade 6 on her first instrument - she doesn't do exams, her teacher knows I don't have a great desire for DD to do exams, just enjoy playing.
She follows the exam curriculum and plays the syllabus pieces but also does other pieces that she likes.
Teacher enters plenty of pupils for exams, he has suggested DD does do the grade 6 exam as an academic exercise although she hasn't done any other exams so far.

On her other instrument DD is self taught, so no exams.
Music theory - teacher has suggested an exam would be good.
Other instrument - she is grade 4 and may take grade 5 exam.

She performs a lot - and she enjoys that so I am not fussed over exams at all.

CharleyDavidson · 10/03/2016 16:27

I learnt to play the piano with a teacher who didn't put you through for grades. I now play as part of my job as a teacher, in church and in assemblies/concerts, so would say that I'm competent.

The only thing I don't have is a) as much musical theory knowledge as I'd have needed to learn if I was doing my grades - although a teacher could still cover that with your DC if they were interested.... and b) a way of saying exactly how proficient a player I am.

I actually only had a couple of years of lessons, up to age 11, then we moved. I taught myself to play more and improve my standard by purely practising. When I qualified as a teacher, I bought the common assembly hymn books and just slogged through them. :)

I'm glad I didn't have to concentrate on only a small number of grade pieces and play them to death before an exam.